Ferrari F355 oil recommendations

[KL31]

Can the people spouting off about this seal swell theory please name some seals in their engine that are rubber or something that can swell and are covered in large amounts of oil?

Valve cover (not drowned in oil)
Spark plug gasket
Some oil pans (mine is just rtv)
Front and rear mains

Any more? That's just off the top of my head. I'm not buying this high milage stuff. Why is it suddenly ok to use after 75k but not before. Some engines are as good as new at 75k. Some are still in superb condition at 150k. My theory, it's just a scam to make you feel nice and open your wallet.

 

[Shannow]

Not buying into the discussion/debate about them growing/shrinking, but...

The elastomeric compatibility testing is usually a fairly short term test (10s of hours), with full and total immersion.

Some elastomers shrink, some swell, some harden, some dissolve.

Like you point out, those that we are concerned with aren't submergd, and have another medium on the outside.

But over the thousands of hours (8760 in a year), it makes a difference....sparkplug tube o-rings are still wet 24/7/365...formula needs to be balanced well enough.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted By: KenO
Reseal or rebuild an engine with 100% new gaskets % seals everywhere. Within ~20k miles or so, EVERYTHING will leak. HM oils have seal sweller agents, and specifically say on the bottle - 'for cars with 75k miles or higher' for that reason.


And they all specifically state on their websites that the oil can be used in lower mileage vehicles as well with no concerns.

Your comments don't even make sense. You are stating that HM oil will cause leaks with new gaskets and seals. How is that possible? Most of the questions about the product are generally about switching back to non-HM oil after using HM. But you are stating that it causes leaks in the first place? If it swells up the new seals, how are they leaking?

And I still want to know how an API SN rated oil is harmful to seals. How did that sneak by?

Would regular M1 be OK to use with new seals? Be careful before you answer that.

 

[KenO]

Case in point - I completely re-sealed an M52 before it went into my E36 ti. Valve cover gasket is rubber. Oilpan gasket is rubber-lined. Oil filter housing gasket is rubber. I ran Maxlife in that car for the first 20-30k miles of it's life and EVERYTHING leaks. You know what doesn't leak? The teflon-lined rear main seal. Literally everything rubber on that motor leaks now. I've resealed probably getting close to a hundred of these motors now - I'm not some backyard shadetree mechanic, I do this for a living. Oilpan bolts were torqued, as was most everything else. I don't have this problem with most customers cars. This was my own car, that I experimented on.

And to the poster that commented about 'if they swelled, how did they leak'. Really? Rubber swells, and it gets soft. Like everything else, it's a bandaid to a proper repair of replacing worn, hardened leaking gaskets. On fresh, soft supple rubber gaskets - it destroys them. I argue basic engineering & physics with people all the time that say 'but that stuff is wrong, my experience says....' I'm not doing that. Show me how the additive packs in HM oils DON'T damage fresh rubber seals. I don't want marketing claims, I want actual science, tests etc. I'm betting you can't....

 

[69GTX]

What's all this 40 grade Ferrari oil stuff? Didn't Dr. Haas in the original Motor Oil University state whey were using 10 grade oil in their Ferrari because it was optimum for cooling?

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
What exactly is a "Ferrari approved oil?" Is there even such a thing?

That's a good question. The Pennzoil Euro 5w-40 claims to be Ferrari approved. The other Euro grades they have that are A3/B4 don't claim it. That's about as rigorous as it gets, I guess.

Of course, that has nothing to do with Ferraris of different years or whether this "specification" changes or updates.

 

[weasley]

Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
A new (or heavily rebuilt F355 engine) should have at least 1200 ppm of lithium (ZDDP)...


Huh?

 

[Mitch Alsup]

Originally Posted By: 69GTX
What's all this 40 grade Ferrari oil stuff? Didn't Dr. Haas in the original Motor Oil University state whey were using 10 grade oil in their Ferrari because it was optimum for cooling?


Dr Haas had a short commute in his Enzo where the oil never got up to temperature, so, in effect, he was compensating by using an oil with a more appropriate actual viscosity due to that lack of temperature. But I think it was a 20-grade oil in a car with a 10W-60 specified oil.

 

[Mitch Alsup]

Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
A new (or heavily rebuilt F355 engine) should have at least 1200 ppm of lithium (ZDDP)...


Huh?

Zinc--Zinc

 

[ammolab]

Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
Originally Posted By: weasley
Originally Posted By: Mitch Alsup
A new (or heavily rebuilt F355 engine) should have at least 1200 ppm of lithium (ZDDP)...


Huh?

Zinc--Zinc


Yes, Zinc needed for the engine, but he got confused because he is on Lithium!

 

[slybunda]

10-40 dino will do the trick its not a special engine.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted By: slybunda
10-40 dino will do the trick its not a special engine.

You're right, it's just a fragile 80's race engine making 110hp/liter.

Same as any other car.

/sarcasm

 

[slybunda]

nop, cars these days with smaller engines making same or more power with greater reliability. technology moves on.

 

[Olas]

Redline.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted By: slybunda
nop, cars these days with smaller engines making same or more power with greater reliability. technology moves on.

Really, which other KNOWN FRAGILE naturally aspirated engine making 110hp per liter and revving to 9000rpm is there?

The S2000 is one that revs to 9k and WILL crack valve retainers.

The M5 S85 V10 is another high-revving, high-hp naturally aspirated engine - that one needs a special oil and would also be considered fragile.

WE're not talking about a Toyota 4 popper or a lazy American V8 here.

 

[edyvw]

Originally Posted By: slybunda
nop, cars these days with smaller engines making same or more power with greater reliability. technology moves on.

Like someone said, name naturally aspirated engines that are 110hp and use Dino?

 

[chrisri]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW
Originally Posted By: slybunda
nop, cars these days with smaller engines making same or more power with greater reliability. technology moves on.

Really, which other KNOWN FRAGILE naturally aspirated engine making 110hp per liter and revving to 9000rpm is there?

The S2000 is one that revs to 9k and WILL crack valve retainers.

The M5 S85 V10 is another high-revving, high-hp naturally aspirated engine - that one needs a special oil and would also be considered fragile.

WE're not talking about a Toyota 4 popper or a lazy American V8 here.

Maybe his Toyota Aygo makes 110HP, it's 1 litre IIRC.

 

[slybunda]

doesnt have to be naturally aspirated, forced induction is what cars use today and have considerably more power per litre. look at the civic type r for example.

 

[RooflessVW]

Originally Posted By: slybunda
doesnt have to be naturally aspirated, forced induction is what cars use today and have considerably more power per litre. look at the civic type r for example.

AND YOUR CIVIC ENGINE HAS NO RELEVANCE TO THE FERRARI ENGINE IN QUESTION!

The F355 does not have a modern engine. It is a high-revving, fragile, state-of-the-80s, race engine.

 

[robertcope]

Originally Posted By: rooflessVW

The S2000 is one that revs to 9k and WILL crack valve retainers.


They're really only a problem if you miss a shift and over-rev the motor. And later retainers fixed the issue. 188K on my AP1, still going strong.