The Lubegard product improved shifting though.
Ford conventional GL4 75W-90
- Thread starter Drew99GT
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Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
The Lubegard product improved shifting though.
But it didn't because you encountered notchy resistance
after adding it during cold weather.
Don't bother with snake oils, instead use a high quality
straight gear oil.
The Lubegard product improved shifting though.
But it didn't because you encountered notchy resistance
after adding it during cold weather.
Don't bother with snake oils, instead use a high quality
straight gear oil.
MolaKule
Staff member
Originally Posted By: BBDartCA
75w90 and 50w trans fluids usually are very close in viscosity.
And even at even some lube OEMs, gl5 75w90 and 50w mt1 are the same lube but the latter has the EP add pack deleted. General statemement. Exceptions exist. Pleanty.
Getting back to the root of the OP's problem, which was his trans started having sticky shifts after a cold snap. I attribute this to the snake oil additive being used. Actually, appears to be a vegetable oil additive. Here is it's patent:
https://www.google.com/patents/US5282989...ved=0CBwQ6AEwAA
Patent ref from brochure: http://www.lubegard.com/pdfs/GEAR_PS.pdf
They are not using vegetable oils.
They are using "derivatives" of vegetable oils.
Vegetable oils contain both acids and alcohols. They separate out the two components and use the acids.
They react these acids with special alcohols to get a new synthesized lubricant called an ester. They call these esters, "Liquid Wax Esters" or LXE.
Quote:
gl5 75w90 and 50w mt1 are the same lube
Sorry, as I explained above, they are not.
The OP appears to have been using a high viscosity differential lube which is too thick for manual transmissions AND which did not have the necessary friction modification for manual transmissions.
Because the Lubegard "GEAR FLUID SUPPLEMENT" thinned out the differential fluid (it has the viscosity of ATF), it allowed slightly easier shifting.
BTW, the Lubegard "GEAR FLUID SUPPLEMENT" is for use in differentials, AND ONLY at a 10% dosage.
I think Drew was wise to go with the dedicated MTL.
75w90 and 50w trans fluids usually are very close in viscosity.
And even at even some lube OEMs, gl5 75w90 and 50w mt1 are the same lube but the latter has the EP add pack deleted. General statemement. Exceptions exist. Pleanty.
Getting back to the root of the OP's problem, which was his trans started having sticky shifts after a cold snap. I attribute this to the snake oil additive being used. Actually, appears to be a vegetable oil additive. Here is it's patent:
https://www.google.com/patents/US5282989...ved=0CBwQ6AEwAA
Patent ref from brochure: http://www.lubegard.com/pdfs/GEAR_PS.pdf
They are not using vegetable oils.
They are using "derivatives" of vegetable oils.
Vegetable oils contain both acids and alcohols. They separate out the two components and use the acids.
They react these acids with special alcohols to get a new synthesized lubricant called an ester. They call these esters, "Liquid Wax Esters" or LXE.
Quote:
gl5 75w90 and 50w mt1 are the same lube
Sorry, as I explained above, they are not.
The OP appears to have been using a high viscosity differential lube which is too thick for manual transmissions AND which did not have the necessary friction modification for manual transmissions.
Because the Lubegard "GEAR FLUID SUPPLEMENT" thinned out the differential fluid (it has the viscosity of ATF), it allowed slightly easier shifting.
BTW, the Lubegard "GEAR FLUID SUPPLEMENT" is for use in differentials, AND ONLY at a 10% dosage.
I think Drew was wise to go with the dedicated MTL.
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Stripping my comments out of context is not appreciated. Several lube OEMs have confirmed to me their MT1 50w synthetic trans fluids and 75w90 / 80w90 gl5 gear oils are the same lubes except for the level of EP package for bevel gear protection. This was a tertiary area of interest as part of the qualification and approval of their products to a specific (and demanding) product application (we had major issues with certain EP additives for unobvious and highly confidential reasons). This was not the case with all suppliers (mostly those wrestling with the maze of ZF nonsense). One of these supplier also told me (I had to keep the email after the factory tour to confirm it) that their 50 weight racing oil and 75w90 gl4 were the exact same products - this lube happens to be popular in this forum section.
Puzzled on the comment about 75w90 being too thick. 75w90 should be about the same as a MTL on a 50 weight SAE scale for engine oil. It's been a couple years since I looked into this, but I recall when we complied all the data of global 75w90 / 80w90 and 50 weight MT1 the hot and cold viscosities were all within, from a functional standpoint, the same basic range between lubes. Random sample of what's in front of me now, I see on the interwebs, for example, Delo ESI 80w90 GL5 has 100c / 40c viscosities of 14.2 / 140 cSt and the Delo ESI 50 weight transmission fluid is 14.5 / 143 respectively. ESI being probably the best lube I've ever introduced by the way (great $ value too).
At least the additive wasn't sperm wale oil based. That'd been some vintage NOS GM stuff worth its weight in gold on eBay. Veggie oil comment was younger and cheek.
Puzzled on the comment about 75w90 being too thick. 75w90 should be about the same as a MTL on a 50 weight SAE scale for engine oil. It's been a couple years since I looked into this, but I recall when we complied all the data of global 75w90 / 80w90 and 50 weight MT1 the hot and cold viscosities were all within, from a functional standpoint, the same basic range between lubes. Random sample of what's in front of me now, I see on the interwebs, for example, Delo ESI 80w90 GL5 has 100c / 40c viscosities of 14.2 / 140 cSt and the Delo ESI 50 weight transmission fluid is 14.5 / 143 respectively. ESI being probably the best lube I've ever introduced by the way (great $ value too).
At least the additive wasn't sperm wale oil based. That'd been some vintage NOS GM stuff worth its weight in gold on eBay. Veggie oil comment was younger and cheek.
MolaKule
Staff member
I did not strip anything out of context. I used the relevant comment to respond.
I think you are the one who has a misunderstanding wrt to context.
I clearly stated that differential fluid has a higher viscosity than do dedicated MTL's. That is a fact and that is the context in which I responded.
Differential lubes behave poorly in manual transmissions for two major reason: 1) viscosity too high for cold weather shifting, 2) no friction modification for synchro assembly.
I also gave an example of a 50 weight product showing it's stated viscosity, which is too high for light truck and car MT's cold weather shifting.
SAE 75W90 has a wide viscosity range. That is a fact as well.
Quote:
Puzzled on the comment about 75w90 being too thick. 75w90 should be about the same as a MTL on a 50 weight SAE scale for engine oil. It's been a couple years since I looked into this, but I recall when we complied all the data of global 75w90 / 80w90 and 50 weight MT1 the hot and cold viscosities were all within, from a functional standpoint, the same basic range between lubes. Random sample of what's in front of me now, I see on the interwebs, for example, Delo ESI 80w90 GL5 has 100c / 40c viscosities of 14.2 / 140 cSt and the Delo ESI 50 weight transmission fluid is 14.5 / 143 respectively. ESI being probably the best lube I've ever introduced by the way (great $ value too).
What do you mean by, "the best lube I've ever introduced."
Delo lubricants are products and trademarks of the Chevron company.
I think you are the one who has a misunderstanding wrt to context.
I clearly stated that differential fluid has a higher viscosity than do dedicated MTL's. That is a fact and that is the context in which I responded.
Differential lubes behave poorly in manual transmissions for two major reason: 1) viscosity too high for cold weather shifting, 2) no friction modification for synchro assembly.
I also gave an example of a 50 weight product showing it's stated viscosity, which is too high for light truck and car MT's cold weather shifting.
SAE 75W90 has a wide viscosity range. That is a fact as well.
Quote:
Puzzled on the comment about 75w90 being too thick. 75w90 should be about the same as a MTL on a 50 weight SAE scale for engine oil. It's been a couple years since I looked into this, but I recall when we complied all the data of global 75w90 / 80w90 and 50 weight MT1 the hot and cold viscosities were all within, from a functional standpoint, the same basic range between lubes. Random sample of what's in front of me now, I see on the interwebs, for example, Delo ESI 80w90 GL5 has 100c / 40c viscosities of 14.2 / 140 cSt and the Delo ESI 50 weight transmission fluid is 14.5 / 143 respectively. ESI being probably the best lube I've ever introduced by the way (great $ value too).
What do you mean by, "the best lube I've ever introduced."
Delo lubricants are products and trademarks of the Chevron company.
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