Does FP contain picric acid?

[bulwnkl]

Just wondering. I have the opportunity to try a fuel additive that has picric acid in it. Anyone know of any fuel additives using it?

 

[MolaKule]

Picric acid is highly oxidative, poisonous, etches copper, and is explosive.

 

[Pablo]

I'm thinking.

 

[VgRt6]

quote:

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Originally posted by MolaKule:
Picric acid is highly oxidative, poisonous, etches copper, and is explosive.

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It'll etch more than just copper! And boy does it pack a punch when it explodes. It was the highlight of the safety video that we were required to watch when starting grad school - a very small amount of dried PA took out a "pseudo" laboratory that had been set up in the desert (for the purpose of the video) and left a huge crater in the sand!

I don't see why it would be used in a fuel additive. Interesting question though.

Gary

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

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Originally posted by MolaKule:
Picric acid is highly oxidative...

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I think that may be why it's in this fuel additive. The limiting factor for internal combustion engine output is Oxygen. That's why nitrous oxide works so well

The MSDS lists this product as relatively benign.

--Eoin

 

[bulwnkl]

As a follow-up, what about iron picrate(sp?)? I know nothing of that compound.

 

[HardbodyLoyalist]

Hey VGRT6, I saw that video, too!

I loved it when then panned the camera back about 300 ft. before the explosion.

 

[luvs2drive]

Hmm, The Halifax Explosion in Nova Scotias Halifax Harbour was a horrible demonstration of its explosive capability. That french munitions ship was carrying 2,300 tons of the stuff.
Halifax harbour was temporarily emptied due to the explosion, and it could be heard hundreds of miles away.

 

[MolaKule]

quote:

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The MSDS lists this product as relatively benign.

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Concentrated form or highly diluted?

 

[Kestas]

It's benign because it is always shipped with 30% water. I'm sure that's what the MSDS reflects. It's harmless when mixed with water. That's the only dilution it sees.

Decades ago it was shipped with 10% water.

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

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Originally posted by MolaKule:

quote:

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The MSDS lists this product as relatively benign.

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Concentrated form or highly diluted?

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I have the MSDS at home, but it does not list water. It lists the picric acid concentration as a couple percent, IIRC. I'll check tonight and post again if I'm off.

 

[reyjay1]

why would the MSDS list water?
I mean it is Material Safety Data Sheet, so only has to list those ingredients not safe to humans.

 

[bulwnkl]

Well, water kills more people each year than other MSDS stuff. j/k

Anyway, the "Hazardous Ingredients" are:

Solvent Naphtha (Petroleum), Light Aromatic 83-87%
Normal Butanol 13-17%
Picric Acid Technical 2.2-2.5%

 

[cit1991]

Picric Acid is the active component of Primacord. I'd be worried about it throwing nitrate groups at high temperatures...then you'd wind up with nitric acid that your base reserve would have to take up.

Any idea why it would be in there?

 

[cit1991]

Iron picrate is the iron salt of picric acid. Picric acid is a strong acid. It's just like trinitro toluene (TNT), but instead of the methyl group from the toluene, there's an OH like from phenol. Phenol is already acidic. The 3 nitro groups in picric acid make that H very acidic.

Think of iron picrate as the product of the following reaction:

engine block + picric acid --> Iron picrate

 

[bulwnkl]

quote:

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Originally posted by cit1991:
Think of iron picrate as the product of the following reaction:

engine block + picric acid --> Iron picrate

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That was my first thought. You see, before I got the bottles & the MSDS, the fellow told me on the phone that iron picrate was doing the magic.
Then, when I saw the MSDS, I thought "Oh, the iron picrate is made when this stuff gets into my fuel tank/supply lines/block and starts chewing on them. The interesting thing is that according to the research on this stuff, there is a period of "uptake." It takes some number of tanksful before the stuff is supposed to start to work. Once you stop using it, a similar number of tanksful is supposedly needed before the effects wear off.
I'm fairly confused.