Castrol Edge EP 5w30 2016 Ford F-150 3.5 EcoBoost

[SubieRubyRoo]

How did you get a hold of so much data? Something you have access to through your job? I'm looking forward to it, whenever you get around to it.

Yes, it's a side perk of my job. I'm just leveraging the data for my personal interest, since I'm heavily involved with statistics but can color outside the lines some on my personal time. Since it's a side note, I hope to have everything charted and done by Labor Day. I'm thinking I may just stick everything in a PDF to make it easier for the board to peruse.

 

[kschachn]

Well, I can't claim all the credit. I'm going to organize all the data, separate the obvious outliers or ones that noted engine failures, and then leverage the power of JMP 15 to help identify with a 95%CI (may re-run at 99% to see if this changes anything) whether or not there are any differences in the "wear" metals and also the typical things a UOA is actually intended for, and possibly stratify into mileage windows. Then, I'll re-run with every single sample including known engine failures and then statistically test the two groups against each other ("good" vs. all).

The tricky thing may be simplifying the charts enough to make them understandable to the laypeople on here.

Yeah but "wear metals" in a spectrographic analysis are influenced far more by engine design and operating conditions than the oil. In the real world outside of a laboratory nobody, ever controls variables to an extent to isolate one isolated measurement. One must be careful not to spend copious amounts of time carefully analyzing flawed data.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Yeah but "wear metals" in a spectrographic analysis are influenced far more by engine design and operating conditions than the oil. In the real world outside of a laboratory nobody, ever controls variables to an extent to isolate one isolated measurement. One must be careful not to spend copious amounts of time carefully analyzing flawed data.

Yes, I know... that's why I put it in quotes. I know UOAs aren't an accurate tool to assess true wear, and (WAG here) probably half or more of the "wear" metals are due to the oil itself, and the remainder due to engine design. Since I'm only assessing the Ford 3.5EB, we can assume the engine design factor will remain constant, and if I have a majority of the oil brands available, the data should be able to identify any trends specific to the given oil brand (like the old wives' tale that Mobil shows higher iron "wear") independent of major uncontrolled variables. After I get the main analysis worked out in my head, I'm happy to share it and see if there are any improvements to be made, so that, at least for this engine, we can hopefully make some real insights into the trends. Thanks for your input!

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Starting a new thread in the UOA section for the 900+ sample, 5M+ mile data set I've got together. Stay tuned!

 

[EcoB00ST]

I do have a full-size truck with a Twin Turbo GDI motor and I agree the OP's report looks really good, and agree on the 30wts not staying in grade very well. I overshot my intended 6k OCI by a bit, and while viscosity is a little low, I'm not really concerned. Plus, the OCI before this was the initial purchase, and I have no clue how it was maintained prior. I'll likely do my UOAs once per year just to keep a check on things. I just turned 45k yesterday. My first UOA on the truck from last August is below. Falls right in line with universal averages, and I had a fairly hot E30 tune and lots and lots of boosting on this OCI. While I've mellowed out some on driving habits, it's still driven fairly hard and I may step to the Castrol 0W40 A3/B4 for summer this year. Just for reference I saw around 13.8psi on the stock tune and as high as 21.9psi on the E30 5StarTuning tune. No other mods besides the SB intake, and it ran a ~10.6 0-100 on video so it's definitely not shabby!

Sorry for the harsh wording. Got a little overexcited for no reason. While everyone is free to test as they wish (and I've certainly done my fair share!) I just don't want noobs to think they have to drop basically a double OCI cost every time when spec oil will protect just fine.

I hear you. That sounds like a solid tune. I'm going to tune mine when the extended warranty is over, which is in a few months. Do you have any recommendations on tunes for the first gen Eco that I have? I had elevated silicon too but I believe it was from when the oil pan was changed just before this OCI.

I was also thinking of going Castrol 0w40 or PP Euro L 5w30 for summers. I have seen solid UOA's for the Castrol 0w40. Haven't seen any for the PP Euro 5w30 in this motor. With the shearing this motor does, I think it can benefit from the higher HTHS. What oil were you running in that UOA you attached?

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

I hear you. That sounds like a solid tune. I'm going to tune mine when the extended warranty is over, which is in a few months. Do you have any recommendations on tunes for the first gen Eco that I have? I had elevated silicon too but I believe it was from when the oil pan was changed just before this OCI.

I was also thinking of going Castrol 0w40 or PP Euro L 5w30 for summers. I have seen solid UOA's for the Castrol 0w40. Haven't seen any for the PP Euro 5w30 in this motor. With the shearing this motor does, I think it can benefit from the higher HTHS. What oil were you running in that UOA you attached?

I haven’t used the Euro L or Castrol yet; I have about 50qts of the Euro 0W-40 (not the SRT version) that I’ll probably use, with a 5-6k bogey. The oil in that UOA was Ravenol DXG, I used a bunch of free Amazon gift cards. My last fill of DXG is in the sump right now for what was on the shelf.

As far as tunes go, I don’t have any 1st Gen experience, but 5 Star is solid with good tech support, and I know Brew City Boost has had a lot of press. Just realize that the magic of the 2nd Gen is the port injectors; there is so much inherent fueling capability when running ethanol mixes that’s missing on 1G. Heck, the 2.7 can run a straight E85 tune on factory equipment, where the 3.5 is limited to about E30 on the factory in-tank and HP pumps. If I want to go to E50, it takes an in-tank pump upgrade, and E85 requires HP pump as well.

However, going from E30 to E85 would pick up well over 100HP, but cost nearly $2k in fuel pumps. For now, I’m content with roughly 500whp. I’ve got the AMS inlet tubes ready to go, and will likely add the CVF Titan 2 intercooler, turbo adapters, and a mid-pipe as money allows. Really, you should seriously consider an intercooler upgrade on 1G, because while not a big HP producer, it will definitely help keep the engine happier in the heat and is never a bad upgrade on any boosted engine.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

So much for the DXG fill, dealer errantly did an OCI for me today during recall work when it was supposed to be done on my '20 Transit Connect tomorrow. 800-mile DXG and 16k+ Fram Ultra filter lost to dealer error. I'll keep working on the huge Oil Chart data to get my mind off of it...

 

[EcoB00ST]

I haven’t used the Euro L or Castrol yet; I have about 50qts of the Euro 0W-40 (not the SRT version) that I’ll probably use, with a 5-6k bogey. The oil in that UOA was Ravenol DXG, I used a bunch of free Amazon gift cards. My last fill of DXG is in the sump right now for what was on the shelf.

As far as tunes go, I don’t have any 1st Gen experience, but 5 Star is solid with good tech support, and I know Brew City Boost has had a lot of press. Just realize that the magic of the 2nd Gen is the port injectors; there is so much inherent fueling capability when running ethanol mixes that’s missing on 1G. Heck, the 2.7 can run a straight E85 tune on factory equipment, where the 3.5 is limited to about E30 on the factory in-tank and HP pumps. If I want to go to E50, it takes an in-tank pump upgrade, and E85 requires HP pump as well.

However, going from E30 to E85 would pick up well over 100HP, but cost nearly $2k in fuel pumps. For now, I’m content with roughly 500whp. I’ve got the AMS inlet tubes ready to go, and will likely add the CVF Titan 2 intercooler, turbo adapters, and a mid-pipe as money allows. Really, you should seriously consider an intercooler upgrade on 1G, because while not a big HP producer, it will definitely help keep the engine happier in the heat and is never a bad upgrade on any boosted engine.

Any recommendations on mid-tier intercooler upgrades for 1G?

 

[EcoB00ST]

So much for the DXG fill, dealer errantly did an OCI for me today during recall work when it was supposed to be done on my '20 Transit Connect tomorrow. 800-mile DXG and 16k+ Fram Ultra filter lost to dealer error. I'll keep working on the huge Oil Chart data to get my mind off of it...

That's so frustrating. They've done that to me before.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Did you look at CVF? I don’t know offhand if they make one for 1G, but the one for 2G is only $600. It definitely takes the cake for bang for the buck, and their 2nd iteration that’s even bigger is only $150 more.

 

[EcoB00ST]

Did you look at CVF? I don’t know offhand if they make one for 1G, but the one for 2G is only $600. It definitely takes the cake for bang for the buck, and their 2nd iteration that’s even bigger is only $150 more.

No I haven't. That's good to know. Thank you for sharing. I'm going to start seriously shopping for the right tune probably closer to the end of the year.

 

[DAVIDO49]

View attachment 80289First UOA on my F-150 and I’m pleased with the results. About 80/20 city/highway. I work 4 miles from home. Mostly short trips, some off roading, and a little bit of towing about 6.5k lbs. I didn’t expect wear numbers this low, even for the short-ish 5k run.

The additives referenced was Chevron Techron in the fuel added every other tank or so. Typically fill with Shell 87 octane and occasional 93 for the V-power cleaning additives. I have a JLT catch can, otherwise bone stock motor. Edge EP 5w30 SP was used. no make up oil as it doesn’t use any. Motorcraft oil filter.

I think the silicon was residual from an oil pan change under warranty due to slight seepage about 5k miles before this oci. It didn’t seem to cause any excess wear like other high silicon numbers caused by filtration issues.

The EB definitely sheared it down to a 20 weight but from all the UOA’s I’ve looked at these motors don’t seem to mind the oil at the 20 wt. I’ve never seen that cause any excess wear in other UOAs. The original 3.5 EB motors were spec’d for 5w20 so I think that’s what helps it tolerate the shearing as it’s not technically far out of spec of what the clearances were designed for.

Great results. Keep it up. You'll have that truck 15yrs easy if you want. We run a few newer F150s w/ Gen2 DI/port inj TGDI & love em. Always well maintained. Thats key w/TGDI design. Have a '20 Ranger too . Gen2- 2.3L TGDI. Great powertrain w/ 10R80 (from F150) ..Dana axles etc. Stout smaller truck. Daily drive it. It's a blast. Use Penn Ultra Platinum 95% of time. 5k mi OCI. Maybe 6k on occasion.. in bigger 3.5L V6 F150s. Motorcraft filters in the F150s & Boss or M1 in Ranger.

 

[DAVIDO49]

Amsoil SS 5w30 is in there now, next up is the new Valvoline Extended Protection 5w30 cause I like the high moly and their focus on wear protection. Seems like a similar formula to the new Maxlife that has a nice dose of moly and seems to do well in terms of wear metals here. Then either PPUP or PP Euro 5w30, really curious to see how a Euro 5w30 does in this application. Just seems like everything about it would be a good match for this motor that shears down 30 wts but I guess we'll see. Then maybe one summer I'd like to try Castrol 0w40.

Got great results in our newer gen2 TGDI F150s w/ PUP. UOAs so good after 2 i did i don't change oil "variety" anymore. These TGDI engines never burn oil either. That would drive me nuts! If I changed oil brands prob be Mobil1 EP. Though PUP been great as I've mentioned in other posts. Learned bout PP & PUP on here a long time ago!

 

[DAVIDO49]

View attachment 80289First UOA on my F-150 and I’m pleased with the results. About 80/20 city/highway. I work 4 miles from home. Mostly short trips, some off roading, and a little bit of towing about 6.5k lbs. I didn’t expect wear numbers this low, even for the short-ish 5k run.

The additives referenced was Chevron Techron in the fuel added every other tank or so. Typically fill with Shell 87 octane and occasional 93 for the V-power cleaning additives. I have a JLT catch can, otherwise bone stock motor. Edge EP 5w30 SP was used. no make up oil as it doesn’t use any. Motorcraft oil filter.

I think the silicon was residual from an oil pan change under warranty due to slight seepage about 5k miles before this oci. It didn’t seem to cause any excess wear like other high silicon numbers caused by filtration issues.

The EB definitely sheared it down to a 20 weight but from all the UOA’s I’ve looked at these motors don’t seem to mind the oil at the 20 wt. I’ve never seen that cause any excess wear in other UOAs. The original 3.5 EB motors were spec’d for 5w20 so I think that’s what helps it tolerate the shearing as it’s not technically far out of spec of what the clearances were designed for.

Def the best & most proven TGDI motor designs out there! That's my opinion as an engineer of 28yrs.

 

[EcoB00ST]

Great report, not that they tell much. I would not go "trying" different oils unless this on is doing something
that bother you like excessive noise or below ave fuel mileage. Never found it good to be changing brands and formulations endlessly. The Valvoline should do well as the amsoil will do well. I would extend the oci at least and additional 1500-2000 miles. Good show .

Very true. I think it's just the curiosity. Valvoline UOA is posted on another thread. I rushed the Amsoil change and forgot to grab a sample, what a fail. Valvoline EP didn't impress me in this application. Small sample size, I know. Here come the statistics police. But you know what I mean.