Engine noise and wear...

[blackandblue]

Is there any merit to the assumption that engine noise (especially at start up) equals engine wear over the long term?

I have owned 3 KIA and all 3 have had the distinctive Hyundai/KIA quasi-ticking noise, especially at start up. They are like that from mile 1, and it seems to be a characteristic of their engines. Recently I did an OCI with 0w30 instead of the spec'd 5w-20. While I didn't think that it had an affect, having changed back to 5w-20 for this oci seems to have made it louder (again).

The real question is- does quieter necessarily mean better protected?

 

[demarpaint]

IMO when you have noise such as ticking, tapping, or anything else where two metal parts are coming in direct contact with each other that's not good. I recall a discussion a while back where one brand of oil was quieter in a posters engine than another, both oils being the same grade. I had the same issue, and simply changing brands of oil stopped it. In fact it was a high priced boutique oil that was giving me the noise, go figure. I changed brands, not grades and eliminated the noise. Quiet is always better than noisy IMO. Flame suit on.......

 

[OtisBlkR1]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
IMO Quiet is always better than noisy IMO. Flame suit on.......


On my motorcycle ive been told "tappy valves are happy valves"..

 

[demarpaint]

I can't comment on motorcycles I don't own one. I don't like tappy valves, or slappy pistons in my engines.

 

[chubbs1]

It can. There are different acoustic properties to oils and as you go thicker you tend to hear less noise (not always) but most of the time. I tend to hear the most noise with true synthetics. I just looked up and see you are using a mostly grp IV oil so you will hear more noise. I had a Nissan Altima that had a slight tick and it was more pronounced with Amsoil ASL and Mobil 1 Extended Performance. I used a lot of brands and went from 5w30 to 0w40 and it lessened but I had stellar used oil analysis from 0w30 and 0w40. More noise with the 0w30 though. So I really would not worry this OCI especially with winter coming up, leave the 5w20 in. That is just my experience.

 

[KCJeep]

I prefer to seek out oils that are very quiet in my vehicles, but a recent UOA indicated one of the smoothest/quietest I'd ever used in my wife's van had very high wear due to coolant contamination.

It doesn't make sense to me you'd think quiet would mean lower wear but I guess it's not that easy.

 

[friendly_jacek]

Depends on noise. Knocking or pinging is obviously harmful, but other than that there should be no correlation. Diesels are nosier, but wear little. The toyota 1ZZ-FE is one very noisy engine, especially on startup, yet wears little. You can go on and on with examples.

 

[crazyoildude]

some engines are louder than others but last just as long

 

[wolf_06]

I have a hyundai and Pennzoil Platinum 5w20, Pennzoil conventional, Quaker State conventional, all were noisier at startup.

castrol gtx, mobil 1 5w20 and syntec keeps it really quiet.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: KCJeep
I prefer to seek out oils that are very quiet in my vehicles, but a recent UOA indicated one of the smoothest/quietest I'd ever used in my wife's van had very high wear due to coolant contamination.

It doesn't make sense to me you'd think quiet would mean lower wear but I guess it's not that easy.


You can't blame the oil you used for higher wear if it was contaminated with coolant. I'd get the leak fixed and go back to the oil that was quietest in the engine. Metal banging against metal in a gasoline engine IMO is not good.

 

[KCJeep]

No bud I'm not blaming the oil at all, in fact it held up remarkably well considering the contamination. My point was simply that run was very quiet, but the actual wear was high so noise doesn't seem to be a good indicator of actual wear, that's all.

 

[Hokiefyd]

Some of the engines that are most noted for piston slap are also some of the most longest-lasting engines out there. Examples: Ford Modulars, Chevy V-8s, Honda K-series, etc.

I don't know if you can correlate noise with wear, but you sure can't seem to correlate it with longevity. Many noisy engines last forever.

 

[bullwinkle]

I think it depends on WHAT is causing the noise-mechanical lifter valve trains and combustion noise (i.e. my '02 Ram Cummins H.O. which would RATTLE THE WINDOWS on a cold winter start!) don't necessarily mean a motor is going to explode tomorrow. A good example is my son's '98 Cherokee 4.0-makes a racket even with half 15W40 & half Maxlife 10W30, but will probably outlast the body.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
Some of the engines that are most noted for piston slap are also some of the most longest-lasting engines out there. Examples: Ford Modulars, Chevy V-8s, Honda K-series, etc.

I don't know if you can correlate noise with wear, but you sure can't seem to correlate it with longevity. Many noisy engines last forever.


I hear ya, but the noise I'm referring to metal contacting metal, ticking or tapping. IMO quiet is always better, within the recommended viscosity. Sure someone can toss LOS or gear oil into a knocking engines to silence it, but that's not what I'm referring to here. I've had friends with oil burning engines last 200K, and they ran pretty good, that doesn't mean the engine was in good shape though.

 

[mechtech2]

Noise means extra clearance [for bunches of reasons].

Wear could be one of many , but it does not mean extra wear over time.
It does not mean metal parts are in contact without any oil.

 

[blackandblue]

It just seemed (no way to prove it one way or the other) as though it was quieter and smoother on 0w30 vs the 5W-20 it has now...

I also can't shake the feeling that all these cars spec'd a Xw-20 would be better protected by Xw-30...

Does anybody know what exactly causes the Hyundai/KIA engine noise? I've heard suggestions it has to do with CVVT?

 

[tig1]

Some engines by design are very clackly but that doesn't have anything to do with the longivity of the engine.

 

[wolf_06]

try castrol gtx

 

[Izb]

Anti-friction modifier is the main reason of low noise.
Examples:
1. Oil with a lot of Moly (>=600 ppm) usually is very quit.
2. Xenum with 2000ppm of NB (http://www.xenum.be/en/start.asp?c=3&l=en )is very quet.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Noise means extra clearance [for bunches of reasons].
Wear could be one of many , but it does not mean extra wear over time.
It does not mean metal parts are in contact without any oil.


Agreed up to a point, because in the internals it generally takes TWO surfaces hitting to make noise. If it is excessive clearances it's not always good news...we have owned many piston slappers that have run way out to very high mileage.

But many of the Hyundais I've seen simply have injectors that are noisy as heck. This is just the side effect of ridiculously high pressure DI pumps and hardware.

I also recently drove a brand new 328 that sounded diesel like when first started!