Finally making the switch to Amsoil!!!

[bluesubie]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
The OP is in Texas. The cold cranking viscosity test on 0W oil is performed at -35C.


In defence of CATERHAM's point, he didn't bring up MRV or CCV at all. He was pointing to HTHS and VI. He prefers something with a higher VI - end of story.

The OP did not question the differences in HTHSV and VI, or ask what VI CATERHAM prefers. He was simply sharing his enthusiasm for switching to Amsoil. End of story.

-Dennis

 

[Scotty1981]

Originally Posted By: Scotty1981
I am also thinking of switching and thought I should chime in here instead of making a new thread. I have an 8th Gen Civic and wanted to know if amsoil ATF and coolant was compatible with hondas. I'm not too worried about oil right now as I run of the OLM so I just let the dealer do the changes right now, they only charge me 18.95 +tax.



Anyone know about this? I'm worried about putting amsoil in if Honda requires a special type of ATF or something, Pablo, any ideas if Amsoil and Honda fluids are interchangable? Was looking to swap out everything but the engine oil right now.

Brake Fluid, Power Steering Fluid, Coolant and Transmission Fluid. I think that covers everything.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: Scotty1981
Originally Posted By: Scotty1981
I am also thinking of switching and thought I should chime in here instead of making a new thread. I have an 8th Gen Civic and wanted to know if amsoil ATF and coolant was compatible with hondas. I'm not too worried about oil right now as I run of the OLM so I just let the dealer do the changes right now, they only charge me 18.95 +tax.



Anyone know about this? I'm worried about putting amsoil in if Honda requires a special type of ATF or something, Pablo, any ideas if Amsoil and Honda fluids are interchangable? Was looking to swap out everything but the engine oil right now.

Brake Fluid, Power Steering Fluid, Coolant and Transmission Fluid. I think that covers everything.


Amsoil ATF works great in Honda transmissions. Also, the BF, power steering fluid and coolant:

http://www.amsoil.com/mygarage/vehiclelookup.aspx?url2=2007+HONDA+CIVIC+R

http://www.amsoil.com/mygarage/vehiclelookup.aspx?url2=2007+HONDA+CIVIC+Z

See me for PC pricing.

 

[Capa]

Originally Posted By: BigBird57
Just be aware the OE and the XL are largely Group III basestocks. Do not forget to add one dollar per qt for shipping. The SSO is the true boutique formula the others are just like everyone else. Nothing special. G-Oil or Pennzoil Ultra would serve you just as well.


The inexpensive Toyota is almost for sure largely Group III. While some people can find it for about $5, here it goes for between $6-$7, plus tax. 2.6 vs 2.7 is really quibbling about nothing.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: Capa
Originally Posted By: BigBird57

The inexpensive Toyota is almost for sure largely Group III. While some people can find it for about $5, here it goes for between $6-$7, plus tax. 2.6 vs 2.7 is really quibbling about nothing.

The difference between a 2.6cP oil and a 2.7cP translates into a 3-5 psi oil pressure difference, not a big deal but significant.
The main difference between most 0W-20s including Amsoil and the Toyota 0W-20 relates to the ultra high VI of the Toyota oil.
216 vs only 167 for Amsoil is a big deal. For most BITOGers VI is just an academic spec' but for those that have an oil pressure gauge equipped car that hugh VI difference becomes very apparent in dramatically lower OP on start-up and during the entire warming up period. The lower the OP the lower the operational viscosity of the oil.
The following video demonstates very nicely why many auto manufacturers place such a high value on an oil's VI:

http://www.sustina.us/product-line.php

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: bluesubie
The OP did not question the differences in HTHSV and VI, or ask what VI CATERHAM prefers. He was simply sharing his enthusiasm for switching to Amsoil.


As we can see, not everyone shares that enthusiasm. Amsoil is a great oil and would likely be my number one choice if I were doing extended OCIs. But, all oils are compromises, Amsoil included.

I almost wish I had more two stroke OPE. One retailer here has every two stroke oil variety Amsoil markets, it would seem. It would be nice to try. There's always my snowmobile, I suppose!

 

[buster]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
The OP did not question the differences in HTHSV and VI, or ask what VI CATERHAM prefers. He was simply sharing his enthusiasm for switching to Amsoil.


As we can see, not everyone shares that enthusiasm. Amsoil is a great oil and would likely be my number one choice if I were doing extended OCIs. But, all oils are compromises, Amsoil included.

I almost wish I had more two stroke OPE. One retailer here has every two stroke oil variety Amsoil markets, it would seem. It would be nice to try. There's always my snowmobile, I suppose!


Exactly.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
The OP did not question the differences in HTHSV and VI, or ask what VI CATERHAM prefers. He was simply sharing his enthusiasm for switching to Amsoil.


As we can see, not everyone shares that enthusiasm. Amsoil is a great oil and would likely be my number one choice if I were doing extended OCIs. But, all oils are compromises, Amsoil included.

With a 5,000-6,000 mile OCI, extended drains was not a motivation.
The OP's enthusiasm in switching to Amsoil was not technically based at all but rather hinged on Amsoil's reputation as a quality formulator. That's all well and good but it doesn't necessarily mean Amsoil actually makes a suitable oil for this particular application.
I simply pointed out that in deviating from the recommended TGMO, Amsoil, while still an SAE 0W-20 oil was very much heavier than the spec' oil. The OP didn't know this but now he does.
A more informed consumer is a better consumer.

 

[buster]

Quote:
I simply pointed out that in deviating from the recommended TGMO, Amsoil, while still an SAE 0W-20 oil was very much heavier than the spec' oil. The OP didn't know this but now he does.
A more informed consumer is a better consumer.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: bluesubie
The OP did not question the differences in HTHSV and VI, or ask what VI CATERHAM prefers. He was simply sharing his enthusiasm for switching to Amsoil.


As we can see, not everyone shares that enthusiasm. Amsoil is a great oil and would likely be my number one choice if I were doing extended OCIs. But, all oils are compromises, Amsoil included.

With a 5,000-6,000 mile OCI, extended drains was not a motivation.
The OP's enthusiasm in switching to Amsoil was not technically based at all but rather hinged on Amsoil's reputation as a quality formulator. That's all well and good but it doesn't necessarily mean Amsoil actually makes a suitable oil for this particular application.
I simply pointed out that in deviating from the recommended TGMO, Amsoil, while still an SAE 0W-20 oil was very much heavier than the spec' oil. The OP didn't know this but now he does.
A more informed consumer is a better consumer.


CATHERHAM I understand your point. But once hairs are split down to this level how much protection are we talking about? A extra 1-10K miles of engine life? That is a big maybe and that is if everything else works out just right. If I need engine oil lubrication this precise I would also need everything else about the engine to this precise for the potential benefits of oil to take effect. That being said as long and as I am willing to spend money and maintain my truck I will no longer be able to drive and my truck would still run.

 

[buster]

Reality is, engines can use a wide range of viscosity. I could technically run anything from a 0w20 to a 5w40 in our cars. The best viscosity is the lightest viscosity that still protects the engine.


Quote:
0W-20 BENEFITS:
Fuel efficiency -- Viscosity is defined as “resistance of a fluid to flow". The lower the viscosity, the
lower the resistance, the less heat generated, the more power that gets to the wheels, the better the
fuel economy of that vehicle. Toyota says that the use of 0W-20 will save between 0.4 and 0.6 MPG.
Honda claims you will see a 1.5% fuel economy savings as compared to 5w30.
Less wear -- Engine design, materials and manufacturing processes have changed.
• Engines are now designed with larger bearing surfaces, which spread the load and lowers PSI..
• The load bearing surfaces are smoother (mirror like) and less porous than in older engines.
Therefore, thinner oils can keep moving surfaces apart without excessive wear.
• Clearances have been reduced to the point that thicker oils can not get where needed. The
Honda Civic Hybrid and Insight have bearing clearances of just 0.0095 inches.
• At start up, thinner oils can get where needed faster thus reducing wear. A Ford study
concluded that 75% of wear occurs at start up.
• Hybrid cars that cycle between battery and gasoline engine are constantly starting, stopping and
jumping to high speed. 0W-20 is needed in this environment.
Cooler Engines -- Thin oil moving fast will remove more heat than thick oil moving slowly.

 

[dave1251]

Originally Posted By: buster
Reality is, engines can use a wide range of viscosity. I could technically run anything from a 0w20 to a 5w40 in our cars. The best viscosity is the lightest viscosity that still protects the engine.


Quote:
0W-20 BENEFITS:
Fuel efficiency -- Viscosity is defined as “resistance of a fluid to flow". The lower the viscosity, the
lower the resistance, the less heat generated, the more power that gets to the wheels, the better the
fuel economy of that vehicle. Toyota says that the use of 0W-20 will save between 0.4 and 0.6 MPG.
Honda claims you will see a 1.5% fuel economy savings as compared to 5w30.
Less wear -- Engine design, materials and manufacturing processes have changed.
• Engines are now designed with larger bearing surfaces, which spread the load and lowers PSI..
• The load bearing surfaces are smoother (mirror like) and less porous than in older engines.
Therefore, thinner oils can keep moving surfaces apart without excessive wear.
• Clearances have been reduced to the point that thicker oils can not get where needed. The
Honda Civic Hybrid and Insight have bearing clearances of just 0.0095 inches.
• At start up, thinner oils can get where needed faster thus reducing wear. A Ford study
concluded that 75% of wear occurs at start up.
• Hybrid cars that cycle between battery and gasoline engine are constantly starting, stopping and
jumping to high speed. 0W-20 is needed in this environment.
Cooler Engines -- Thin oil moving fast will remove more heat than thick oil moving slowly.

Are you itching to try some 0W-10 next? Whew I am not going to get in those threads when 0W-10 becomes available one day.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Amsoil, while still an SAE 0W-20 oil was very much heavier than the spec' oil.


Please don't obfuscate. Amsoil 0W-20 is NOT "heavier" than the specified oil. If that's what you mean by "spec'".

Yes Amsoil has a marginally higher HTHS, we've been down that road, no need to repeat. But it meets the crankcase fill requirements of Toyota. Please stop writing otherwise.

 

[GumbyJarvis]

buy amsoil, buy american

unless theres something better LOL (i know someones gonna bash the NGK thing on me for that comment)

 

[Oil Changer]

Quote:
Ive always wanted to run Amsoil in my cars, but the price difference has always discouraged me. Now that PP and mobil 1 Full Synthetic have creeped up in price (I dont even know when or how that happened!) Amsoil is looking even more attractive.

Wife's car is a 2012 Corolla. It is spec'd for 0W20. Im planning on getting some Amsoil from Pablo (Fellow Bitog'er) in the next 2 weeks. Ive still got a stash of 5 gallons of 5W30 for my nissan versa, but once that is out, my versa is going on an Amsoil diet as well!


The OP offered no reason to switch to Amsoil other than Amsoil is available to him at an acceptable price point and "always wanted to...".

Quote:
Never used Amsoil, so the novelty of it is also nice.


Quote:
While the viscosity issue is debatable (and I have no clue about it, it is way beyond my limited oil knowledge)


The OP admits to not having any technical reason to switch to Amsoil other than for "the novelty".

The OP wants to run Amsoil just to say he is running Amsoil. CATERHAM offers technical reasons why that is not the best idea and gets dogpiled.

Amsoil is not the best choice for the OP. If he wants to be cool and make friends on BITOG, buy Sustina, post a VOA and then a used oil analysis after a 10k run. He'll be far more revered than offering nothing more than a run-of-the-mill boring Amsoil used oil analysis.

 

[GumbyJarvis]

Originally Posted By: Oil Changer

Amsoil is not the best choice for the OP. If he wants to be cool and make friends on BITOG, buy Sustina, post a VOA and then a used oil analysis after a 10k run. He'll be far more revered than offering nothing more than a run-of-the-mill boring Amsoil used oil analysis.


TBCH Its all him man, so what if he does not make friends on here, hes doing what he wants to do, AMSOIL and Sustina are both good oils, its his choice, I am one of the only PEAK users on here, as some refer to PEAK as the "FRAM of oils" as apparently it is "Overpriced garbage quality" its what I wanna use, so I use it. PEAK has been good to me on rebates and I have never had them "Lose" my rebate letter (ie SOPUS did many times, Used to be a FIRM QS user) PEAK has sent me letters with coupons/gift checks, and I got an email from them for my birthday with a follow up for a rebate... If he wants to use AMSOIL as I said its his choice, its his car, who cares what others think? in Texas a Low 0w-20 versus a high 0w-20 really shouldnt matter, if he was living in michigan or idaho it could possibly mean another thing. I say use what you want man, Use AMSOIL, or SUSTINA with confidence! Out of the two id go with Amsoil, but thats just me if available, either oil man, choose what you want


PS. Everyone get off Pablos back
PSS. Everyone also get off Caterhams back

 

[GumbyJarvis]

Pablo is willing to help him, representing AMSOIL-Consumer relations at a very very good way, that means more to me if I was in your shoes than Toyota just selling you the stuff cause you "need it"

In my book, someone treats me good (as Old World Industries has) than ill treat you good by giving you a paycheck, cant remember how many times this has happened. Yeah, you not buying Toyotas oil isnt gonna put them out of business, but you buying for example AMSOIL puts food on the table for Pablo!

I guess its just me, happens alot, Got horrible service many times at various places, such as Subway, yeah me not going there anymore isnt necessarily hurting them, but id rather help the friendlier people at say Quiznos get the hours to put food on the table.

Same with mechanics, MOST people go to one mechanic, the person down the road may do the same job cheaper, but this is "your mechanic" you know and trust so you go to him regardless, same concept.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: GumbyJarvis
If he wants to use AMSOIL as I said its his choice, its his car, who cares what others think?


Absolutely. However, he should expect to hear our opinions here, be they informed or uninformed. But it his choice. In any case, either oil is more than up to the task for his application, and by a very wide margin, if you ask me. Either of the two options are very well respected oils here. It's not like he's putting City Star in the thing.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: dave1251
Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Originally Posted By: Garak

/quote]


CATHERHAM I understand your point. But once hairs are split down to this level how much protection are we talking about? A extra 1-10K miles of engine life? That is a big maybe and that is if everything else works out just right. If I need engine oil lubrication this precise I would also need everything else about the engine to this precise for the potential benefits of oil to take effect. That being said as long and as I am willing to spend money and maintain my truck I will no longer be able to drive and my truck would still run.

I don't think pointing out a 50 point VI difference is splitting hairs. As mentioned previously it translates into the Amsoil 0W-20 being 30% heavier at room temperature and a whopping 45% at 0C.
The Toyota 0W-20 is one of the few Ultra High VI 0W-20 oils available.

 

[dave1251]

I disagree, when you are talking about VI how much translates to engine protection, engine life, and engine efficiency? On a practical real world level. We like to discuss the technical data on motor oil a lot. But really how much translates to protecting a internal combustion engine? If I have to pay Toyota for their oil at their price at their convenience, to get the motor oil with highest VI I better be getting a lot of benefit over any oil I can go to Walmart or my local parts store and pick up. I will even throw Amsoil in the mix at least if I am willing to pay Amsoil the privilege of providing me with a PCMO Amsoil will deliver it to my house. If I want Toyota 0W-20 I have to drive 17 miles to the Toyota dealership to put Toyota oil in my Ford. So if I have to do that what is the benefit? Are my engines going to last longer? Am I going to see a noticeable difference in my gas mileage? If no one can guarantee that because a oil has a higher VI content none of that is going to happen it is not worth my hassle or extra money it will take me to obtain a oil with the highest VI for my engine.

DISCLAIMER!
That is my personnel opinion and the expressed opinions by me do not represent anyone else.