Email back from Royal Purple regarding API cert

[Spawne32]

I was curious as to why Royal Purples oil only met the SL API certification standard so I emailed them regarding the subject. Just got the response, good info! Was wondering what you guys thought about the matter.

Good Evening Robert,

We have held most of our motor oils back from API SM (most RP SAE motor oils are API SL) because of the lower amount of anti-wear additive allowed in API SM/ILSAC GF-4 oils. The reason for the API/ILSAC mandate of lower anti-wear is that certain components of anti-wear additive were shown to cause premature degradation of catalytic converters. And, OEMs are now mandated by the EPA to warranty the emission system separately from the power train. Rudimentary experimentation showed certain anti-wear additives do in fact degrade catalytic converters; however, the anti-wear additive was applied directly to the core of the cats. If enough oil is consumed in the combustion chamber (i.e. through poor piston ring seal and/or leaking valve seals), there can be a degradation in cat life. This is not an issue with Royal Purple motor oils. The OEMs are willing to trade the longevity of the engine for a possibility of extending the life of the catalytic converters. They are pretty sure that the engine will make it through the warranty period, though. We do not agree with reducing anti-wear protection for the engine and our SL formulations have shown zero problems with emissions systems during over 3 years with field testing by the US Border Patrol.

The 0W-40 and 5W-40 viscosity grade oils were formulated primarily for the European car market and the XW-40 weight oils are not subject to the anti-wear restriction. API and ILSAC are only concerned with 'Energy Conserving' viscosities (0W-20, 0W-30, 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30).

One thing to keep in mind is that the API ratings represent formulation restrictions and performance minimums. Royal Purple API rated oils have always exceeded the API ratings. The API SM rating did force improvements in lesser quality oils, but merely restricted formulation concerning Royal Purple.

Thanks for inquiring about Royal Purple and have a great day!


Best Regards,

Christopher Barker
Tech Services
Royal Purple, Inc.
1 Royal Purple Ln.
Porter, TX 77365
281-354-8600

 

[DieselTech]

Yup high levels of zinc make it impossible to get SM. Much like redline royal purples Market really isn't ones dodge neon. Though you can use it without ill affects. The just wont get API on it

 

[4ever4d]

I think RP is a fantastic oil just can't justify price of it or any other synth. i don't buy into extended oci's,but always up for learning something new ,good info.

 

[buster]

Royal Purple has a nice starting Tbn too. (12)

 

[Audi Junkie]

BZZZZZT!

If HDEOs can make API SM, RP should be able to do it too, no excuses.

The problem isn't necessarily performance, rather the cost of tests would bite into profits on their $8/q oil. RP would rather spend money on stupid purple dye and dumb endorsements instead.

Their customers aren't likely to be looking for certs they don't understand anyway (present company excluded) and are likely to believe the spew about how modern specs actually hold RP back from making the best oil...that's why they are looking at purple coloured oil anyway.

It's quite comical.

 

[BobFout]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
BZZZZZT!

If HDEOs can make API SM, RP should be able to do it too, no excuses.

The problem isn't necessarily performance, rather the cost of tests would bite into profits on their $8/q oil. RP would rather spend money on stupid purple dye and dumb endorsements instead.

Their customers aren't likely to be looking for certs they don't understand anyway (present company excluded) and are likely to believe the spew about how modern specs actually hold RP back from making the best oil...that's why they are looking at purple coloured oil anyway.

It's quite comical.


HDEOs are not under the ILSAC boot like most sparker oils.

When Chris uses the word "SM" he really means "SM/GF-4".

It does also cost non-trivial (hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of dollars) amounts of money to re-cert their oils.

 

[NHHEMI]

Originally Posted By: Spawne32
I was curious as to why Royal Purples oil only met the SL API certification standard so I emailed them regarding the subject. Just got the response, good info! Was wondering what you guys thought about the matter.

Good Evening Robert,

We have held most of our motor oils back from API SM (most RP SAE motor oils are API SL) because of the lower amount of anti-wear additive allowed in API SM/ILSAC GF-4 oils. The reason for the API/ILSAC mandate of lower anti-wear is that certain components of anti-wear additive were shown to cause premature degradation of catalytic converters. And, OEMs are now mandated by the EPA to warranty the emission system separately from the power train. Rudimentary experimentation showed certain anti-wear additives do in fact degrade catalytic converters; however, the anti-wear additive was applied directly to the core of the cats. If enough oil is consumed in the combustion chamber (i.e. through poor piston ring seal and/or leaking valve seals), there can be a degradation in cat life. This is not an issue with Royal Purple motor oils. The OEMs are willing to trade the longevity of the engine for a possibility of extending the life of the catalytic converters. They are pretty sure that the engine will make it through the warranty period, though. We do not agree with reducing anti-wear protection for the engine and our SL formulations have shown zero problems with emissions systems during over 3 years with field testing by the US Border Patrol.

The 0W-40 and 5W-40 viscosity grade oils were formulated primarily for the European car market and the XW-40 weight oils are not subject to the anti-wear restriction. API and ILSAC are only concerned with 'Energy Conserving' viscosities (0W-20, 0W-30, 5W-20, 5W-30, 10W-30).

One thing to keep in mind is that the API ratings represent formulation restrictions and performance minimums. Royal Purple API rated oils have always exceeded the API ratings. The API SM rating did force improvements in lesser quality oils, but merely restricted formulation concerning Royal Purple.

Thanks for inquiring about Royal Purple and have a great day!


Best Regards,

Christopher Barker
Tech Services
Royal Purple, Inc.
1 Royal Purple Ln.
Porter, TX 77365
281-354-8600



While new to you this is not news to most of us. Thanks for sharing however.

 

[badtlc]

Since it hasn't been specifically stated, the Royal Purple Xw40 oils "are" API SM certified.

 

[znode]

Originally Posted By: BobFout

HDEOs are not under the ILSAC boot like most sparker oils.

When Chris uses the word "SM" he really means "SM/GF-4".


You can still get SM and at least meet all the other specs without getting the starburst. Every other company manages to get their thick-blended "high mileage" oils to do it without problem.

Originally Posted By: BobFout

It does also cost non-trivial (hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of dollars) amounts of money to re-cert their oils.


"Hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of dollars"?

Quote:
Fee— API Members $1,250
Fee— NonMembers $1,500
Additionally, an annual fee of $0.0020 per gallon of
licensed motor oil after the first million gallons of
production of licensed oil will be assessed.

 

[BobFout]

Originally Posted By: znode
Originally Posted By: BobFout

HDEOs are not under the ILSAC boot like most sparker oils.

When Chris uses the word "SM" he really means "SM/GF-4".


You can still get SM and at least meet all the other specs without getting the starburst. Every other company manages to get their thick-blended "high mileage" oils to do it without problem.

Originally Posted By: BobFout

It does also cost non-trivial (hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of dollars) amounts of money to re-cert their oils.


"Hundreds of thousands, maybe millions of dollars"?

Quote:
Fee— API Members $1,250
Fee— NonMembers $1,500
Additionally, an annual fee of $0.0020 per gallon of
licensed motor oil after the first million gallons of
production of licensed oil will be assessed.


So RP chooses not to decrease additive levels in their oil.

Those are license fees, not testing fees.

 

[Spawne32]

Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
BZZZZZT!

If HDEOs can make API SM, RP should be able to do it too, no excuses.

The problem isn't necessarily performance, rather the cost of tests would bite into profits on their $8/q oil. RP would rather spend money on stupid purple dye and dumb endorsements instead.

Their customers aren't likely to be looking for certs they don't understand anyway (present company excluded) and are likely to believe the spew about how modern specs actually hold RP back from making the best oil...that's why they are looking at purple coloured oil anyway.

It's quite comical.



After alot of discussion and research on it im actually glad they hold it back from the SM standard, rotella t only meets the CF standard for API cert as well, and everyone knows rotella t is good oil. Im pretty sure this has something to do with the higher levels of zinc present.

 

[buster]

Royal Purple and Redline do a lot of business with certain racing circles where higher levels of ZDP are often needed. ZDP also works very well, and is cost effective.

I'm pretty impressed with Royal Purple lately. Those cam lobes of the Mustangs looked a lot better with RP than M1. (Not a true scientific test, but eye opening on some level).

 

[BobFout]

Originally Posted By: Spawne32
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
BZZZZZT!

If HDEOs can make API SM, RP should be able to do it too, no excuses.

The problem isn't necessarily performance, rather the cost of tests would bite into profits on their $8/q oil. RP would rather spend money on stupid purple dye and dumb endorsements instead.

Their customers aren't likely to be looking for certs they don't understand anyway (present company excluded) and are likely to believe the spew about how modern specs actually hold RP back from making the best oil...that's why they are looking at purple coloured oil anyway.

It's quite comical.



After alot of discussion and research on it im actually glad they hold it back from the SM standard, rotella t only meets the CF standard for API cert as well, and everyone knows rotella t is good oil. Im pretty sure this has something to do with the higher levels of zinc present.


Rotella T (dino or synthetic) meets CJ-4. It is still SM though, but not GF-4.