difference between E4/E7 and E9 oils

[bismillah]

https://www.mobil.com/en-it/commercial-vehicle-lube/pds/gl-xx-mobil-delvac-1-5w-40

https://www.mobil.com/en-it/commercial-vehicle-lube/pds/gl-xx-mobil-delvac-1-esp-5w-40

Hi everyone, what is the difference between these two oils?
One I see is ACEA E4 / E7 while the other is E9.

What is the difference between E4/E7 and E9 oils?

I understand this is a very technical question

 

[Greasymechtech]

Page 14

 

[bismillah]

very interesting document.
Up to E7 oils are recommended in engines WITHOUT particulate filters, while E9 is recommended WITH or without particulate filters.

Can an E9 oil be considered a substitute for an E7?

In an engine without a particulate filter, which uses E7 oil, it might be a good idea to use an E9 oil?

 

[Jetronic]

It can be, but when you make a switch like that it's prudent to check TBN if you have long drains. Afterall, you decreased TBN to start with.

 

[m37charlie]

E7 is somewhat similar to legacy CI4+. E9 is similar to CJ4 or CK4.
E4 is very rare in US. I was using Delvac 1 5W40 in my 05 Unimog U500 (NOT ESP, LE etc) but they stopped selling it in North America so I managed to find Delvac 1 SHC 5W40. TBN is 16, instead of 12 in the non SHC version.
So I drove from Anchorage to Halifax, Antwerp to Mongolia, and back, with a few detours. 25600 miles. ~8000 miles on 300ppm sulfur, ~1000 miles on 3000ppm Mongolian diesel. Consumption was 1L/2500 miles, sump 29.6L. Fe on drainage was 44ppm, TBN still very high at 11.5. Could have easily done 40000 miles.
The Mercedes spec 228.5 for my engine includes this oil.
E4s are good for super long OCI even on high sulfur fuels.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

very interesting document.
Up to E7 oils are recommended in engines WITHOUT particulate filters, while E9 is recommended WITH or without particulate filters.

Can an E9 oil be considered a substitute for an E7?

In an engine without a particulate filter, which uses E7 oil, it might be a good idea to use an E9 oil?

Every E9 oil I've seen also listed E7 on the bottle

E7 is somewhat similar to legacy CI4+. E9 is similar to CJ4 or CK4.
E4 is very rare in US. I was using Delvac 1 5W40 in my 05 Unimog U500 (NOT ESP, LE etc) but they stopped selling it in North America so I managed to find Delvac 1 SHC 5W40. TBN is 16, instead of 12 in the non SHC version.
So I drove from Anchorage to Halifax, Antwerp to Mongolia, and back, with a few detours. 25600 miles. ~8000 miles on 300ppm sulfur, ~1000 miles on 3000ppm Mongolian diesel. Consumption was 1L/2500 miles, sump 29.6L. Fe on drainage was 44ppm, TBN still very high at 11.5. Could have easily done 40000 miles.
The Mercedes spec 228.5 for my engine includes this oil.
E4s are good for super long OCI even on high sulfur fuels.

Can't you use E6 in place of E4?

Rotella T6 5w30 is E6

Chevron's Delo 5w30 is E6, E7, and E9

 

[m37charlie]

E6 is the low SAPS successor to E4. But only with ULSD. And even with ULSD, EGR forms HNO3 (more than without EGR) and eats at TBN.
The reason my TBN dropped 10000 miles. And no EGR. Sounds like a lot but only 0.23% fuel consumption, unchanged since new, Mercedes says Anyways, for my usage outside ULSD countries sometimes, E4 is best and allows very long trips without having to change oil anywhere except home. I have to drive 5200 miles each way to get to a seaport, for example.

 

[bismillah]

Thank you m37charlie for your answer and for your expertise (and also for making me dream with your Unimog). Where you use the Mobil 1 Devac 5W40 do you think that using the Mobil 1 Delvac ESP 5W40 would have any advantages? Would you do it, why yes and why not?
Thanks

 

[m37charlie]

ESP is fine if only for ultra low sulfur fuel. But if you anticipate higher sulfur then Delvac 1 5W40 or Delvac 1 SHC 5W40 is much better. I honestly think that I could get 100,000km out of SHC, considering 29.6L sump, fuel consumption 26-27L/100km, and oil consumption 1L/4000km. That’s 25L in 100,000km!!