The turbo engine probably runs higher oil pressure. If that is the case, you need a higher bypass pressure setting filter, because the filter for the regular engine would end up bypassing more often at high rpm-s. BTW bypass is not impossibly rare. When the engine is cold, it is common for the bypass valve to open until the oil gets warm and flows freely. Even when the bypass opens, the oil is pretty clean, as it is kept filtered most of the time, so it is not a tragedy.
Compatible aftermarket Mazda Skyactiv Turbo filters?
- Thread starter crazy_raccoon
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Key to this is to keep the engine RPM down, which keeps the oil flow volume down and therefore the filter dP down, until the engine warms up pretty good.
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IIRC the STP S6607XL and Ecogard X4610 both pop up when you put the 2.5 Turbo engine into their respective filter finders. I have both in the stash for my CX-30 Turbo, but am using OEM for now.
The point I was making is that the bypass occasionally opening is not the end of the world. The oil is (normally) circulating, and any impurities the filter can catch get trapped in the filter. So the oil is kept clean. Impurities do not get generated at a significant enough rate so that they would make a big difference in the quality of lubrication when the bypass briefly opens, for example because the engine is pushed hard. We are only dealing with any (unfiltered) impurities that got generated since the oil has last run the circuit. I do not remember the exact, but all the oil in the engine runs through the filter in a matter of some tens of seconds. Now if it bypasses frequently, or constantly, that is a different matter.
The only worry is anything that's already been caught in the filter getting swept off the media, or swept out of the dome end if the filter is base up, and going through the bypass valve. There was a case here where a piece of glue broke off on the dirty side of the filter and got swept through the bypass valve and lodged in the engine (glue piece that matched broken off area in the filter found after engine tear down), causing engine damage. Rare case, but it can happed. Keep the revs low until the oil warms up helps keep the bypass valve closed.
So, at dealership yesterday. Considering a used Mazda for my son. Still haggling a bit...
Anyway, young guy at service counter and I asked him about this. He looked at me like I had 3 eyes on my forehead. Went and asked someone, who came out and told me the same thing about bypass spring pressure. I then asked why aftermarket filters spec same part number for both and he just shurgged his shoulders. Then said "In the South, shouldn't make much difference."
So, we're in South Carolina, I assume he meant weather is warm here.
So, yeah. I wasn't overly impressed, but he's probably not "wrong" per se....
I considered asking about the MM Act, but figured the three eyes on the forehead would start appearing again.......
EDIT: I may be wrong, but if you have a turbo and engine seizes and you have the wrong OEM or an aftermarket filter on your car......not sure what would happen, but I bet they initially deny warranty. My wife has a non turbo 2024 CX-5, so not an issue, but if it was a turbo, I would just use the OEM filter for the turbo. Not expensive, and not worth haggling about probably. Sticky wicket for sure.
Anyway, young guy at service counter and I asked him about this. He looked at me like I had 3 eyes on my forehead. Went and asked someone, who came out and told me the same thing about bypass spring pressure. I then asked why aftermarket filters spec same part number for both and he just shurgged his shoulders. Then said "In the South, shouldn't make much difference."
So, we're in South Carolina, I assume he meant weather is warm here.
So, yeah. I wasn't overly impressed, but he's probably not "wrong" per se....
I considered asking about the MM Act, but figured the three eyes on the forehead would start appearing again.......
EDIT: I may be wrong, but if you have a turbo and engine seizes and you have the wrong OEM or an aftermarket filter on your car......not sure what would happen, but I bet they initially deny warranty. My wife has a non turbo 2024 CX-5, so not an issue, but if it was a turbo, I would just use the OEM filter for the turbo. Not expensive, and not worth haggling about probably. Sticky wicket for sure.
Yes, if a dealership can show that the wrong OEM part, or an aftermarket non-OEM part was used and caused the failure, the MM warranty act will not save you. The MM warranty act only basically says that the dealership can't deny warranty on say when the windshield wiper motor burned out when you used an aftermarket oil filter that had nothing to do with the wiper motor failure.
But, if say it was the right aftermarket filter used that caused the failure and engine damage, then the dealer would still most likely deny warranty and send you to make a claim with the filter maker under their warranty.
I am thinking that the Turbo engines perhaps prefer a higher flow rate filter.
Flow rate is really a differential pressure chart (the pressure difference between the filter inlet and outlet, given at various gallon per minute flow rates, the lower the better). Flow rate and filtering performance are kind of "opposing" specs, the higher filtration filters tend to have worse flow rate ( higher resistanse) . The good news is, employing synthetic filter media tends to result in better flow rate, while still maintaining good filtering performance. I think what really matters is flow rate at engine operational temp.
When the oil is cold, the best strategy is taking it easy on the RPM, to minimize the inevitable bypass
.
I see no disadvantage in using a higher flow rate filter on an engine that does not demand this (other than cost). So this perhaps explains why an aftermarket filter manufacturer specs the same filter for turbo and non-turbo engines, it is likely that the filter is high flow rate, so works for both applications.
Flow rate is really a differential pressure chart (the pressure difference between the filter inlet and outlet, given at various gallon per minute flow rates, the lower the better). Flow rate and filtering performance are kind of "opposing" specs, the higher filtration filters tend to have worse flow rate ( higher resistanse) . The good news is, employing synthetic filter media tends to result in better flow rate, while still maintaining good filtering performance. I think what really matters is flow rate at engine operational temp.
When the oil is cold, the best strategy is taking it easy on the RPM, to minimize the inevitable bypass
. I see no disadvantage in using a higher flow rate filter on an engine that does not demand this (other than cost). So this perhaps explains why an aftermarket filter manufacturer specs the same filter for turbo and non-turbo engines, it is likely that the filter is high flow rate, so works for both applications.
I don't think that's how it would be interpreted.
They could spin it and say the aftermarket didn't design a filter correctly and cause problem. Honda used to have a different filter model for their Type R engine with higher flow rate. The aftermarket use a higher flow rate for ALL engines and never get a warning from Honda on that.
Looks like unless aftermarket change their part number application list and put a bigger filter for turbo model they will likely just put the blame on the aftermarket filter company or your mechanics.
Preface by saying it's been over a year since I posted the reply, but the topic of the "high flow" Mazda oem filter has come up since. Mazda can "spin it" (interpret it) any way they choose, and place blame wherever they choose. Doesn't change that 'if' they "require" that specific Mazda OEM 'high flow" oil filter only for use they have to pay for it under MM act.
I don't agree with your conclusion that the aftermarket has to change their filters. They only need to warranty the filter for the listed application and stand behind that warranty. You are correct though saying Mazda can place blame wherever, but the burden of proof is on them.
Lastly, this except from post #11 (1/28/23) sums up "my" feelings. on the topic of the Mazda 'high flow" filter....
"And anecdotally in this thread we have a member successfully using an aftermarket XG7317 in place of the Mazda OEM. Also, "if" I'm reading the same member's response correctly, appears to be claiming with possible exception of coo, both Mazda OEM filters are the same......
..... I'd now add what at end of my reply in that link....."Personally, count 'me' as skeptical about the "high flow" oil filter. 'To me' reads like something to get owners to buy the specific Mazda OEM oil filter only."
Saying that someone is "successfully using" a filter does not mean much. Someone put on an aftermarket filter on an engine, and no immediate horrible outcome was observed. For example: the filter operating in bypass mode most of the time may not be immediately apparent. Accelerated engine wear may occur over some time period, but this would not be necessarily easily observed.
It may be reasonable for a manufacturer to make / recommend a low flow resistance
filter for a particular engine that requires such. I agree, the maker recommending their own branded filter could be self-serving . But, when an auto maker issues a technical bulletin, I would tend to take that more seriously. Esp. when they say : We designed a new filter for this engine, use this instead of our "old" filter.
It may be reasonable for a manufacturer to make / recommend a low flow resistance
filter for a particular engine that requires such. I agree, the maker recommending their own branded filter could be self-serving . But, when an auto maker issues a technical bulletin, I would tend to take that more seriously. Esp. when they say : We designed a new filter for this engine, use this instead of our "old" filter.