Can't find UOA results for the Corvette LS7 engine

[BuickGN]

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
Originally Posted By: ProStreetCamaro

So wrong in so many ways im not even going to get into it with you. Just look at the LSX engines. Case closed.


I owned a Firehawk so I am familiar. The LSX motors are outdated and have dismal specific output numbers. Even the hand built LS7's specific output numbers barely match those of an every day accord or camry. Yes they make it up with displacement, but that's just a crutch for lack of R&D.

People can put the blinders on and argue how great American engineering is. But the bottom line is that all three American car companies are a breath away from folding. There is probably an excellent reason for that fact.


I'm sure the Corvette owner that puts 20 buslengths on you in the 1/4 will be [censored] because your car has a higher specific output. lol

One day you will learn that as engines go up in displacement, things like friction and weight mean the specific output goes down but overall output, the one that counts, goes up. My TL's 3.2L V6 only makes 258hp and even less torque with it's 11:1 compression and OHC setup.

If only my car could match the specific output of your car.....Oh wait, it makes twice the specific output as yours.... and it's nearly twice as big. Nearly 4 times the power, 6 times the torque with a small pushrod V6 hmmm.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: ProStreetCamaro
Here is what I have to say about OHC engines. If they were so [censored] great then why are the ford versions (4.6 and 5.4) absolute TURDS? Sure ford got some power out of them but they had to use a roots blower to do it. They make no bottom end power when they are N/A and thats why they are dogs off the line compared to a GM pushrod engine. The LSX head design is simply amazing. Most people dont even know they are 18 degree cylinder heads. Exactly like the 18 degree heads found on nascar engines.


I can answer that one

1. The 2V heads are awful. The flow just slightly better than the old GT40 iron heads.

2. The engines were bore-size limited because of an engineering fubar.

When the engine was first designed, it was HEAVILY based on the old 427 SOHC. Hence the deep-skirted block and multi-bolt main caps. It also had a 4" bore.

Well, some moron bean counter decided that if they wanted to make a FWD V8 car, that it would not be worth it to engineer another engine and forced the engineers to revise the engine to fit in an FWD configuration. This involved making the engine shorter and reducing the bore size.

The engine was then also cheapened in other ways, such as the [censored] forged cracked-powder rods.

One simply has to look at the engine this design was based on (the 427SOHC) and it's power output (657HP) to see the potential this engine had.

3. Ford HAS managed to make good power out of the 4V configuration. Unfortunately, the engine was only put in a limited production (2000 Cobra-R) car in North America.

The Aussies have this engine readily available in the Falcon!!!!!

The Cobra-R engine made 425HP (Ford rated it at 385, but it made that at the tires in NUMEROUS dyno tests), which is 78.7HP/L. The LS7 makes 72HP/L.

4. And while Ford took the "lazy" route with the '03/'04 Cobra (the blower), one cannot overlook the fact that those engines will handle 1,000RWHP in stock trim. They had Manley forged H-beam rods, forged pistons, forged crank.....etc.

Some porting on the Termi heads yields 320CFM at .500 lift; those engines had the POTENTIAL to make some VERY good power numbers on motor alone. As I said, Ford was lazy.

5. Hurricane (now BOSS) which was supposed to debut at the end of this year in the F-150 is the original design of the mod motor. IF it comes out, it should give a good idea of what the mod motors were supposed to be. Though it sounds like we may never see that engine in the Mustang.

6. Off the line power is relative to gearing and displacement. Most OHC engines need to rev to make power. This is due to displacement for the most part. The old Windsor 302 only made 225HP. But it made 300lb-ft of torque at a very low RPM point. Peak HP occurred at 4,500RPM. With an H/C/I swap on my stock 302, it made 325HP on motor, but it didn't make that power figure until almost 6,000RPM. This is because it's displacement-limited. A good example of this is the people that stroke a 302 to 347ci. They have much better street manners because it brings back the low-end torque they lost when they increased airflow capacity of the top-end. With my new cam, chip and MAF setup, I should be ~425HP on motor. With a 7,000RPM power range. As the power goes up, since the displacement is the same, so does the RPM required.

Remember, the mod motors are SMALL (except the V10). 281 and 330ci respectively. The 4.6L is giving up 21ci to it's old Windsor brother, has better flowing heads and intake, and thus, is going to have to rev higher to make power. And it DOES make more power; 260HP in the 2V trim, 300HP in the 3V trim. Not great numbers, but better than the old 302 did.

This is why slapping a set of 4.10's in a mod-motor car REALLY wakes them up; they can get into their power band much quicker.

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: BuickGN
The LSx powered cars are just amazing. What exactly makes a DOHC motor better when the LS series with their cathedral style heads are flowing more air while still maintaining good velocity, have a broad flat torque curve, get better mileage, and fit in a smaller package? Yet some people still can't get past the fact that they use pushrods.


Yes, just like our 'duh driving, GM bashing 'pal' a few posts above^^^^^!!

 

[dailydriver]

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
I owned a Firehawk so I am familiar. The LSX motors are outdated and have dismal specific output numbers. Even the hand built LS7's specific output numbers barely match those of an every day accord or camry. Yes they make it up with displacement, but that's just a crutch for lack of R&D.


Oh boy, here we go with the ricetarded 'hp/liter' arguements. :no-no:

This s*** has started soooo many riceboy WARS over on ls1tech.com that it is unfathomable!!!

Funny how that 'low tech, outdated,under-engineered' "crutch" as you call it outperforms ALL of your precious imports and gets better fuel mileage at the same time, huh?

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
But the bottom line is that all three American car companies are a breath away from folding.


And you (and your fellow import nameplate militants) could not be any more overjoyed/thrilled, or ecstatic about that, right??

Of course it has nothing at all to do with legacy costs (that your Nippon Giants NEVER had to face!!), trade imbalances, dumping by your precious import companies, currency manipulation, etc., etc., right??
Yup, it must be those sub 50 I.Q. dumbazz engineers and their blasted, ancient (OHCs/4 valves per cylinder were around before pushrods/OHV), "outdated" pushrods/OHVs.

 

[aquariuscsm]

Here`s a killer run from my car`s big brother (man I with I had a
TT!!!!!!!!)

http://videos.streetfire.net/video/300ZX-with-4000-stall-dragstrip--10-sec-outside_4480.htm

As much as I love my Z,nothing sounds more bad as* than a souped up American made V8!!!!!!!!

 

[aquariuscsm]

Im my dream garage there sits:

A twin turbo Z32
A 3000GT VR4
An `87 Buick GNX
A `67 Camaro modded to the hilt!

Unfortunately that will probably never become a reality :^(

 

[ProStreetCamaro]

Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Im my dream garage there sits:

A twin turbo Z32
A 3000GT VR4
An `87 Buick GNX
A `67 Camaro modded to the hilt!

Unfortunately that will probably never become a reality :^(



My dream car only I want mine in candy apple red over gold metallic base.

 

[BuickGN]

Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
I owned a Firehawk so I am familiar. The LSX motors are outdated and have dismal specific output numbers. Even the hand built LS7's specific output numbers barely match those of an every day accord or camry. Yes they make it up with displacement, but that's just a crutch for lack of R&D.


Oh boy, here we go with the ricetarded 'hp/liter' arguements. :no-no:

This s*** has started soooo many riceboy WARS over on ls1tech.com that it is unfathomable!!!

Funny how that 'low tech, outdated,under-engineered' "crutch" as you call it outperforms ALL of your precious imports and gets better fuel mileage at the same time, huh?

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
But the bottom line is that all three American car companies are a breath away from folding.


And you (and your fellow import nameplate militants) could not be any more overjoyed/thrilled, or ecstatic about that, right??

Of course it has nothing at all to do with legacy costs (that your Nippon Giants NEVER had to face!!), trade imbalances, dumping by your precious import companies, currency manipulation, etc., etc., right??
Yup, it must be those sub 50 I.Q. dumbazz engineers and their blasted, ancient (OHCs/4 valves per cylinder were around before pushrods/OHV), "outdated" pushrods/OHVs.

These hp/L arguments are about the most retarded thing out there and my car makes nearly 200hp/L. When you can't compete with the actual power output of others, you have to make up an argument you can win (specific output)regardless of whether or not it means anything. Sometimes I like my GN because it's like beating the ricers at their own game.

Sure, the LS7's specific output isn't as high as an S2000 but it makes nearly 3 times the power and will pull hard from anywhere on the tach. It's called usable power. It doesn't have to be above 7,500rpm to make more than 5hp.

 

[ProStreetCamaro]

Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
I owned a Firehawk so I am familiar. The LSX motors are outdated and have dismal specific output numbers. Even the hand built LS7's specific output numbers barely match those of an every day accord or camry. Yes they make it up with displacement, but that's just a crutch for lack of R&D.


Oh boy, here we go with the ricetarded 'hp/liter' arguements. :no-no:

This s*** has started soooo many riceboy WARS over on ls1tech.com that it is unfathomable!!!

Funny how that 'low tech, outdated,under-engineered' "crutch" as you call it outperforms ALL of your precious imports and gets better fuel mileage at the same time, huh?

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
But the bottom line is that all three American car companies are a breath away from folding.


And you (and your fellow import nameplate militants) could not be any more overjoyed/thrilled, or ecstatic about that, right??

Of course it has nothing at all to do with legacy costs (that your Nippon Giants NEVER had to face!!), trade imbalances, dumping by your precious import companies, currency manipulation, etc., etc., right??
Yup, it must be those sub 50 I.Q. dumbazz engineers and their blasted, ancient (OHCs/4 valves per cylinder were around before pushrods/OHV), "outdated" pushrods/OHVs.

These hp/L arguments are about the most retarded thing out there and my car makes nearly 200hp/L. When you can't compete with the actual power output of others, you have to make up an argument you can win (specific output)regardless of whether or not it means anything. Sometimes I like my GN because it's like beating the ricers at their own game.

Sure, the LS7's specific output isn't as high as an S2000 but it makes nearly 3 times the power and will pull hard from anywhere on the tach. It's called usable power. It doesn't have to be above 7,500rpm to make more than 5hp.




AHHHH HAHAHA you just put it plain and simple. Why cant import guys understand this? Is it really that hard to understand?

Nobody here is saying that imports cant be made fast. [censored] a guy in our car club has a 9 second older civic. BUT the car is stripped out completely and doesnt weigh anything and the engine is built to the max plus a huge turbo to get it to run those numbers. Then you look across the lot to another members 2000 Z28 that has forged bottom end with heads and cam that runs high 10's on motor and high 9's on a 150 shot and is his full interior daily driver still getting in the middle 20mpg range.


DURRRRRRR whats so hard to understand?

 

[aquariuscsm]

Originally Posted By: ProStreetCamaro
Originally Posted By: aquariuscsm
Im my dream garage there sits:

A twin turbo Z32
A 3000GT VR4
An `87 Buick GNX
A `67 Camaro modded to the hilt!

Unfortunately that will probably never become a reality :^(



My dream car only I want mine in candy apple red over gold metallic base.

Holy shi*!!!!!!!!!!!! Now THAT is an engine! Man if that car pulled up next to me and wanted to race,I`d look for the next turn and get outta there! AWESOME car ProStreetCamaro!

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: ProStreetCamaro
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: dailydriver
Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
I owned a Firehawk so I am familiar. The LSX motors are outdated and have dismal specific output numbers. Even the hand built LS7's specific output numbers barely match those of an every day accord or camry. Yes they make it up with displacement, but that's just a crutch for lack of R&D.


Oh boy, here we go with the ricetarded 'hp/liter' arguements. :no-no:

This s*** has started soooo many riceboy WARS over on ls1tech.com that it is unfathomable!!!

Funny how that 'low tech, outdated,under-engineered' "crutch" as you call it outperforms ALL of your precious imports and gets better fuel mileage at the same time, huh?

Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
But the bottom line is that all three American car companies are a breath away from folding.


And you (and your fellow import nameplate militants) could not be any more overjoyed/thrilled, or ecstatic about that, right??

Of course it has nothing at all to do with legacy costs (that your Nippon Giants NEVER had to face!!), trade imbalances, dumping by your precious import companies, currency manipulation, etc., etc., right??
Yup, it must be those sub 50 I.Q. dumbazz engineers and their blasted, ancient (OHCs/4 valves per cylinder were around before pushrods/OHV), "outdated" pushrods/OHVs.

These hp/L arguments are about the most retarded thing out there and my car makes nearly 200hp/L. When you can't compete with the actual power output of others, you have to make up an argument you can win (specific output)regardless of whether or not it means anything. Sometimes I like my GN because it's like beating the ricers at their own game.

Sure, the LS7's specific output isn't as high as an S2000 but it makes nearly 3 times the power and will pull hard from anywhere on the tach. It's called usable power. It doesn't have to be above 7,500rpm to make more than 5hp.




AHHHH HAHAHA you just put it plain and simple. Why cant import guys understand this? Is it really that hard to understand?

Nobody here is saying that imports cant be made fast. [censored] a guy in our car club has a 9 second older civic. BUT the car is stripped out completely and doesnt weigh anything and the engine is built to the max plus a huge turbo to get it to run those numbers. Then you look across the lot to another members 2000 Z28 that has forged bottom end with heads and cam that runs high 10's on motor and high 9's on a 150 shot and is his full interior daily driver still getting in the middle 20mpg range.


DURRRRRRR whats so hard to understand?


BINGO! I know of a number of guys with stock bottom-ended Fox-body Mustangs running mid-10's with some boost. My cam grinder went 11.19 on motor, stock bottom-ended 302 with some GT40's, 4.56's out back, Systemax II intake, 8,000RPM, lots of cam....etc. Drove it to the track and back.

The only fast (11-13 second range) Imports that run at the track we run at are running Turbo's the size of my head! And they are complete stripper cars. And most of them are all older Civic/CRX's......

Watched the one Civic with the hood up in the parking lot after a run with a huge breaker-bar on the head bolts trying to get the car to stop burning coolant.......... Had a bit of a head-lifting issue.

 

[Patman]

Originally Posted By: PacoZ06

Patman: Based on my short experience with BITOG, I know I am right when I state that you are one of the better contributors on this site. You deserve a thanks.





Thanks for the kind words!

 

[aquariuscsm]

Hey Patman,I went on your site and saw your black Vette...........that car is AWESOME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Black on black with factory chrome wheels. You got THEE BEST color combo possible!

 

[ProStreetCamaro]

Im not an import guy but I already said it before that they can be made fast but it takes sooooooooo much more to do it.

Here is one of our car club guys civic. Runs high 9's. The car is not streetable.

http://www.racersden.net/forum/image.php?u=895&type=sigpic&dateline=1206237097