Does it really even matter what oil?
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The 'best' has more to do with giving the best service than using the best oil. Just like changing oil too often yields no benefit, using an over-engineered and over-formulated oil has no benefit either.
Good oil, good oci, done.
I believe that most any car can run on most any oil. All we can do is optimize the process. I change visc grades for seasons and use the same brand oil for a few ocis, and move on.
Good oil, good oci, done.
I believe that most any car can run on most any oil. All we can do is optimize the process. I change visc grades for seasons and use the same brand oil for a few ocis, and move on.
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
The 'best' has more to do with giving the best service than using the best oil. Just like changing oil too often yields no benefit, using an over-engineered and over-formulated oil has no benefit either.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
"Over engineered" is not a bad thing. I would take that any day over "barely good enough".
The 'best' has more to do with giving the best service than using the best oil. Just like changing oil too often yields no benefit, using an over-engineered and over-formulated oil has no benefit either.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
"Over engineered" is not a bad thing. I would take that any day over "barely good enough".
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
The elevated wear metals in used oil analysis after the initial changeover doesn't correlate with actual engine wear.
Why does this keep having to be covered again, again, and again?
Forever. This is one of the reasons I took a break from this site. It seems like there's more new info from a non oil oriented car forum than this one. Sad.
The elevated wear metals in used oil analysis after the initial changeover doesn't correlate with actual engine wear.
Why does this keep having to be covered again, again, and again?
Forever. This is one of the reasons I took a break from this site. It seems like there's more new info from a non oil oriented car forum than this one. Sad.
The correct oil depends on the vehicle in question and the service it's used for. For most passenger cars used to go to work and back, and to the grocery store, I'd agree that oil really doesn't matter as long as it's name brand and meets current specs.
Now, for a sports car or turbocharged engine, or a vehicle that is truly subject to extreme operating parameters (temps below -20 always or above 110 always), or where extended drain intervals are necessary, then of course a higher quality oil will protect better.
Now, for a sports car or turbocharged engine, or a vehicle that is truly subject to extreme operating parameters (temps below -20 always or above 110 always), or where extended drain intervals are necessary, then of course a higher quality oil will protect better.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Coming from someone running Redline in a Honda, no, that's not a decision I "understand".
Last time I checked, Hondas run well on normal oil. So it's your position that takes some ~special~ understanding. That is, an understanding that goes beyond the combined efforts of Honda, API and the membership of this forum. Next you'll be telling us (again) how we are too poor to afford Redline.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Bzzt. Last time I opened up my 145k Honda engine it was SPOTLESS inside
Usually have a higher HTHS
Not needed, superfluous. About as important as dye or purfume in an oil. If I want a high HT/HS, I'll use 20w-50
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Longer than 10k? "Withstand" a longer oci with worn-out friction modifiers and other additives? Sorry, I like to change my oil every once ion a while anyway...cost is no object. If I want an extended drain oil, I'll get one certified as such
Usually have a better add pack
"better"? How? My Mom knows more about add packs than you do...well, she know enough to use an approved oil.
....but you know something everyone else doesn't.
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Coming from someone running Redline in a Honda, no, that's not a decision I "understand".
Last time I checked, Hondas run well on normal oil. So it's your position that takes some ~special~ understanding. That is, an understanding that goes beyond the combined efforts of Honda, API and the membership of this forum. Next you'll be telling us (again) how we are too poor to afford Redline.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Bzzt. Last time I opened up my 145k Honda engine it was SPOTLESS inside
Usually have a higher HTHS
Not needed, superfluous. About as important as dye or purfume in an oil. If I want a high HT/HS, I'll use 20w-50
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Longer than 10k? "Withstand" a longer oci with worn-out friction modifiers and other additives? Sorry, I like to change my oil every once ion a while anyway...cost is no object. If I want an extended drain oil, I'll get one certified as such
Usually have a better add pack
"better"? How? My Mom knows more about add packs than you do...well, she know enough to use an approved oil.
....but you know something everyone else doesn't.
It does matter which oil you use if you drive an Euro car, as those vehicles tend to have very specific oil requirements due to complex engine designs or emission systems. Not using a recommended or approved oil may result in damage in the long-run.
Also, if you have a vehicle that is notorious for engine problems (e.g. Toyota 1MZ-FE V6, GM 3.6, etc), then you need to be more conscious of what oil you use.
Also, if you have a vehicle that is notorious for engine problems (e.g. Toyota 1MZ-FE V6, GM 3.6, etc), then you need to be more conscious of what oil you use.
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Coming from someone running Redline in a Honda, no, that's not a decision I "understand".
Last time I checked, Hondas run well on normal oil. So it's your position that takes some ~special~ understanding. That is, an understanding that goes beyond the combined efforts of Honda, API and the membership of this forum. Next you'll be telling us (again) how we are too poor to afford Redline.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Bzzt. Last time I opened up my 145k Honda engine it was SPOTLESS inside
Usually have a higher HTHS
Not needed, superfluous. About as important as dye or purfume in an oil. If I want a high HT/HS, I'll use 20w-50
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Longer than 10k? "Withstand" a longer oci with worn-out friction modifiers and other additives? Sorry, I like to change my oil every once ion a while anyway...cost is no object. If I want an extended drain oil, I'll get one certified as such
Usually have a better add pack
"better"? How? My Mom knows more about add packs than you do...well, she know enough to use an approved oil.
....but you know something everyone else doesn't.
Everything you posted above was an opinion and a very bad one at that. I'm not going to bother. Everytime I get into a discussion with you and you get personal I get banned. But do yourself a favor and learn the difference in opinion and fact. You may want to update that signature.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
All meaningless nonsense.
Thank you for proving my point.
When you don't have the mental capacity to understand, of course it's meaningless nonsense....to you.
Thanks for proving my point.
Coming from someone running Redline in a Honda, no, that's not a decision I "understand".
Last time I checked, Hondas run well on normal oil. So it's your position that takes some ~special~ understanding. That is, an understanding that goes beyond the combined efforts of Honda, API and the membership of this forum. Next you'll be telling us (again) how we are too poor to afford Redline.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Bzzt. Last time I opened up my 145k Honda engine it was SPOTLESS inside
Usually have a higher HTHS
Not needed, superfluous. About as important as dye or purfume in an oil. If I want a high HT/HS, I'll use 20w-50
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Longer than 10k? "Withstand" a longer oci with worn-out friction modifiers and other additives? Sorry, I like to change my oil every once ion a while anyway...cost is no object. If I want an extended drain oil, I'll get one certified as such
Usually have a better add pack
"better"? How? My Mom knows more about add packs than you do...well, she know enough to use an approved oil.
....but you know something everyone else doesn't.
Everything you posted above was an opinion and a very bad one at that. I'm not going to bother. Everytime I get into a discussion with you and you get personal I get banned. But do yourself a favor and learn the difference in opinion and fact. You may want to update that signature.
I have what I consider to be a performance car. Do I use the best oil I can find? No. I use the best bang for the buck I can get. elevenBucks for a jug of motor craft semi synthetic. Good oil at a good price.
Can I throw a word in here?
I think BuickGN (like with a lot of rides, I wish I had bought one when they were only used Buicks) strives to use the best oil he can find, even in undemanding applications.
OTOH, Audi Junkie prefers to use an oil that will do well in an application given shortened drain intervals.
Both points have merit, and I think maybe you guys agree on more points than you disagree.
I am in the middle.
I use various oils, and I change every 4K on any dino, and 5K on anything labeled as synthetic, although I realize that the label covers a lot of ground, from Supertech to Redline, with plenty of botique oils in between.
Anyway, I think you both make valid points and have considerable experience.
You should both agree to disagree and not get into personal attacks.
I think BuickGN (like with a lot of rides, I wish I had bought one when they were only used Buicks) strives to use the best oil he can find, even in undemanding applications.
OTOH, Audi Junkie prefers to use an oil that will do well in an application given shortened drain intervals.
Both points have merit, and I think maybe you guys agree on more points than you disagree.
I am in the middle.
I use various oils, and I change every 4K on any dino, and 5K on anything labeled as synthetic, although I realize that the label covers a lot of ground, from Supertech to Redline, with plenty of botique oils in between.
Anyway, I think you both make valid points and have considerable experience.
You should both agree to disagree and not get into personal attacks.
Originally Posted By: The Critic
It does matter which oil you use if you drive an Euro car, as those vehicles tend to have very specific oil requirements due to complex engine designs or emission systems. Not using a recommended or approved oil may result in damage in the long-run.
Also, if you have a vehicle that is notorious for engine problems (e.g. Toyota 1MZ-FE V6, GM 3.6, etc), then you need to be more conscious of what oil you use.
Like the perfect Pennzoil Platinum used oil analysis I post from various Euro engines?
Wrong visc and not "approved", but...not Redline or Royal Purple either.
It does matter which oil you use if you drive an Euro car, as those vehicles tend to have very specific oil requirements due to complex engine designs or emission systems. Not using a recommended or approved oil may result in damage in the long-run.
Also, if you have a vehicle that is notorious for engine problems (e.g. Toyota 1MZ-FE V6, GM 3.6, etc), then you need to be more conscious of what oil you use.
Like the perfect Pennzoil Platinum used oil analysis I post from various Euro engines?
Wrong visc and not "approved", but...not Redline or Royal Purple either.
Do even the "approved" oils do well on the extended drains most of these engine manufacturers allow?
I have long thought that running some absurdly long OCI on an expensive car makes no sense.
A cheaper, but capable, oil changed more often has to be preferable.
If you can afford a new BMW or Benz as a daily driver, you should be able to afford to change the oil every 5-7K.
Even the average VW or Mini buyer shouldn't find that kind of change interval overly burdensome.
I have long thought that running some absurdly long OCI on an expensive car makes no sense.
A cheaper, but capable, oil changed more often has to be preferable.
If you can afford a new BMW or Benz as a daily driver, you should be able to afford to change the oil every 5-7K.
Even the average VW or Mini buyer shouldn't find that kind of change interval overly burdensome.
Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Can I throw a word in here?
I think BuickGN (like with a lot of rides, I wish I had bought one when they were only used Buicks) strives to use the best oil he can find, even in undemanding applications.
OTOH, Audi Junkie prefers to use an oil that will do well in an application given shortened drain intervals.
Both points have merit, and I think maybe you guys agree on more points than you disagree.
I am in the middle.
I use various oils, and I change every 4K on any conventional, and 5K on anything labeled as synthetic, although I realize that the label covers a lot of ground, from Supertech to Redline, with plenty of botique oils in between.
Anyway, I think you both make valid points and have considerable experience.
You should both agree to disagree and not get into personal attacks.
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Can I throw a word in here?
I think BuickGN (like with a lot of rides, I wish I had bought one when they were only used Buicks) strives to use the best oil he can find, even in undemanding applications.
OTOH, Audi Junkie prefers to use an oil that will do well in an application given shortened drain intervals.
Both points have merit, and I think maybe you guys agree on more points than you disagree.
I am in the middle.
I use various oils, and I change every 4K on any conventional, and 5K on anything labeled as synthetic, although I realize that the label covers a lot of ground, from Supertech to Redline, with plenty of botique oils in between.
Anyway, I think you both make valid points and have considerable experience.
You should both agree to disagree and not get into personal attacks.
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Originally Posted By: Kurtatron
Sorry if I incurred your impatience, but thank you regardless for answering my question. I will see increased wear metals in the oil transition, but this is not indicative of accelerated engine wear. Thank you.
You may see increased wear metals on the transition (depending on how "dirty" your engine is) on the first couple OCIs, but no it is not indicative of actual engine wear. It is indicative of oxidation layers/varnish/sludge/ring deposits being lifted off by the high ester content oil.
Sorry if I incurred your impatience, but thank you regardless for answering my question. I will see increased wear metals in the oil transition, but this is not indicative of accelerated engine wear. Thank you.
You may see increased wear metals on the transition (depending on how "dirty" your engine is) on the first couple OCIs, but no it is not indicative of actual engine wear. It is indicative of oxidation layers/varnish/sludge/ring deposits being lifted off by the high ester content oil.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Conventional oils at normal ocis keep engines perfectly clean-FACT
Usually have a higher HTHS
Conventional oils have EXACTLY the correct HT/HS speced by the mfg-FACT
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Conventional oil is what is specified for the mfg intervals, in fact many oil companies recommend against extending intervals with their synthetic products-FACT
Usually have a better add pack
You have no specific info on this, just SPECULATION and when I enquired from experts here on the subject, none could say there were any differences in the make-up of the add packs-FACT
Not much more coming from your end except personal attacks and speculation, along with some dumb automotive obsessiveness.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Thinking you need Redline oil in a Honda or 600hp for the street is the definition of ignorance
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Conventional oils at normal ocis keep engines perfectly clean-FACT
Usually have a higher HTHS
Conventional oils have EXACTLY the correct HT/HS speced by the mfg-FACT
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Conventional oil is what is specified for the mfg intervals, in fact many oil companies recommend against extending intervals with their synthetic products-FACT
Usually have a better add pack
You have no specific info on this, just SPECULATION and when I enquired from experts here on the subject, none could say there were any differences in the make-up of the add packs-FACT
Not much more coming from your end except personal attacks and speculation, along with some dumb automotive obsessiveness.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Thinking you need Redline oil in a Honda or 600hp for the street is the definition of ignorance
Originally Posted By: Audi Junkie
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Conventional oils at normal ocis keep engines perfectly clean-FACT
Usually have a higher HTHS
Conventional oils have EXACTLY the correct HT/HS speced by the mfg-FACT
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Conventional oil is what is specified for the mfg intervals, in fact many oil companies recommend against extending intervals with their synthetic products-FACT
Usually have a better add pack
You have no specific info on this, just SPECULATION and when I enquired from experts here on the subject, none could say there were any differences in the make-up of the add packs-FACT
Not much more coming from your end except personal attacks and speculation, along with some dumb automotive obsessiveness.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Thinking you need Redline oil in a Honda or 600hp for the street is the definition of ignorance
LOL! I do need 600hp for the street but coming from someone with a 17 second car I wouldn't expect you to get it. As to the rest, you really need to look up the definition of fact and opinion. There's just too much here for me to pick apart, I honestly don't have the time tonight. Thanks for the entertainment. Try harder next time.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You're pretty much right. The big issue is I don't care what other people run in their cars. I don't call people cheap for running whatever is on sale. On the other hand the cheap people love to talk smack about people who spend more money on oil. AJ is notorious for this, along with posting his opinions as facts.
You also don't see the 3,000 mile OCI people attacking the extended OCI people yet you see it go the other way around all the time.
I could just as easily talk down to people that spend $60 to have a quick lube install a conventional oil and a Fram filter which costs the same as my Redline and RP filter but I don't care what others do.
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
That's an opinion.
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Usually have a higher HTHS
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Usually have a better add pack
Better oils usually keep the engine cleaner.
Conventional oils at normal ocis keep engines perfectly clean-FACT
Usually have a higher HTHS
Conventional oils have EXACTLY the correct HT/HS speced by the mfg-FACT
Usually withstand a longer OCI
Conventional oil is what is specified for the mfg intervals, in fact many oil companies recommend against extending intervals with their synthetic products-FACT
Usually have a better add pack
You have no specific info on this, just SPECULATION and when I enquired from experts here on the subject, none could say there were any differences in the make-up of the add packs-FACT
Not much more coming from your end except personal attacks and speculation, along with some dumb automotive obsessiveness.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
These days I'm more amused than annoyed by certain peoples' ignorance.
Thinking you need Redline oil in a Honda or 600hp for the street is the definition of ignorance
LOL! I do need 600hp for the street but coming from someone with a 17 second car I wouldn't expect you to get it. As to the rest, you really need to look up the definition of fact and opinion. There's just too much here for me to pick apart, I honestly don't have the time tonight. Thanks for the entertainment. Try harder next time.
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