Change-Flush transmission fluid at 120k

So if you had an engine that was overdue on the oil change, you would change one quart at a time?

There is no complaint about issues, so how do we know that any crud has built up? that we should be worried about loosening up? At 120k all the material may well be held in suspension at this time—this trans likely has a rock catcher, drop the pan to see if there is debris, but I think nothing will be seen.

I’ve watched a few videos of trans teardowns, and outside of carnage, I’m not sure I have seen anything other than dirty fluid? not piles of deposits lurking in corners, waiting to come loose.

Yet on car engines we’ve all seen plenty of sludge, yet no one thinks twice about full oil changes and aggressive cleaners. I get it, different applications with different parts, but I don’t see the need to be careful. Those clutches are wear items and any failure after atf change I suspect is more related to old fluid than new.
There are no clutches or frictive debris in an engine. I get your point on fresh fluid, but it’s best to be careful. Can you change all of it out? Sure. But just like has been discussed numerous times in the HPL EC threads, if you’re going whole-hog to change the fluid and correct past maintenance failures you’re going to need to shorten OCI/FCI to get the “leftovers” out. That’s why I personally think the partial-fluid changes are the smallest shock to the system when talking about long-neglected transmissions.

The real fix is to do reasonable maintenance on time; roughly 30-50k trans fluid changes. Then there’s no issues changing the entire fluid volume at once. 👍🏻
 
So if you had an engine that was overdue on the oil change, you would change one quart at a time?

There is no complaint about issues, so how do we know that any crud has built up? that we should be worried about loosening up? At 120k all the material may well be held in suspension at this time—this trans likely has a rock catcher, drop the pan to see if there is debris, but I think nothing will be seen.

I’ve watched a few videos of trans teardowns, and outside of carnage, I’m not sure I have seen anything other than dirty fluid? not piles of deposits lurking in corners, waiting to come loose.

Yet on car engines we’ve all seen plenty of sludge, yet no one thinks twice about full oil changes and aggressive cleaners. I get it, different applications with different parts, but I don’t see the need to be careful. Those clutches are wear items and any failure after atf change I suspect is more related to old fluid than new.
The particulate in old trans fluid can actually aid in preventing slipping as things age. And transmission fluids aren’t exposed to combustion gases, fuel, oxidation etc like engine oil. It’s apples to oranges really.
 
I try to do my fluids on it, but my Tundra was bought used with 73k on the clock, zero changes. Back then everyone griped about how WS changed color fast, so it must be crap... so I did a full flush, and it quickly was nice and red (I also decided to risk it with Maxlife). IIRC it was still nice and red with I did the job 50k or whatever later, still got a nice full flush.

My Camry, that had 140k on it, with who knows what kind of driving, was very dark. Dex III? No idea, but it was dark, and looked even worse as I drained it. Full flush. I waited too long, did something like 20k before doing another full flush--I saw quite a bit of dark / black material coming out, I presume clutch material being held in suspension, getting "cleaned up" by the new ATF. It's rather nice clean now, shifts good and hard at 5k rpm (probably shouldn't be doing that!), with only a cold start issue (have to wait for it to pump up, probably an o-ring given out), but at almost 250k maybe any failure is indistinguishable from wear&tear?

As to particulates preventing slippage, I don't buy that. Ford used to play with the fiction modifiers for shift quality (maybe all of them did), so garbage in suspension is going to... play with shift quality. Anything in suspension is going to find itself sandwiched between those clutches and metal plates. A D&F means you have reduced what is in suspension by some percentage, a percentage much less than 100% (to be fair, a full flush isn't 100% either, as there are piles of nooks and crannies for old ATF to sit in). Engine bearing surfaces are always (?) separated by motor oil, transmission clutches, I want to say get that oil squeezed out by what they do, as it's intentionally locked together by friction: and each time they shift, some amount of slipping occurs while the oil (and suspended garbage) is being pressed out.

And if garbage in suspension was helping it shift... as you do D&F's the transmission is going to start slipping, and quickly fail. Might as well hasten inevitable I say, and save on the cost of good ATF going down the drain. :)

*

Of course, I advocate one thing, others advocate another. I'm sure a careful search of the archives will show a great deal of people doing both, and both having good results. I'll bet, dollars to doughnuts, in many cases and very likely in this case too, either method will result in the same exact outcome: a transmission with fresh fluid and proper operation. That's my opinion in the matter.
 
if it slips with fresh fluid you needed new clutches anyway. i opened up an old Mitsubishi transmission recently and it had a bit of brown-grey film in the pan, i don't know when it was changed last. the goop wasn't magnetic and It wasn't slippery even though it was saturated with oil. i could see how removing the magic goop could cause slip if you don't got clutches left. i think the goop is old clutch material. trans shifts the same before and after the drain and fill. there wasn't much stuff on the magnets and the old fluid wasn't burnt, just dirty.
 
In my last car my repair shop said they couldn’t do it.
I’ll ask about this car.
My money says they're going to tell you they "can't" do it. Probably have to find a handy friend or a mobile mechanic that will do it for you.
 
It’s not a hard job for a DIYer and YouTube can help greatly.
I understand the living arrangements and not having the facility to do it.
However I hate paying a dealer 3x-4x what it would cost me to do it myself.
 
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