I had a Dodge Caravan work vehicle and 100k miles was still running great.
Of course highway miles are very easy on engine and transmission.
Of course highway miles are very easy on engine and transmission.
Dodge Quality?
- Thread starter mbacfp
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Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Buying with a warranty gives you some kind of reassurance. I will say, the absolute worst vehicle quality wise I've ever owned was my 2013 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was basically loaded, the limited Trailhawk model. I LOVED that thing, but it had more problems than every other vehicle I've owned combined. Sometimes I still regret getting rid of it, but I couldn't stand taking it in so often.
What kind of issues did you have with your 2013? My father's 2013 GC trailhawk has been pretty much flawless with the 5.7L V8. He has about 102k miles on it.
Some of the list of the major stuff... Sunroof leaking, dash squeak (never resolved, was told to use the radio...), driver seat motor failed twice, clunk in rear suspension (unresolved), weird screeching of rear brakes (unresolved), MDS that felt horrible, was told normal operation, and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Just to reiterate... I actually really loved that thing. Feature packed, a MONSTER in snow. The 4x4 system may have been the best I've ever used. But it just felt like keeping it too long would leave me with a turd that needed fixing far too often.
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Buying with a warranty gives you some kind of reassurance. I will say, the absolute worst vehicle quality wise I've ever owned was my 2013 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was basically loaded, the limited Trailhawk model. I LOVED that thing, but it had more problems than every other vehicle I've owned combined. Sometimes I still regret getting rid of it, but I couldn't stand taking it in so often.
What kind of issues did you have with your 2013? My father's 2013 GC trailhawk has been pretty much flawless with the 5.7L V8. He has about 102k miles on it.
Some of the list of the major stuff... Sunroof leaking, dash squeak (never resolved, was told to use the radio...), driver seat motor failed twice, clunk in rear suspension (unresolved), weird screeching of rear brakes (unresolved), MDS that felt horrible, was told normal operation, and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Just to reiterate... I actually really loved that thing. Feature packed, a MONSTER in snow. The 4x4 system may have been the best I've ever used. But it just felt like keeping it too long would leave me with a turd that needed fixing far too often.
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Buying with a warranty gives you some kind of reassurance. I will say, the absolute worst vehicle quality wise I've ever owned was my 2013 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was basically loaded, the limited Trailhawk model. I LOVED that thing, but it had more problems than every other vehicle I've owned combined. Sometimes I still regret getting rid of it, but I couldn't stand taking it in so often.
What kind of issues did you have with your 2013? My father's 2013 GC trailhawk has been pretty much flawless with the 5.7L V8. He has about 102k miles on it.
Some of the list of the major stuff... Sunroof leaking, dash squeak (never resolved, was told to use the radio...), driver seat motor failed twice, clunk in rear suspension (unresolved), weird screeching of rear brakes (unresolved), MDS that felt horrible, was told normal operation, and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Just to reiterate... I actually really loved that thing. Feature packed, a MONSTER in snow. The 4x4 system may have been the best I've ever used. But it just felt like keeping it too long would leave me with a turd that needed fixing far too often.
Yeah that doesn't sound good at all, I would've dumped it too. My dad dodged a bullet by getting one without a sunroof. He had to in order to fit in the thing without his head touching the ceiling. The MDS definitely sounds like a problem, since his is not noticeable at all besides the "eco" light on the dash.
Sounds like your dealer was giving you the run around too. We have two local Jeep dealerships. One is okay, not stellar, but just okay. The other one is awful, and nobody from my family will ever go there again for anything.
Originally Posted By: jeepman3071
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
Buying with a warranty gives you some kind of reassurance. I will say, the absolute worst vehicle quality wise I've ever owned was my 2013 Jeep Grand Cherokee. It was basically loaded, the limited Trailhawk model. I LOVED that thing, but it had more problems than every other vehicle I've owned combined. Sometimes I still regret getting rid of it, but I couldn't stand taking it in so often.
What kind of issues did you have with your 2013? My father's 2013 GC trailhawk has been pretty much flawless with the 5.7L V8. He has about 102k miles on it.
Some of the list of the major stuff... Sunroof leaking, dash squeak (never resolved, was told to use the radio...), driver seat motor failed twice, clunk in rear suspension (unresolved), weird screeching of rear brakes (unresolved), MDS that felt horrible, was told normal operation, and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Just to reiterate... I actually really loved that thing. Feature packed, a MONSTER in snow. The 4x4 system may have been the best I've ever used. But it just felt like keeping it too long would leave me with a turd that needed fixing far too often.
Yeah that doesn't sound good at all, I would've dumped it too. My dad dodged a bullet by getting one without a sunroof. He had to in order to fit in the thing without his head touching the ceiling. The MDS definitely sounds like a problem, since his is not noticeable at all besides the "eco" light on the dash.
Sounds like your dealer was giving you the run around too. We have two local Jeep dealerships. One is okay, not stellar, but just okay. The other one is awful, and nobody from my family will ever go there again for anything.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: HemiHawk
and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Not saying this WAS the case, but a possibility here was the oil pressure sensor for the VCT system. I had mine die on my '14 Charger SRT and it did similar things before eventually triggering a CEL. Had sort of a "surgy" feeling to it and performance was really varied. Was similar to when the CPS's started failing on my M5.
and the straw that broke the back was that the engine developed this lugging/chugging sound/feeling. It did it at idle, and was down on power while driving.
Not saying this WAS the case, but a possibility here was the oil pressure sensor for the VCT system. I had mine die on my '14 Charger SRT and it did similar things before eventually triggering a CEL. Had sort of a "surgy" feeling to it and performance was really varied. Was similar to when the CPS's started failing on my M5.
Not really staying within the parameters of your thread....but.....if I had enough money to buy a Hellcat (and it's an awesome machine), I think I would rather take my time looking and find an old muscle car classic from the 60's that's been completely restored. Those cars are getting more rare as time passes, and they are really something special versus a rather common newer hotrod.
I would honestly get a V6 Camry. A tad less power, but you will be praising it's reliability until the cows come home and then some. And if Hellcat can't take a curve, you will be pleasantly surprised that a Camry will take it with even less willingness and grace of the before mentioned cows.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
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Originally Posted By: KrisZ
I would honestly get a V6 Camry. A tad less power, but you will be praising it's reliability until the cows come home and then some. And if Hellcat can't take a curve, you will be pleasantly surprised that a Camry will take it with even less willingness and grace of a mule.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
You made me spit my drink out!
I would honestly get a V6 Camry. A tad less power, but you will be praising it's reliability until the cows come home and then some. And if Hellcat can't take a curve, you will be pleasantly surprised that a Camry will take it with even less willingness and grace of a mule.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
You made me spit my drink out!
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
I would honestly get a V6 Camry. A tad less power, but you will be praising it's reliability until the cows come home and then some. And if Hellcat can't take a curve, you will be pleasantly surprised that a Camry will take it with even less willingness and grace of a mule.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
You made me spit my drink out!
+1
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
I would honestly get a V6 Camry. A tad less power, but you will be praising it's reliability until the cows come home and then some. And if Hellcat can't take a curve, you will be pleasantly surprised that a Camry will take it with even less willingness and grace of a mule.
I'm really puzzled why more people don't cross shop Hellcats with Camrys lol.
You made me spit my drink out!
+1
Dodge doesn't even build a proper front wheel drive small or midsize car anymore.
Originally Posted By: Merkava_4
That Multi Cylinder Displacement that Dodge uses would be a deal breaker for me unless I was so desperate for the truck that I'd be willing to install an MDS delete kit as soon as I got the truck home. GM calls theirs Active Fuel Management but it does the same thing. There's a delete kit available for GM too.
Chrysler's system is good. I've known people who had issues w/GMs system. Have never known anyone with any issues w/Chrysler's.
That Multi Cylinder Displacement that Dodge uses would be a deal breaker for me unless I was so desperate for the truck that I'd be willing to install an MDS delete kit as soon as I got the truck home. GM calls theirs Active Fuel Management but it does the same thing. There's a delete kit available for GM too.
Chrysler's system is good. I've known people who had issues w/GMs system. Have never known anyone with any issues w/Chrysler's.
Originally Posted By: SatinSilver
Dodge doesn't even build a proper front wheel drive small or midsize car anymore.
Who cares? Keep driving Toyotas then.
Dodge doesn't even build a proper front wheel drive small or midsize car anymore.
Who cares? Keep driving Toyotas then.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Thanks for the pictures. Leaning towards Hellcat. Appreciate it.
You are quite welcome. I've never seen one in for warranty work. My SRT had an oil pressure sensor for the VCT fail, covered under warranty, took a few minutes for them to change. That was the only issue I had with that car during the time I owned it. The kitties are very well regarded and seem to be extremely reliable. My dealership has sold a ton of them and I've yet to hear a complaint. Though I'm not sure how you can complain about 707HP on tap with full warranty
I'm really impressed with how the interiors have improved since the old Dodge days where Fisher Price or Tupperware seemed to have a hand in the design and implementation. Everything is soft-touch now, the dash in my GC is leather, headliner is suede. They feel quite upscale, particularly for the price.
I agree - their interiors are very nice. So nice that I am shopping RAM trucks (Longhorn or Limited) because they have it all over GM and Ford interiors and the Nissan/Toyota interiors are utter garbage. I currently have a Denali truck and the new Denalis interior is too much plastic where the Dodge RAM is all soft touch and just pure luxury. My wife has a 2014 Grand Cherokee Overland - same thing - beautiful interior and the 3.6/8 speed trans is smooth as silk. Again, I am a GM guy (employee too) but OPEN minded unlike many on BITOG and I recognize a good vehicle when I see it regardless of maker.
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Thanks for the pictures. Leaning towards Hellcat. Appreciate it.
You are quite welcome. I've never seen one in for warranty work. My SRT had an oil pressure sensor for the VCT fail, covered under warranty, took a few minutes for them to change. That was the only issue I had with that car during the time I owned it. The kitties are very well regarded and seem to be extremely reliable. My dealership has sold a ton of them and I've yet to hear a complaint. Though I'm not sure how you can complain about 707HP on tap with full warranty
I'm really impressed with how the interiors have improved since the old Dodge days where Fisher Price or Tupperware seemed to have a hand in the design and implementation. Everything is soft-touch now, the dash in my GC is leather, headliner is suede. They feel quite upscale, particularly for the price.
I agree - their interiors are very nice. So nice that I am shopping RAM trucks (Longhorn or Limited) because they have it all over GM and Ford interiors and the Nissan/Toyota interiors are utter garbage. I currently have a Denali truck and the new Denalis interior is too much plastic where the Dodge RAM is all soft touch and just pure luxury. My wife has a 2014 Grand Cherokee Overland - same thing - beautiful interior and the 3.6/8 speed trans is smooth as silk. Again, I am a GM guy (employee too) but OPEN minded unlike many on BITOG and I recognize a good vehicle when I see it regardless of maker.
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Originally Posted By: GMBoy
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Thanks for the pictures. Leaning towards Hellcat. Appreciate it.
You are quite welcome. I've never seen one in for warranty work. My SRT had an oil pressure sensor for the VCT fail, covered under warranty, took a few minutes for them to change. That was the only issue I had with that car during the time I owned it. The kitties are very well regarded and seem to be extremely reliable. My dealership has sold a ton of them and I've yet to hear a complaint. Though I'm not sure how you can complain about 707HP on tap with full warranty
I'm really impressed with how the interiors have improved since the old Dodge days where Fisher Price or Tupperware seemed to have a hand in the design and implementation. Everything is soft-touch now, the dash in my GC is leather, headliner is suede. They feel quite upscale, particularly for the price.
I agree - their interiors are very nice. So nice that I am shopping RAM trucks (Longhorn or Limited) because they have it all over GM and Ford interiors and the Nissan/Toyota interiors are utter garbage. I currently have a Denali truck and the new Denalis interior is too much plastic where the Dodge RAM is all soft touch and just pure luxury. My wife has a 2014 Grand Cherokee Overland - same thing - beautiful interior and the 3.6/8 speed trans is smooth as silk. Again, I am a GM guy (employee too) but OPEN minded unlike many on BITOG and I recognize a good vehicle when I see it regardless of maker.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Thanks for the pictures. Leaning towards Hellcat. Appreciate it.
You are quite welcome. I've never seen one in for warranty work. My SRT had an oil pressure sensor for the VCT fail, covered under warranty, took a few minutes for them to change. That was the only issue I had with that car during the time I owned it. The kitties are very well regarded and seem to be extremely reliable. My dealership has sold a ton of them and I've yet to hear a complaint. Though I'm not sure how you can complain about 707HP on tap with full warranty
I'm really impressed with how the interiors have improved since the old Dodge days where Fisher Price or Tupperware seemed to have a hand in the design and implementation. Everything is soft-touch now, the dash in my GC is leather, headliner is suede. They feel quite upscale, particularly for the price.
I agree - their interiors are very nice. So nice that I am shopping RAM trucks (Longhorn or Limited) because they have it all over GM and Ford interiors and the Nissan/Toyota interiors are utter garbage. I currently have a Denali truck and the new Denalis interior is too much plastic where the Dodge RAM is all soft touch and just pure luxury. My wife has a 2014 Grand Cherokee Overland - same thing - beautiful interior and the 3.6/8 speed trans is smooth as silk. Again, I am a GM guy (employee too) but OPEN minded unlike many on BITOG and I recognize a good vehicle when I see it regardless of maker.
Originally Posted By: VNTS
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Our local Sheriffs love their squad Chargers, hate the Impalas and Exploreres, so go figure
I my neck of the woods the Leos love their V8 Chargers,V8 Caprices and V8 Tahoe's. There is not much love for the Explorer or Taurus.
Originally Posted By: Quattro Pete
Our local Sheriffs love their squad Chargers, hate the Impalas and Exploreres, so go figure
I my neck of the woods the Leos love their V8 Chargers,V8 Caprices and V8 Tahoe's. There is not much love for the Explorer or Taurus.
MY dad has a 2016 RAM 1500 with the 5.7 Hemi and 8 speed trans. I believe it has around 30-40K miles on it now with no issues.
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Huie83
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
The 5.7L HEMI only has one cam, it's a pushrod engine. My guess is that he has the 3.6L V6, which is DOHC and had the camshaft/head issue very early on.
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
The 5.7L HEMI only has one cam, it's a pushrod engine. My guess is that he has the 3.6L V6, which is DOHC and had the camshaft/head issue very early on.
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Huie83
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
The 5.7L HEMI only has one cam, it's a pushrod engine. My guess is that he has the 3.6L V6, which is DOHC and had the camshaft/head issue very early on.
Sorry just checked with him, you are correct, it chewed up the lobes on "the cam", not " a cam" like I stated. Improper heat treating or something like that is the cause. How wide spread this is I'm not sure.
Originally Posted By: Huie83
A guy on my team at work has a 2011 Jeep Grand Cherokee, also with the 5.7 Hemi. That thing has had lots of issues. From what I can recall it has had:
- The engine replaced @ 110K miles due to bad a bad cam in one head. I guess this is a well documented issue. $7K for a Mopar reman.
- Radiator and Trans cooler replaced. $1100
- Headlight bulbs burn out a lot. He said he's replaced them atleast 3 times now. I guess the front bumper, grill etc has to be slid out to a "service position" to get to bulbs as there is no space behind to get to them. $250 a service.
- Trans computer or some body module that was affecting the trans had to be replaced.$700
- the window switches in both front doors had to be replaced. $?
- Condenser and AC compressor replaced. $? I think he said it was like $1400.
Granted, the 2011 was a first model year and he takes it to the dealer so its a little more pricey, but that's kind of a lot for a 6 year old truck with 150K miles....
The 5.7L HEMI only has one cam, it's a pushrod engine. My guess is that he has the 3.6L V6, which is DOHC and had the camshaft/head issue very early on.
Sorry just checked with him, you are correct, it chewed up the lobes on "the cam", not " a cam" like I stated. Improper heat treating or something like that is the cause. How wide spread this is I'm not sure.
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OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: Huie83
Sorry just checked with him, you are correct, it chewed up the lobes on "the cam", not " a cam" like I stated. Improper heat treating or something like that is the cause. How wide spread this is I'm not sure.
Almost guarantee it was lifter failure, would have nothing to do with the hardness of the camshaft (this is a roller engine). But there have been issues with the rollers getting buggered up, flat-spotting and then destroying the lobe. There's actually a thread on it here somewhere.
Interesting side-note: As I mentioned in a previous thread about the issue, my local dealer has seen this issue a few times on the MDS 5.7L's, but they have never seen it on a 6.4L, despite both engines using the same parts. The key difference is the 6.4's spec'ing 0w-40.... Anecdotal of course, but still interesting.
Sorry just checked with him, you are correct, it chewed up the lobes on "the cam", not " a cam" like I stated. Improper heat treating or something like that is the cause. How wide spread this is I'm not sure.
Almost guarantee it was lifter failure, would have nothing to do with the hardness of the camshaft (this is a roller engine). But there have been issues with the rollers getting buggered up, flat-spotting and then destroying the lobe. There's actually a thread on it here somewhere.
Interesting side-note: As I mentioned in a previous thread about the issue, my local dealer has seen this issue a few times on the MDS 5.7L's, but they have never seen it on a 6.4L, despite both engines using the same parts. The key difference is the 6.4's spec'ing 0w-40.... Anecdotal of course, but still interesting.
Originally Posted By: mbacfp
Looking into getting either a Charger Hellcat, Mustang GT, or maybe Vette or Camaro. Is Dodge quality that much behind? Not planning on modding or racing it, etc. Right or wrong, GM bailout stuff in 08 kinda makes me rank them last...but I know if there is a better deal GM would be on the table. Appreciate any insights.
I looked at a Charger SRT before I bought my 2 Series; it was a great car and the I thought that the quality was top notch. I passed on it only because I preferred a smaller car. A couple of weeks ago I rented a new Charger R/T with @11K miles on it. The car was tight, rattle-free, and an absolute ball to drive. I would not hesitate to buy any of the cars that you are considering.
Looking into getting either a Charger Hellcat, Mustang GT, or maybe Vette or Camaro. Is Dodge quality that much behind? Not planning on modding or racing it, etc. Right or wrong, GM bailout stuff in 08 kinda makes me rank them last...but I know if there is a better deal GM would be on the table. Appreciate any insights.
I looked at a Charger SRT before I bought my 2 Series; it was a great car and the I thought that the quality was top notch. I passed on it only because I preferred a smaller car. A couple of weeks ago I rented a new Charger R/T with @11K miles on it. The car was tight, rattle-free, and an absolute ball to drive. I would not hesitate to buy any of the cars that you are considering.
Originally Posted By: dishdude
Speaking of Toyota, didn't they have a huge recall on oil hoses a few years ago? And that wasn't an engine producing 700+ HP.
Toyota has a lot more defects that any one of us on this board might think. Many are multi-generational, repeat offenses. Toyota knows that percpetion and influence are the most important things to get and maintain sales, therefore they damage-control and advertise harder than anyone else in the industry to the tune of several Billion (USD) dollars annually in PR and influencing alone, and a full 2 billion dollars last year exclusively targeting the US market. People that naturally seek out Toyota as "the superior product" simply do not know any better. No offense to anyone though.
Speaking of Toyota, didn't they have a huge recall on oil hoses a few years ago? And that wasn't an engine producing 700+ HP.
Toyota has a lot more defects that any one of us on this board might think. Many are multi-generational, repeat offenses. Toyota knows that percpetion and influence are the most important things to get and maintain sales, therefore they damage-control and advertise harder than anyone else in the industry to the tune of several Billion (USD) dollars annually in PR and influencing alone, and a full 2 billion dollars last year exclusively targeting the US market. People that naturally seek out Toyota as "the superior product" simply do not know any better. No offense to anyone though.
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