Ford guys - ball joint info needed please

[Jimmy9190]

My girlfriend's mother has a 2001 Crown Vic with the 4.6 V8 in it, the car has about 100K on it now I guess. She just bought 2 new tires for it this week. She said the tire guy told her her car "will need ball joints soon" and wrote that on her sales receipt/work order.

I know the way to check ball joints is jack up the front end and check for up and down play and movement in the wheel/tire. I know I can also look for excess play and movement in the ball joint with a pry bar, and see any obvious torn boots and other physical damage. She said there are no unusual noises or squeaking from the front end and no play or slop in the steering, but a 77 year old woman may not know what is normal and abnormal steering noise or condition, either.

We are headed to her house tomorrow for my gf to visit with her mom and so I can take a look at the car. Is there anything Ford and/or Crown Vic specific I should check for in particular? From looking online, it looks like the lowers are pressed in, the uppers are bolted in. Most of the threads I found online seem to indicate it's not very hard to replace all 4 ball joints.

I appreciate the help here. I know very little about Fords and even less about Crown Vics.

Thanks.

 

[Panzerman]

I am not a Ford man, but we do have Ford company trucks and I have noticed everytime we take the Trucks into the garage they say they need new ball joints. Our company doesnt fix the truck until it actually breaks or becomes a unsafe(noticably) issue. So far we havent had a ball joint fail, although they told me it was bad, 30,000 miles ago. I seem to think they become loose quick and stay that way. If it bothers you, I would change it. My company truck has a 159,000 miles on it, runs like a top and doesnt use a drop of oil between 4,000 mile changes. The 4.6 is a Great engine. Has never had the transmission fluid or any fluids, except rearend oil changed(rear axle bearing went out, so they serviced the rear end at 156,000 miles) or spark plugs. Runs like a new one, yet.

 

[JHZR2]

maybe the boots are looking bad or there is just a little play. Im doing the whole thing on my MB this weekend because of one torn boot that doesnt have THAT much play. Steering is tight overall though just a little funny at times. Wouldnt necessarily classify it as anything if just a grocery hauler...

 

[bdcardinal]

Idler arms are a common point of failure on the -02 panthers. The Caster and Camber eccentrics are mounted to the upper ball joint, so an alignment will be necessary after replacement. Generally Moog are the preferred replacement brand for chassis components or else Motorcraft.

 

[Jimmy9190]

Well turns out the tire guy was right. Steering on the car is sloppy. I put the front end up on jack stands, removed the front wheels and the rubber boots on all 4 ball joints have split open and rotted away. Same thing with the boots on both stabilizer bar links.

We brought the car here to our house and I'll get started on it tomorrow. My gf's mom doesn't drive very much and said she can do without the car for a few days, even a week. Neighbors in the retirement park where she lives can take her to church, grocery store, etc.

I will try to get the car fixed and get it back to her as soon as I can. The only oddball thing I can see from looking at it is I will need a ball joint press tool to press the old lower joints out and press the new lowers back in. I can rent the tool at Autozone. Other than that it doesn't look like too bad of a job. I thought it was a little different the way Ford used a pinch bolt to attach the upper studs to the steering knuckles. I have never seen that before.

Any pointers, tricks or things to look out for are very much appreciated.

 

[brianl703]

Might consider looking at the whole control arm instead of just the ball joint. It was only another $50 for the whole control arm vs. just the ball joint. Rockauto prices for Moog parts.

 

[OVERKILL]

As brian stated, get the control arms. Been there, done that with my Expie.

 

[Herz]

I used NAPA premium made by Spicer/Dana joints and end links on my focus, 20k on them so far, so good. They are cheaper than moog and are good quality. Should not be to bad of a job.

 

[4ever4d]

If you can find them get ball joints with zerk fittings so they can be lubed they will last much longer.Spray the bottom ball joints with PB Blaster it will be much easier to press them out.

 

[punisher]

Ditto on the whole lower control arm. Even with a balljoint press it is a wh***, and thats being nice. If you can take the whole arm off and use a propwer hydraulic press, life is much easier.

Lowers- remove the spindle completely from lower and upper joints and let it flop out of the way. I had to use an air hammer in addition to the press to knock mine out. If I had it to do over, I would throw another lower control arm on there.


Upper- Mark your two adjustment cams on the upper so they line up close upon reassembly. You have left and right upper joints, don't mix them up.

 

[CROWNVIC4LIFE]

The Crown Vic probably does not need a thing...I would take it to a honest mechanic and get a second opinion.

Generally you can not believe one word that comes out of any tire store...More so in Florida then any other place on earth...They generally tell you a lie as soon as they open their mouth.

That is just IMHO!

 

[eljefino]

^ If they were so dishonest their sales tactics were pretty low pressure.

When using one of those bolt-vise ball joint presses, I like to whack on the LCA with a 2 lb sledge when the going gets real tough. Sets up a vibration that busts rust loose. Then I find I can get another 1/2 turn on the bolt pretty easily. Repeat.

 

[Jimmy9190]

After reading up on the repairs online, I took the BITOG'ers advice and just ordered a new set of Dorman lower control arms from Rockauto, they were about $95.00 each.

Autozone sells the exact same part for $194.00, Advance has it for $188.00. Neither one would price match Rockauto, and the best discount code I could find for AAP was $50.00 off a $150.00 purchase, and even with doing two separate orders it still only dropped the price to $138.00 each. I ordered both LCA's in from Rockauto for $214.00 shipped, I hope to receive them by Wednesday or Thursday. This is my first purchase from Rockauto and I hope I don't have any trouble with it.

I could not find a good quality upper ball joint and sway bar end link on Rock Auto for a good price. They had some cheap $15.00 China-made parts and then they had Raybestos and Moog for in the neighborhood of $45.00 on up around $60.00 each. I ran down to Autozone and picked up Duralast upper ball joints and sway bar links, all 4 together cost $128.00 including tax. From what I have read online, TRW makes the Duralast brand of chassis parts. I put Duralast upper and TRW branded ball joints on my truck a year ago and have had no problems with them at all, so I believe these Duralast parts will do fine. Plus all 4 part boxes each say "Made in USA" right on the box. That's very important to me. An added bonus is I had a coupon good for an extra point on my AZ Rewards Card too, and the sales guy even let me keep the coupon too. It's only good until March 8th.

I found some excellent online tutorials on the upper ball joint and lower control arm/ball joint procedures on www.autoclinix.com. They have good detailed step by step instructions with great pictures.

Thanks for all the help on this. I do appreciate it.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: CROWNVIC4LIFE
The Crown Vic probably does not need a thing...I would take it to a honest mechanic and get a second opinion.

Generally you can not believe one word that comes out of any tire store...More so in Florida then any other place on earth...They generally tell you a lie as soon as they open their mouth.

That is just IMHO!


I agree on the second opinion. Just wondering how many miles on the CV? I have 195,000 miles on my Aerostar and the ball joints are still fine, NY Pothole City too. You can have a sloppy front end and the problem is something other than the ball joints, it could be a tie-rod for example. It might pay to have a local shop check it out. Ball joints can last a very long time even with spilt boots, especially if they have zerk fittings, and you can grease them. You are taking on a big project especially if is only a bad tie rod.

I had a tire shop tell me I need all kinds of front end work plenty of times and I knew darn well there was nothing wrong with it, then had it confirmed by a shop I trust. Just a suggestion that's all.

 

[bdcardinal]

I got all Moog ball joints, tie rods, pitman arm and idler arm from Amazon.com shipped for less than anyplace else including Rock Auto with discounts, or any jobbers that i use at work giving me stuff at their cost.

 

[mechtech2]

When you put the new ones in, put them in the freezer first! They will shrink slightly and go in a lot easier.
Also, heat the female part of the control arm first with a hand held propane torch [or whatever]. This will expand things and make assembly easier. Use a bit of lube/grease.

 

[Jimmy9190]

Thanks for the info. I did my own second opinion inspection yesterday at my gf's mother's house. There is no question the parts need to be replaced. I put the car up on jack stands and saw all the ripped and damaged boots on the ball joints and the sway bar end links.

We brought the car here to our house and in driving it there is a lot of play and slop in the steering. There is also a lot of grinding and groaning and clunk type noise associated with front end suspension problems from the front end, when making parking lot type maneuvers or going over speed breakers. The tie rods and idler arms all looked good.

I looked on Amazon, and did not find the parts the car needs. Maybe I didn't look in the right place on Amazon. I am not very familiar with their site.

From looking at it and reading online, it does not look to be too hard of a job. I did my own ball joints and stabilizer bar links without much trouble. My gf's mom lost her husband (my gf's dad) just last year, she is on a fixed income and does not have much money. My gf bought the parts for the car and I am doing the work to help her mother out, save her some money and get her car in good shape before she heads back home to Ohio for the summer. I will get the car aligned before I give it back to her too. Other than this problem, the car does run very well.

 

[The Critic]

How are Duralast ball joints holding up?

 

[TooManyWheels]

Originally Posted By: Jimmy9190
The tie rods and idler arms all looked good.



Did you compress them to make sure they had no play?