Because this is the post that never ends it goes on and on my friend....
Fram Endurance Flashlight Test in canister
- Thread starter Glenda W.
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Amen.
Only locked when devolves into name calling
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Yep. If we beleive the PH is a leaker; then no wonder it's much worse than the apparently non-leaking higher efficiency filters!
It's more likely to be a leaker to have that much worse efficiency as was demonstrated. Math is math.
And, if we reason that the media itself couldn't be that worse and there is a flaw in it's manufacturing rather than design; it's no stretch to "also" consider how a leaking "high efficiency" filter would also "likely" have worse numbers than shown in the testing. This is basic common sense. Does it "help" that a leaking filter with better media is in place? Sure. Why are we planning on the filters being manufactured poorly? We have no concrete data on just how much worse it performs! Why "plan" to run a filter that is passing unfiltered oil? Why plan on it being failed? Great belly rub if; after the fact, you realize you had a leaker. It still performs worse than a non-leaker.
So, just use a different filter. Easy. Now, you are likely more efficient than ANY leaking full flow oil filter. Simple. Why prop up and justify the use of a clear unfiltered oil flow path that is most likely a defect of some kind? Jumping to conclussions and saying "nothing to see here" is wild to me. It's a risk. Caring for our cars should be aversion to risk. Isn't that the point of not blindly extending OCIs or even trusting short intervals alone help with some of the TGDI? Might still need to step up a grade even in shorter OCIs for some!
Side Note: It's beginning to look a lot like the Premium Guard Extended Life filters offer the most reliable construction as of this post; if a particular higher efficiency model line has manufacturing defect. We can't confirm all Amsoil/RP/FE filters have this leaking bypass.
I'm glad I was able to snag some OG Titaniums at @Glenda W. 's recommendation. They do still exist for now! So, I'm good for a couple years while running extended OCIs on Amsoil SS. I have peace of mind rather than blindly trusting my particular model; FE7317 or the Amsoil equivalanet Ea15k13 (which is at the moment the center of the data points on consistent leaker), is "maybe" not a leaker this time...and suffer worse results while extending the interval. How much worse is unknown. WHY would I opt for being a guinea pig here? My vehicle has over 330k miles. I'm not going to extend the interval now with questionable; at best, oil filtration.
It's more likely to be a leaker to have that much worse efficiency as was demonstrated. Math is math.
And, if we reason that the media itself couldn't be that worse and there is a flaw in it's manufacturing rather than design; it's no stretch to "also" consider how a leaking "high efficiency" filter would also "likely" have worse numbers than shown in the testing. This is basic common sense. Does it "help" that a leaking filter with better media is in place? Sure. Why are we planning on the filters being manufactured poorly? We have no concrete data on just how much worse it performs! Why "plan" to run a filter that is passing unfiltered oil? Why plan on it being failed? Great belly rub if; after the fact, you realize you had a leaker. It still performs worse than a non-leaker.
So, just use a different filter. Easy. Now, you are likely more efficient than ANY leaking full flow oil filter. Simple. Why prop up and justify the use of a clear unfiltered oil flow path that is most likely a defect of some kind? Jumping to conclussions and saying "nothing to see here" is wild to me. It's a risk. Caring for our cars should be aversion to risk. Isn't that the point of not blindly extending OCIs or even trusting short intervals alone help with some of the TGDI? Might still need to step up a grade even in shorter OCIs for some!
Side Note: It's beginning to look a lot like the Premium Guard Extended Life filters offer the most reliable construction as of this post; if a particular higher efficiency model line has manufacturing defect. We can't confirm all Amsoil/RP/FE filters have this leaking bypass.
I'm glad I was able to snag some OG Titaniums at @Glenda W. 's recommendation. They do still exist for now! So, I'm good for a couple years while running extended OCIs on Amsoil SS. I have peace of mind rather than blindly trusting my particular model; FE7317 or the Amsoil equivalanet Ea15k13 (which is at the moment the center of the data points on consistent leaker), is "maybe" not a leaker this time...and suffer worse results while extending the interval. How much worse is unknown. WHY would I opt for being a guinea pig here? My vehicle has over 330k miles. I'm not going to extend the interval now with questionable; at best, oil filtration.
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Main takeaway ... if you like leaky filters then use a high efficiency leaky filter.
Can't avoid them! Just get the best version of them! Best CoA for sure!
Main takeaway ... if you like leaky filters then use a high efficiency leaky filter.
Do we know or think that the Amsoil EA15K13 (same applications) are affected by this possibly leaking bypass?
They are e-core design (wire reinforced media, black plastic internal support and 13 inlet holes).
I'm literally invested in this answer as I have five of them manufactured May this year for my Frontier.
Thank you!
They are e-core design (wire reinforced media, black plastic internal support and 13 inlet holes).
I'm literally invested in this answer as I have five of them manufactured May this year for my Frontier.
Thank you!
Yes. Whip City Wrencher found a leaking Amsoil. All we know 100% is at least some champ labs made (Amsoil, RP, Endurance) 7317’s and equivalents are showing this defect. We need more c&p’s of other applications to see how widespread this is.
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Nobody else has asked, so I will.
Will these filter leaks be any worse with a thin oil, than with a thick oil?
Will these filter leaks be any worse with a thin oil, than with a thick oil?
The oil cleanliness and the oil viscosity are in two different worlds. One doesn't effect the other, but both can have an effect on wear given the right situations.Nobody else has asked, so I will.
Will these filter leaks be any worse with a thin oil, than with a thick oil?
Now I'm a bit more confused. I found the Whip City Wrencher video from 10months ago on U tube on the EA15K13 flashlight test.
His was manufactured Aug 2022 and has a steel core and 10 inlet holes like the pics of other filters on here.
The EA15K13s I have are from May this year and are plastic ecore design with 13 inlet holes.
They must have changed in the last couple of years.
Have we seen any plastic e-core EA15k13s with this problem?
The box and sticker looks the same as the one in the video with the same 99% at 20 microns claim...
His was manufactured Aug 2022 and has a steel core and 10 inlet holes like the pics of other filters on here.
The EA15K13s I have are from May this year and are plastic ecore design with 13 inlet holes.
They must have changed in the last couple of years.
Have we seen any plastic e-core EA15k13s with this problem?
The box and sticker looks the same as the one in the video with the same 99% at 20 microns claim...
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I was wondering - along Ronn's logic - if a thick oil will circulate 4 times a minute, a thin oil may circulate 5 times a minute,
So would a thin oil stay cleaner?
Or - would the same particle do 20% more wear damage because it circulated one additional time?
Nonsense either way.
4WD
$50 site donor 2025
How does a thin oil circulate more ?
Im sorry. I totally missed that you mentioned ecore. I don’t know of any tests done on the ecore version. Not sure who even manufacturers those.
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The difference in viscosity when at operating temperature isn't enough to cause any real flow difference. When the oil is really cold and thick, where the PD oil pump could hit pressure relief with pretty low RPM, then there could be a flow difference. The only way the oil stays cleaner is to go through a more efficient filter that doesn't have tears or other leak paths around the media going on.
I am currently running an FE7317 on my Accord. Filter has an early 2023 build date. Planning on a UOA in about a month.
Would a UOA with particle count be of any benefit to see how this filter performs?
Would a UOA with particle count be of any benefit to see how this filter performs?
Couldn’t “hurt” and would be another “data point.”
Would you be willing to cut it open and perform a “flashlight” test on it?
Another member has done a particle count test while the filter is still on, which makes more sense if you're running a 25000 mile filter and intend to run it a long time.
But when the filter is end of life, you can just cut it open and check with a flashlight.
Without another PC to compare it to from the same car with the same OCI under the same use conditions, one PC doesn't tell you much. If it came back relatively high particle counts per mL, it might indicate a leakage. Do you have any other PCs with other filters used on that car around the same OCI to compare to?
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