Thats my point, these oils are used in long drain applications in europe and have been for years. No reason they couldn't do it here. On this site several have claimed that the processed GPIII oils are almost as good as PAO anyway, so there should not be an issue. Plus a lot of companies claim GPIII to be synthetic, I think Castrol gets a bad rap because they were the first.
Castrol Edge base oil
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Originally Posted By: Jason8691
Thats my point, these oils are used in long drain applications in europe and have been for years. No reason they couldn't do it here. On this site several have claimed that the processed GPIII oils are almost as good as PAO anyway, so there should not be an issue. Plus a lot of companies claim GPIII to be synthetic, I think Castrol gets a bad rap because they were the first.
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
Thats my point, these oils are used in long drain applications in europe and have been for years. No reason they couldn't do it here. On this site several have claimed that the processed GPIII oils are almost as good as PAO anyway, so there should not be an issue. Plus a lot of companies claim GPIII to be synthetic, I think Castrol gets a bad rap because they were the first.
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
Originally Posted By: brian12
It seems kind of funny that none of the other group III synthetics claim long drain intervals. Maybe the 15-20% PAO is enough though.
Castrol Edge does.
Truth is, most of the brand name OTC "full synthetics" aren't just group III either, most contain at least some group IV or V from what I've read.
In the end, it's the add pack that determines the oil's suitability for extended drains. Most of the group III synthetics that don't make extended drain claims have TBN values in the 8s. Edge has a higher TBN like M1EP.
It seems kind of funny that none of the other group III synthetics claim long drain intervals. Maybe the 15-20% PAO is enough though.
Castrol Edge does.
In the end, it's the add pack that determines the oil's suitability for extended drains. Most of the group III synthetics that don't make extended drain claims have TBN values in the 8s. Edge has a higher TBN like M1EP.
Exactly!(almost) It is not the base oil that determines extended drain interval, it is the formulation. The challenge is develping an extended drain oil that meets the low SAPs requirements of ILSAC GF4. That means you are not going to see great TBN numbers but TBN retention should be improved(this could be some of that P retention capability that is being pushed in GF5, Less ZDDP but it stays active longer and does not volatize. There may be other ways of buffering the other additives to time release them. This is not a question of more additives, it is a question of better additives.
Originally Posted By: Bryanccfshr
Originally Posted By: StevieC
Thanks for posting... I believed you, I just wanted to see it.
I guess it is primarily a GRP-III, I don't like Castrol. They make a decent oil but I always hated their marketing so I try not to put money in their pockets. I also find them way over priced for the product.
You can get Pennzoil YB which IMO is a better oil (not looking to start a war), at a much cheaper price.
Is Grp III not capable of long OCI's with a good additive package? Just curious.
It is, just not as long an oil that has more PAO or POE content IMO.
Originally Posted By: StevieC
Thanks for posting... I believed you, I just wanted to see it.
I guess it is primarily a GRP-III, I don't like Castrol. They make a decent oil but I always hated their marketing so I try not to put money in their pockets. I also find them way over priced for the product.
You can get Pennzoil YB which IMO is a better oil (not looking to start a war), at a much cheaper price.
Is Grp III not capable of long OCI's with a good additive package? Just curious.
It is, just not as long an oil that has more PAO or POE content IMO.
PAO is used more as an additive among the store bought brands. Mobil 1 has the highest % of PAO among all retail oils, some being 100% PAO/V. Many Group III's as mentioned are of similar quality to certain PAO's. But as others said, a lot of it is the additives. Long drain additives. Amsoil's top of the line oils are all PAO based.
Originally Posted By: yannis
Originally Posted By: brian12
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
It can , shell ,aral, most elf's are group III and are called synthetics.
From what I've read on this board, several times, the courts ruled that a group 3 could not be listed as synthetic in europe. Maybe that only applies to certain countries though.
Originally Posted By: brian12
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
It can , shell ,aral, most elf's are group III and are called synthetics.
From what I've read on this board, several times, the courts ruled that a group 3 could not be listed as synthetic in europe. Maybe that only applies to certain countries though.
Originally Posted By: brian12
Originally Posted By: yannis
Originally Posted By: brian12
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
It can , shell ,aral, most elf's are group III and are called synthetics.
From what I've read on this board, several times, the courts ruled that a group 3 could not be listed as synthetic in europe. Maybe that only applies to certain countries though.
Well put it this way. Regardless of what they can or cannot be called, does the N. American Edge meet the same specs as Euro Edge? I don't think so.
N. American brew.
Euro brew.
Originally Posted By: yannis
Originally Posted By: brian12
A group 3 oil cannot be called a synthetic in europe. I'm not really sure what your getting at here.
It can , shell ,aral, most elf's are group III and are called synthetics.
From what I've read on this board, several times, the courts ruled that a group 3 could not be listed as synthetic in europe. Maybe that only applies to certain countries though.
Well put it this way. Regardless of what they can or cannot be called, does the N. American Edge meet the same specs as Euro Edge? I don't think so.
N. American brew.
Euro brew.
Edge 0W40 and 10W60 are PAO.
I don't think that you will find any current, fully-formulated oil that will be greater than about 80% PAO.
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