Condensation in headlights?

[irv]

My Son's 2008 Malibu has some condensation in both headlights and although I have watched some Youtube vids on how to go about it, is there anything else I should be doing as far as not having to deal with this issue again?

Most vids show finding the spot where moisture/water is getting in then caulking/sealing that with weather proof silicone. I was thinking, before I watched the vids, that I'd separate the front lens from the back plastic housing, clean everything up really good then silicone them back together.

Is that overkill or should I stick with this plan?
These guys don't do that so maybe I should just stick with the easiest way?

 

[Nick1994]

I'd take them off and put them in the oven at the lowest heat setting for just a little bit to be sure any and all moisture is gone and glue the heck out of them.

 

[Timo325]

If you've had water inside of one for awhile, you'll see that cover can get dirty in the inside and occlude the light passing through. In that case, it may be better to do as you say and separate the two. Then you can clean everything, and put it back together.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by Nick1994
I'd take them off and put them in the oven at the lowest heat setting for just a little bit to be sure any and all moisture is gone and glue the heck out of them.


I'd likely end up ruining them if I did that, Nick. I think I'll stick with a hair dryer and just make sure all is dry on the inside and outside first before I start with any silicone.

Originally Posted by Timo325
If you've had water inside of one for awhile, you'll see that cover can get dirty in the inside and occlude the light passing through. In that case, it may be better to do as you say and separate the two. Then you can clean everything, and put it back together.


I agree but I am wondering how difficult it will be to line everything up without making a mess? If there are guide pins or something else like that that helps hold them true then I'll definitely go that route but I likely won't know for sure until I do seperate them.

Also, once they are put back together, it might be somewhat difficult to clamp/weight them due to their design? The roundness and lack of flat surfaces might be challenging?

 

[69GTX]

Caulk the heck out of them. But it still may not work.

I did that last year on a set of them in my 2002 Lincoln. There was 1/4 inch of standing water in the worst one.

After a couple hours and using the hair dryer to run them perfectly dry.....the next day they were fogged up again. And I did caulk the exterior the best I could going after every seam. Maybe taking them apart is the only way to get it all sealed up. Over the following several months there wasn't any standing water. But, they remained a bit foggy. So I did improve their condition.

 

[StevieC]

Scotty had a great video where he said what he usually does is drills a small hole in the bottom because water doesn't flow upward, and then the heat of the bulb being on will dry it out regularly and then the condensation problem goes away. Something to try.

I have always removed and closely inspected. Patched the lens with silicone and then cleaned the inside by sloshing around with some non-ammonia not-alcohol glass cleaner followed by a rinse of 1/2 vinegar 1/2 water and then dried it out with a heat gun or you could use a hair dryer.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by 69GTX
Caulk the heck out of them. But it still may not work.

I did that last year on a set of them in my 2002 Lincoln. There was 1/4 inch of standing water in the worst one.

After a couple hours and using the hair dryer to run them perfectly dry.....the next day they were fogged up again. And I did caulk the exterior the best I could going after every seam. Maybe taking them apart is the only way to get it all sealed up. Over the following several months there wasn't any standing water. But, they remained a bit foggy. So I did improve their condition.


I'm thinking that is likely the best way as well.
Seeing yours all fogged up again the next day must of been disheartening!
To take my son's headlights out, or to just change a bulb, on his Malibu, the whole front fascia/bumper has to come off just to get at them! (Vid below if interested?)

Originally Posted by StevieC
Scotty had a great video where he said what he usually does is drills a small hole in the bottom because water doesn't flow upward, and then the heat of the bulb being on will dry it out regularly and then the condensation problem goes away. Something to try.

I have always removed and closely inspected. Patched the lens with silicone and then cleaned the inside by sloshing around with some non-ammonia not-alcohol glass cleaner followed by a rinse of 1/2 vinegar 1/2 water and then dried it out with a heat gun or you could use a hair dryer.



Drilling a couple small holes makes sense but I would still be concerned (maybe needlessly?) that water would still somehow get up in them? I think, but could be wrong, if it did make things better why wouldn't manu's do this already?

Regardless, they have to come off and be resealed so hopefully once I have them apart and seeing what is all involved, hopefully just siliconing them really good does the trick?
I am hoping the 2, front and back, pieces mate into one another rather than just butting up to one another? If this is the case (which it should be I would think?) it shouldn't be too bad of a job once I have everything all torn apart.

 

[StevieC]

You could drill the back facing the engine compartment if you want. No water would make it in there but I think you would be fine with the bottom because of gravity.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by StevieC
You could drill the back facing the engine compartment if you want. No water would make it in there but I think you would be fine with the bottom because of gravity.


Once I have them off I'll check and see how much dirt/sand/grit and the like are on them as that will tell the story if water can get in there or not.

But, after thinking about this again, any new holes, imo, will allow condensation to enter them. If they are completely sealed, like they come from the factory, (which likely explains why no holes are drilled in them there) they should stay perfectly dry/moisture free on the inside.

The majority of vehicles I see, plus my own, don't have any moisture in them at all and neither have any holes drilled nor ways to allow water/moisture to get in.

I think, now that I think about it more, I will skip drilling new holes.
It just makes sense to me not to.

 

[SnowDrifter]

Don't use caulk or anything else that dries

Use butyl rubber
https://www.amazon.com/Second-Skin-Damplifier-Butyl-Rope/dp/B0155KELRW

Also check the seal around your bulbs. I like to put a dab of dielectric grease on the seal before installation

 

[dishdude]

Replacement is the only way to go, I'd use an aftermarket CAPA set.

 

[KneeGrinder]

30 years body shop exp. I have separated a few, many I tried and gave up on! I strongly suggest you do not attempt separating the lens from the housing. Very few can be done successfully. I never worked on domestic vehicles, so I have no experience with Malibu headlamps. The "tip" on drilling a hole is a good idea for evaporating the moistier out, but drill small enough holes so you can use a soldering iron to sort of "smear" seal the hole you drilled in the bottom of the headlamp. Drill holes in the black plastic part that will be easy to seal up with soldering iron. "Plastic Welding"


Most headlamps also have a small L or U shaped vent hose on the bottom of the lamp to help aid the drainage of small amounts of moistier, headlamps are not really completely sealed. you might check for the drain hose, but I don't know if the dealer sells them if they are not present on the headlamp. Goodluck!


As Snowdrift said, bulbs do, should have a gasket inbetween the lightbulb socket and the lamp housing, they would be loose without the gasket.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by KneeGrinder
30 years body shop exp. I have separated a few, many I tried and gave up on! I strongly suggest you do not attempt separating the lens from the housing. Very few can be done successfully. I never worked on domestic vehicles, so I have no experience with Malibu headlamps. The "tip" on drilling a hole is a good idea for evaporating the moisture out, but drill small enough holes so you can use a soldering iron to sort of "smear" seal the hole you drilled in the bottom of the headlamp. Drill holes in the black plastic part that will be easy to seal up with soldering iron. "Plastic Welding"


Most headlamps also have a small L or U shaped vent hose on the bottom of the lamp to help aid the drainage of small amounts of moisture, headlamps are not really completely sealed. you might check for the drain hose, but I don't know if the dealer sells them if they are not present on the headlamp. Goodluck!


As Snowdrift said, bulbs do, should have a gasket in between the light bulb socket and the lamp housing, they would be loose without the gasket.



Thanks for the advice everyone.

At this point, I think I will just remove them and then decide, after having a good look at them, what is the best way to tackle this?
I think drilling holes will worsen the problem? Like in the one vid I posted above, the water sticks to the lens, just like on my son's car. It doesn't always just drain out like we think it would.
I will check the vents that should already be there to make sure they are working properly, use a hair dryer to dry, then either apply some butyl tape or silicone depending on what path I choose?
I am not sure when I am going to be able to get around to this, but hopefully sometime within the next couple of weeks?

I will take pics of my progress and keep this post active with how I made out.

 

[StevieC]

Originally Posted by irv
Originally Posted by StevieC
You could drill the back facing the engine compartment if you want. No water would make it in there but I think you would be fine with the bottom because of gravity.


Once I have them off I'll check and see how much dirt/sand/grit and the like are on them as that will tell the story if water can get in there or not.

But, after thinking about this again, any new holes, imo, will allow condensation to enter them. If they are completely sealed, like they come from the factory, (which likely explains why no holes are drilled in them there) they should stay perfectly dry/moisture free on the inside.

The majority of vehicles I see, plus my own, don't have any moisture in them at all and neither have any holes drilled nor ways to allow water/moisture to get in.

I think, now that I think about it more, I will skip drilling new holes.
It just makes sense to me not to.



When the bulb is on and generating heat along with the hole it will create convection and dry out the bulb. It's because the moisture is seeping into the bulb because it's not fully sealed and it's condensing in there with no way to escape. Similar happens to windows that have broken seals. There are companies out there that put a small hole in the corner that is hardly noticeable and they will spray in an alcohol solution to evaporate the moisture in-between the panes of glass and then the problem never re-appears because of the vent (hole) they added that allows the space between the panes to vent back into the room and equalize the humidity. We did this to extend the life of the windows in the Condo buildings I was an assistance property manager for. We would replace the windows every 20 years but the seals might fail in year 10 or 15 sort of thing.

Up to you but just thought I would explain why this works.

 

[vavavroom]

Headlight housings are vented on the backside, usually near the top and bottom. Make sure the vents are not obstructed. Poor air circulation prevents evaporation and can easily result in internal condensation.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by vavavroom
Headlight housings are vented on the backside, usually near the top and bottom. Make sure the vents are not obstructed. Poor air circulation prevents evaporation and can easily result in internal condensation.


Rain again here tomorrow so hopefully I can get around to it on Thursday?

I will definitely be checking those vents out!

Thanks.

 

[Lubener]

That moisture will soon blow your lamps. Mine did not have vents. I have successfully solved condensation by drilling a VERY small hole in the bottom of the assembly. No need to replace.

 

[irv]

Originally Posted by Lubener
That moisture will soon blow your lamps. Mine did not have vents. I have successfully solved condensation by drilling a VERY small hole in the bottom of the assembly. No need to replace.


I am hoping to get at it tomorrow, hopefully?

I'll check the vents (if they have any, which I believe they do?) then decide about drilling anymore holes?

 

[irv]

I ended up getting at it tonight just before dark and managed to get them dried and siliconed up. Quite a bit of water was inside once I moved them around but about 1/2 hour to 45 minutes each, all were dry using a hair dryer and good to go for siliconing.

I looked and again, nothing was obvious where the water was getting in so I cleaned the top up real good where it joined to the backing and applied a decent amount of silicone.

I also looked good at the vents and both had cobwebs in them. I picked then blew them out with compressed air.

Thinking further about drilling holes? If I drill in the bottom of the backing plate the holes still won't go into where the lights and chrome reflective material is. Is there any point in just drilling holes into the grayish part of the backing plate or are you guys suggesting I drill right through to the area/space where the bulbs are located?

 

[SnowDrifter]

Originally Posted by KneeGrinder
30 years body shop exp. I have separated a few, many I tried and gave up on! I strongly suggest you do not attempt separating the lens from the housing. Very few can be done successfully. I never worked on domestic vehicles, so I have no experience with Malibu headlamps.


No kidding? I've never had an issue with getting headlights apart or going back together. Go around it with a heat gun, 3 flat objects, maybe a screwdriver to get it started but I've found butter knives work well - more surface area as to not gouge the mating surface.

Heat it up. More than you think, the housings can take a lot of heat - enough that I can no longer touch it without getting burned. 180 to 200 degree range by feel. I usually have to wear gloves when I work. Slowly pry it apart. Scrap the old goo out with a hot flatblade screwdriver, do whatever else ya need to do in there and start putting it back together.

Assembly goes like.. Roll the butyl into the proper thickness, apply it around the female part of the seam, overlapping the edges at the bottom of the housing. I lay it on a little on the thick side, any extra will ooze out anyway. Start putting in the screws, just enough to get them threaded, then get the light hot. Tighten down the screws the rest of the way, install the clips, then let it cool. Once at that point, I'll pop the bulb in with a layer of dielectric grease on both the connector and gasket.

Never had one leak. The oldest of which I did in 2012 and is still fine to this day