First Post - First real piston soak

RapidCAD

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30 min run is done, CLP is in for 48 hours.. I'll follow with maybe 48 hours more of Berryman's in the cylinders after I rock the crank and suck out the CLP, then I'll suck that out and complete the flush steps and follow up with the Kreen eventually. BTW, here is what the cylinders looked like after I cleaned them up last June with Sea-Foam and a dental tool
 
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Originally Posted By: BrocLuno
So out here, we can't get KREEN any longer ... It's some political B... about cancer causing chemicals, etc. Since non-licensed folks used it, the State said no more frown In lieu of KREEN, I use a combo of Break-Free and BG109. The Break-Free goes in overnight (or over weekend) and just sits. The end gaps will let it by to fill the whole ring pack. Then fire it up and drive about the block, change oil and filter and good to go. The BG109 goes in (full can) somewhere between 500 and 100 miles before an oil change. Have had very good luck with this approach smile The next suggestion is to change the oil chemistry to break up the deposits. I'd run a change on Redline, then Pennz Ultra, then go back to semi-syn. All this will do what it can. But you may just need a ring job ...
Kreen has a fair bit of VOCs in it - it’s butyl cellosolve and a chlorinated solvent I think. I’ve been wondering about CLP as a ring soak, I’ve been running MMO before an OCI, but this time I’ve used Schaeffer’s Neutra 131 as a flush and it seems like it’s more aggressive than MMO. I just changed my oil and filter but I’ll give CLP a try as a soak and another shot of 131 about 500 miles out from an OCI. Besides, while I don’t own firearms I can let my friends who do us my CLP to clean theirs.
 
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
I still recommend LCD, Inc.'s LC20 for piston soaks.
I still have a gallon jug that I forgot all about. I think I used it on the snowblower years ago but I forget. When I have time and need I will try it.
 
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Sorry to inform you but you have a 25+ year old car that wasn't known as a "reliable" one anyway. Its turbocharged and has high mileage, it was likely beat or improperly maintained in its first 100K and now you are reaping the effects of that. Time for a full rebuild, you can't fix blow-by like that no matter what additive or hacks you try, the motor is done. Buy you some time and run a crankcase full of 20W50, than might slow it some but only postpones the inevitable...
 
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My first post, too. Hopefully not hijacking this thread, but have a question about doing a piston soak, and this seems like a good place to ask. 2001 Corolla. Have had it for about a year, but it was consuming oil at a ferocious rate: first 1 quart/400 miles, finally all four quarts/200 miles. Now, a dead cylinder #4, and the likely death of the car. Never had the resources to to do an engine rebuild, unfortunately. In the hope that cylinder 4's problem is simply a stuck ring and not structural damage, I'm going to attempt a piston soak. How much solvent to use? Enough so that the fluid goes over the top of the piston head? Will keying the engine be enough to extract all the solvent after the soak, or do I have to find some kind of syringe to get the rest out? Leave the spark plugs loosely in the cylinder during the soak (and then remove them during extraction)?
 
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Holy cats that a lot of oil. Do a leak down test if possible or at least a compression. I don't think you have to worry about a wet compression test. Don't be too surprised if its very low.
 
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Originally Posted By: nthach
Kreen has a fair bit of VOCs in it - it’s butyl cellosolve and a chlorinated solvent I think.
No chlorinated solvents in Kreen according to the MSDS, and given that they suggest using it in gas and the combustion products of chlorinated solvents are toxic...
 

RapidCAD

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Ok, I've done the soak, did it first for two days with CLP in there, rocking the crank a few times a day. Cylinders 3 and 4 eventually penetrated through, while I had to use a bulb and thin aquarium tubing to evacuate the remainder out of 1 and 2, but about half of that penetrated as well. I learned that this stuff is difficult to suck up. It works best if you fill the aquarium tubing with CLP first, the hydraulic tension works better with more head in the tube rather than starting to suck with an empty tube. Then, since I had time and product, I decided to put 2oz of B-12 in each cylinder for two more days. I rocked the crank several times a day again, and only the B-12 ponding in the dished pistons was remaining, so I used old shoelaces to wick it out of them. Then I dumped the oil, ran her for 5min at 2k, then 25min at idle and dumped it again - filters each time too. She started up surprisingly well, and idk how much smoke she made, I had a tailpipe hose under the door with blankets sealing the cold air outside. I threw the rest of the B-12 in the tank and filled her up and have put 240miles on her so far. I plan to put the Kreen in on Saturday after she gets 100 more miles on her. She does not seem to smoke on on-ramps revving around 5-6k anymore, but she is still smoking if I pull out of work after she sits all day. Bluish white thick billows that stop as quickly as they start, lasts about 3 seconds and stops. Otherwise it is hard to see anything. She has burned almost 1/2 quart in 250 miles. Not really any better. I still have to do the Kreen this weekend. She has brand new stem seals on her (June), done at a shop, I doubt that they are bad already. The smoking even happens when I leave work using as little throttle as possible. I never see that when pulling out of the driveway in the morning, but my garage floor is flat while at work she sits on a 5 degree slope, rear end down. In either place I hear lifter tick for the first 5 seconds then she quiets down. That is pretty common now if she cools down for about 4 hours. I have two questions. How much Kreen should I put in the crankcase for this 1000 mile cleanse? She only has about 3 of her 3.4 qt capacity left in her. I still plan on putting about a half-can in the tank. Also, should I use 8 oz of the Kreen this weekend to do one more ring soak since I have hthe Kreen and the time? If I did, would I have to dump the oil and filter again, or could that wait until the 1000 miles are up?
 

RapidCAD

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Any thoughts on those last two questions? I could use the advice before i dig into it tomorrow. Thanks in advance. cool
 
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I think you've done enough of a piston soak, two different products, 48 hours total? If the valve stem seals are good I think it might be time for a rebuild.
 

RapidCAD

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Thanks all. I will check compression again tomorrow, and follow with those 10 oz of Kreen in the crankcase, 16 oz in the tank. So far the only sure thing is that my milage jumped from 26 to 28 with just as cold weather and the same trip to and from work. However, I was in the gas a little more to check the smoke, so milage should have improved more than 8% had I driven similarly. I hit 31 mpg a few trips in the summer and I would think 32 or 33 would be possible if this proves to be true, but one tankful isn't a good test sample. Will post compression numbers tomorrow.
 

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All this talk of piston soak and no mention of MMO? Wow, I am shocked! RapidCad- I hope the piston soak works out for you and buys you some extra time with that engine.
 

RapidCAD

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Ok, here are the results: After 357 miles mostly with half a can of B-12 in the tank, she has used about 3/4 quart according to the dipstick. Lately, with the cold weather, I've been running 87 octane with the boost turned down a half turn (about a 10 lb max). She actually calls for 87, but with the hybrid replacement turbo I replaced the bad original with, she can make more boost. So when I want to run a little higher boost (11 lbs), I use priemium and turn up the manual boost controller a little. I mention that due to the look of those plugs, not being sure why they look so white and powdery this time I checked them. Compression test results before and after... Before soak: Dry (cold too) CYL 1 (150) CYL 2 (149) CYL 3 (133) CYL 4 (155) Wet (cold too) CYL 1 (172) CYL 2 (180) CYL 3 (170) CYL 4 (180) After soak: Dry (room temp) CYL 1 (150) CYL 2 (149) CYL 3 (140) CYL 4 (158) Wet (room temp) CYL 1 (205) CYL 2 (220) CYL 3 (199) CYL 4 (212) I don't know what to make of it all. Seems like the dry did not differ much. But the wet is considerably better. I probably caused some uneven results as well, not clearly reading the ounce measure on my oil syringe. Cylinder 2 got a half ounce more than the others and my first wet measure was actually 240, which I eventually threw out after I figured out my inequity. Here is what the spark plugs look like. They seem noticeably whiter than they did previously. So anyone know what to make of all this? While I have the plugs out and the intake tube off, I think I will pull the valve cover and check the seal of the baffle covers that are notorious for causing too much oil to enter the PCV system, which could be happening, but I did this all a few years ago, so I doubt it.
 
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RapidCAD

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Thanks. I might consider a different course of treatment, but I still have to do the valve cover baffles today and run the Kreen for 1000 miles. So, can anyone give me an analysis of those numbers? Does that indicate that the oil control rings have freed up? And the plugs, what does the white dust indicate?
 

RapidCAD

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I did some reading and found that the white powdery deposits are from oil burn off or possibly too much additive (B-12) but judging by the consumption numbers it is probably the oil consumption causing this. However, I thought that before the soak, the plugs were that light tan (perfect) color. I will have to check all the paperwork that came with the Kreen to see if they have a recommendation on the oz/gallon ratio for Kreen in the gas tank. The Capri only has a 11 gal tank, so it would likely require less than most every car or truck.
 

RapidCAD

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This will probably be my last post on this problem. After pulling the valve cover, re-sealing the baffles, and putting her back together again with a fresh filter and 8oz of Kreen in with around 3 Qts of Valvoline Max-Life 10W40, I ran her 488 miles so far. She is down about 7/8 of a quart already. I might have lost 5 or 6 oz to a corner leak on the valve cover, (didn't tighten it enough and found a decent mess under the car ), but I don't think it leaks anymore and I doubt it leaked most of a quart, that would have left the underside of the car pretty messy -all I cleaned up was considerably less than a cup. I caught the leak after driving about 270 miles (since the change) and it was down about 1/2 quart. Now, 210 miles later she is down about another 3/8 quart, so I don't think it leaked all that much out. My catch can on the PCV line had maybe an ounce in it, but it is a cheap model, not a good one. I suspect it all went through the PCV line. The only smoke I see is when she sits over 8 hours and after starting, I have to get into traffic. She leaves a medium blue-grey cloud about half the size of the car and that is it. No more the rest of the trip, no more until she sits over 6 or so hours. If I drive at lunch there's no smoke and none 4 hours later when I leave in the evening. My guess is that the soak helped lower consumption some, maybe 25%, but it will take time and miles to know for sure just how much. I know that the compression numbers really jumped after the soak so it had an effect. Maybe the valve guides are bad. I only had the shop put the valve seals on that came with my gasket set, and hot-dip the head and deck it flat. Maybe those guides should have been replaced last summer. They did not mention anything alarming when they machined it, only that it had only minimal warpage before they milled it. The world may never know what the problem is. I'll put her up for sale next week at the honest price and disclose what is up with it. Sad to see it go, but I can't keep working on it.
 
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All of those caustic chemicals are probably making your problem worse. They are not friendly to aluminum. You are literally eating away your pistons.
 
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