Changing pads on fixed caliper system.

[bigjl]

Not sure if my terminology is correct.

But put some new pads on the Taxi yesterday along with a new Bosch fuel filter and an oil and filter change.

I run one set of discs a year and two sets of pads.

Has Mintex discs on there and had Mintex or Ferodo pads, replaced with decent quality German made Pagid pads.

Most cars that is have owned have the calipers were you rotate the caliper to get the pads out, usually single or twin piston calipers.

The Taxi has four piston calipers where the pads are held in places with anti rattle type clips with slide pins.

I have now realised that I should have been more worried when I lost the tool is used to push back the pistons in these type of calipers!

These are old school heavy duty van calipers these days in the UK!

I have now ordered the £30 tool from Sealey to do these pads the next time, as it took me two hours to push the pistons back with the wrong tools.

One good thing was the fuel filter was fitted properly, twisted on hand tight and could be removed the same way, new Bosch one was very slightly smaller in diameter.

Changed the oil for Mobil 1, 5 litres of 0w40 New Life now marked up as SN, SM rather than the previous stuff I bought being only SM, not sure what the differences are if any, and just under a litre of leftover Castrol Edge 5w40 A3/B3/B4/C3 oil.

Remembered to get a sample of the outgoing Maxlife Diesel 10w40 which had just under 9k on it.

I now have two samples ready to go to Blackstone.
This one and the one I took from the Pathfinder a few months ago.

Going to run this about 7.5k and then change it out with UOA.

 

[The_Jeff]

Got any pictures of this taxi?

 

[GMBoy]

If all you had to do was push the calipers in (not turn them) then A simple large C-clamp pressing on an old pad pushed the pistons back for me with no trouble at all. Those must be some big brakes but still - you could just open a bleeder and the pushing would be very easy as it expels the fluid out the bleeder.

Done hundreds of brake jobs and never came across your issue.

 

[Propflux01]

Originally Posted By: GMBoy
If all you had to do was push the calipers in (not turn them) then A simple large C-clamp pressing on an old pad pushed the pistons back for me with no trouble at all. Those must be some big brakes but still - you could just open a bleeder and the pushing would be very easy as it expels the fluid out the bleeder.

Done hundreds of brake jobs and never came across your issue.


+1

 

[yonyon]

Originally Posted By: GMBoy
If all you had to do was push the calipers in (not turn them) then A simple large C-clamp pressing on an old pad pushed the pistons back for me with no trouble at all. Those must be some big brakes but still - you could just open a bleeder and the pushing would be very easy as it expels the fluid out the bleeder.

Done hundreds of brake jobs and never came across your issue.


The c-clamp works well for most floating calipers. Using a c-clamp on many fixed calipers can be a bit more work. Perhaps this is a fixed caliper application.

Do they make four-piston floating calipers?

I'm too cheap to buy a proper tool for fixed calipers myself (if they were readily available for under $2.50 I'd buy one) so I just use two 30 degree angle prybars.

 

[bigjl]

Yes as per the title it is a fixed caliper system.

The tool I needed was the Disc Brake Piston Spreader AK711.

As I did indeed have a C clamp, this is what I use on my other vehicles.

But due to not being able to easily swing out the caliper I opted to use the c clamp.

I had to use the old pads as there is no room on this application at least not with the basic c clamp that I had to hand.

The big pain was the fact that four piston calipers are pretty rare these days, the pistons are actually not that big diameter wise, about an inch and a half say.

The issue isn't pushing back the pistons due to trying to do it by hand, but by lack of access to do it.

If I had the basic spreader type tool I mentioned this would have been. Ten minute job!

I believe the braking system is Lockheed so pretty old school!

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: GMBoy
If all you had to do was push the calipers in (not turn them) then A simple large C-clamp pressing on an old pad pushed the pistons back for me with no trouble at all. Those must be some big brakes but still - you could just open a bleeder and the pushing would be very easy as it expels the fluid out the bleeder.

Done hundreds of brake jobs and never came across your issue.


How many of them on a London Taxi without the Workshop Manual?


I have also done loads of brake jobs and you know what?

I never came across this problem before either, otherwise I would have the piston spreader tool in my toolkit already wouldn't I?

At least now the pads have a good amount of cooper grease applied as these pads looked to have been out in dry as a bone.

I will not being doing the next brake job on the Taxi as it is going to be discs and pads and the discs are the same as the some Ford Transit vans and the discs sometimes need to be removed with a puller.

I should have taken some pictures, not my forte, as I think the old school big is better approach to the engineering in these Taxis would interest Bitogers.

The wheel nut wrench that comes with it is two foot long!

The wheel nuts are like something off a truck!

Should have measured them but probably 22/24 mm.

I think once you figure these vehicles out they are a nice easy vehicle to maintain as they are a working vehicle through and through. And therefore designed to be fixed and made to last rather than thrown away.

I am not a big one on pictures but it is currently liveried up advertising an American company that makes nail polish.

Ellie.

The livery should be on www.ubiquitoustaxis.com

Will get some pictures next time it is around.

 

[GMBoy]

So you didn't have a manual to brush up on before starting the work nor the proper tool. Yeah, that can make for a rough job.

 

[bigjl]

Indeed it can.

Hence the thread.

Difficult to get manuals for a vehicle made in such small quantities.

But let's be honest I never expected a simple pad swap to be such a pain.

Not to mention the fact that the only way to get the the oil filter out is to remove the airbox and its flexible pipes and the steering wheel to steering box link.

Yup, the London Taxi might be an icon but not really the easiest vehicle to work on.

 

[SteveSRT8]

I would have expected it to be much easier.

My car has 4 piston fixed calipers on every wheel and I can pad slap it without even taking the calipers off, simply pop the clips and pull the pads right out!

Absolutely the easiest ever in my 40 plus years of turning wrenches.

 

[bigjl]

Issue wasn't getting the pads out.

Just pushing the back.

As I have said I was caught out a little.

Never had any problems doing the rears on my Mondeo and that caliper includes the handbrake so you have to turn the piston as you push it back.

For those that have worked on such old school vehicles the calipers were made by AP Lockhead.

I couldn't remove the caliper either due to the size of the bolts holding them on, I think they were 22mm but only have one socket that size as they are rare on modern European vehicles.

The vehicle does weigh the best part of two tonnes so I can see why everything is heavy duty.

But the engineering on this is really nice and heavy duty.

I suppose I will just have to get that new multi drawer tool chest I saw in the Sealey catalogue!

And then fill it up!

 

[bdcardinal]

This is what I use on the Mustang and Volvo Brembo fixed calipers.

 

[Kestas]

I've always found some way of pushing the pads back - even with four piston systems. I just did it last week. With the pads in place you can grab an ear of the pad backing and pinch it back against the caliper. Or you can wedge something between the pad and rotor to push the pistons back.

Otherwise it sounds like you need to beef up your toolbox and get the right socket or buy the spreader tool. 10 years into wrenching I realized I needed GOOD tools and bought myself a nice 300-pc Craftsman tool kit, which provided a good basis to build on.

 

[bigjl]

Originally Posted By: bdcardinal
This is what I use on the Mustang and Volvo Brembo fixed calipers.

Now that is the tool for the job!

Wife is already on side as far as buying some more tools goes!

So I shall probably go for one of the Sealey kits that comes with tools.

Several to choose from anywhere from £300 to £600 with 200/300 tools of various kinds.

Also have my eye on a really nice 2 tonne trolley jack at Costco for just over £100. Similar ones are nearly £200 in Sealey or MachineMart.

Seems a shame to waste an opportunity to buy some new tools with permission from the boss.

 

[bigjl]

Your dead right there.

Start off with a decent sized all round tool kit then add the more Gucci stuff as and when needed.

I wish I hadn't sold the tools I bought when I ran the garage many years ago, even though I was the workshop manager I used to get stuff from the Snap-On and Mac Tools vans that did weekly payments.

I think they still do this but only for garage employees.

Snap-On and Mac made some really good tools!

 

[GMBoy]

Originally Posted By: bigjl
Indeed it can.

Hence the thread.

Difficult to get manuals for a vehicle made in such small quantities.

But let's be honest I never expected a simple pad swap to be such a pain.

Not to mention the fact that the only way to get the the oil filter out is to remove the airbox and its flexible pipes and the steering wheel to steering box link.

Yup, the London Taxi might be an icon but not really the easiest vehicle to work on.


It sounds no different than some other projects I've done where they turned out to be one of those 30min jobs turned into a whole day, LOL! Well, atleast you got it done and learned from it. Please do post pics of those London Taxis I know a lot of us here are very curious and interested.

Cheers!

 

[bigjl]

I certainly shall.

Though London seems to heading the same way as NewYork with the imminent release of the Nissan NV200 London Taxi, different to the NY or other versions due to the Conditions of Fitness for London including the legendary turning circle.

So that Taxis are able to swing round in one to at a Central London Hotel in one go!

The company that makes them recently got mugged by Geely in what seems to have been a "long game" idea to purchase the company for next to nothing?

I think NY will miss the Crown Vic, but hopefully the iconic London Taxi will survive.

 

[The_Jeff]

Originally Posted By: bigjl

Not to mention the fact that the only way to get the the oil filter out is to remove the airbox and its flexible pipes and the steering wheel to steering box link.


Well that's ridiculous! Who made your engine? I'm reading renault, puegot, and nissan all got a turn one time or another.

Sounds like an opportunity to run some hose and put in a remote oil filter kit.

 

[bigjl]

The engine in there now is a VM 2.5 commonrail turbo diesel.

The bay is not a good shape though hence why there can be space issues.

The Fairway which was based on the older FX4 model both looked similar, and were in production till '97.

Then came the first "modern" design with the more rounded noddy car look which was the TX1, this had the same 2.7 Nissan engine as the Fairway.

In about '01 the TX2 came out with a 2.4 turbo Diesel engine from a Ford Transit but that was a pig and not suited to use with a autobox. If you have ever been to London you might have heard one making a noise on tickover, the so called death rattle!

The TX2 was very similar to the TX1 externally.

Then in '06 the TX4 came out.

It actually has a Chrysler gearbox in it, a four speed auto.

And the about mentioned VM engine.

However as the London Taxi Co has limited financial resources due to a limited and shrinking market the basic design and dimensions underneath are almost identical.

The amazing turning circle pushes the inner wings inwards slightly, this steals the room under the engine bay.

This is one reason I have looked into the Amsoil bypass filter kit, but I may have to settle for just a remote filter setup, if I move it from its current position to a small space on the in the inner wing below the airbox it will not only be much easier to access, but I think there will be added cooling benefits as it will get some cooling air hitting it!

A double win.


Peugeot and Renault have never supplied engines for London Taxis though.

Prior to the Fairway there were various Austin engines and I think a Perkins diesel at one point.

If it wasn't for the EU the Nissan engine would probably still be used though, it was a lowly stressed engine capable of huge mileages, most 15 yr old Fairways coming of the run this year after hitting the new 15 yr age limit are on the origin engine!

It was not unusual to find 20 yr old Fairways with the original engine.

One bloke that works in one of the fleet garages for over ten years only had the head off one Nissan engine and it was due to the driver running it for a half a shift with almost no water!

The only time they used to break was if neglected and run low on oil for many, many miles.

Sadly it was only a Euro 1 emission engine, the TX2 was Euro 2 but with an emissions kit they both were classed as Euro 3.

The TX4 was always Euro 4, the latest TX4's are Euro 5 and are are now fitted with a DPF.

If you think about it Europe and the EU are responsible for almost killing off the traditional London Taxi!

Funnily enough Mercedes brought out a competitor about four years ago which is a Vito van conversion with a trick back axle that allows it to meet Conditions of Fitness for London, Re the turning circle.

It hasn't been the sales success they expected in London.

The Germans are key players in the EU. Mercedes is large German company.

If LTC are gone they will have the entire Taxi market in London till the new Nissan NV200 arrives this year.

Talk about a good conspiracy theory!