It is too bad too because I think GM has a winner in this Commaro from the stand point of offering a lot of bang for the buck. The fact remains that as one of the oldest automotive manufactures I hold to them to a higher standard then they hold themselfs too and that is sad! They built the first car that drove on another surface besides the earth they built the lunar roving module that electric car......Too bad they could not carry some of that pride through to today!
Camaro Build Quality
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OVERKILL
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Originally Posted By: Maritime Storm
Quality control, fit and finish and Camaro & Firebird are combinations that have never been used in the sentence, why would you expect the new Camaro to be any different? Their was a reason the Mustang always outsold the Camaro even though it never perfomed as well, Ford put a little more effort into building the Mustang then GM did slapping the Camaro/Firebird together. Like others have mentioned this car probably has a history, but I've seen a couple of Camaros up close and the fit and finish is on par with the previous models, deplorable. The tradition continues, I still believe GM had no right to beg for money so they build a muscle car in this economy.
I wouldn't say "never", the fox bodies were, for a number of years, faster, especially against the "305HO", which is an oxymoron in itself.
The Termi was also quicker, as was the Cobra-R. There were other years where the Mustang was quicker as well.
But that is beside the point.
The Mustang has simply always appealed to a broader user base, and subsequently sales have always been better. Even when the LSx engine debuted, offering the best performance the platform has EVER offered, sales STILL sagged, and the entire platform was eventually axed.
GM has never "got it right" with the F-body, no matter how right they got it underneath the hood. Its reincarnation doesn't seem to have changed that unfortunately.
Quality control, fit and finish and Camaro & Firebird are combinations that have never been used in the sentence, why would you expect the new Camaro to be any different? Their was a reason the Mustang always outsold the Camaro even though it never perfomed as well, Ford put a little more effort into building the Mustang then GM did slapping the Camaro/Firebird together. Like others have mentioned this car probably has a history, but I've seen a couple of Camaros up close and the fit and finish is on par with the previous models, deplorable. The tradition continues, I still believe GM had no right to beg for money so they build a muscle car in this economy.
I wouldn't say "never", the fox bodies were, for a number of years, faster, especially against the "305HO", which is an oxymoron in itself.
The Termi was also quicker, as was the Cobra-R. There were other years where the Mustang was quicker as well.
But that is beside the point.
The Mustang has simply always appealed to a broader user base, and subsequently sales have always been better. Even when the LSx engine debuted, offering the best performance the platform has EVER offered, sales STILL sagged, and the entire platform was eventually axed.
GM has never "got it right" with the F-body, no matter how right they got it underneath the hood. Its reincarnation doesn't seem to have changed that unfortunately.
Originally Posted By: Warstud
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
The new Camaro is yet another vehicle that will sink GM (permanently).
They still don't get it!
I'm guessing another $50 billion..............and they still won't get it!
Ford has their [censored] together.
That's funny you say that but I just read that the Camaro is the second best selling car on the road. I personally don't like the looks of it.
Wait 2 years. The F-Body has NEVER been a big seller compared to the likes of the Mustang.
Originally Posted By: Drew99GT
The new Camaro is yet another vehicle that will sink GM (permanently).
They still don't get it!
I'm guessing another $50 billion..............and they still won't get it!
Ford has their [censored] together.
That's funny you say that but I just read that the Camaro is the second best selling car on the road. I personally don't like the looks of it.
Wait 2 years. The F-Body has NEVER been a big seller compared to the likes of the Mustang.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Originally Posted By: ms21043
No chip here, and yes it's hard for me to grasp. You say someone let you take their new car out to a closed-to-the-public test track where while testing the performance in the car by yourself, you attempted to slide or drift the car around a corner. All fine and good if this is what happened, you must have good friends. I mean you wouldn't try this on a public street with someone else in the car would you?
Drive safely...
Buddy of mine and myself took out a 1999 Mustang Cobra from a dealership in the GTA many years back. Salesmen drove first, had it doing 140+ on the on-ramp (60Km/h). Took us down to the Industrial Park where some driver swapping took place and she was rowed through the gears. Oh yes, there was rubber.
I'm not sure why it is so difficult to picture a performance car being driven as intended?
Every car salesmen that's ridden with me on a test drive of a performance car has told me to hammer on it!
I test drove a Civic Si when they first came out to see what all the fuss was about - the salesguy ripped first through fourth without letting off the gas pedal between shifts and was laughing and saying how slow it was!
Originally Posted By: ms21043
No chip here, and yes it's hard for me to grasp. You say someone let you take their new car out to a closed-to-the-public test track where while testing the performance in the car by yourself, you attempted to slide or drift the car around a corner. All fine and good if this is what happened, you must have good friends. I mean you wouldn't try this on a public street with someone else in the car would you?
Drive safely...
Buddy of mine and myself took out a 1999 Mustang Cobra from a dealership in the GTA many years back. Salesmen drove first, had it doing 140+ on the on-ramp (60Km/h). Took us down to the Industrial Park where some driver swapping took place and she was rowed through the gears. Oh yes, there was rubber.
I'm not sure why it is so difficult to picture a performance car being driven as intended?
Every car salesmen that's ridden with me on a test drive of a performance car has told me to hammer on it!
I test drove a Civic Si when they first came out to see what all the fuss was about - the salesguy ripped first through fourth without letting off the gas pedal between shifts and was laughing and saying how slow it was!
Why does everybody WANT to hate GM and their products? No matter what it is, people look for an excuse to bash them. Hey, everybody saying GM shouldn't have built a muscle car in this economy- the camaro is selling faster than the factory can sell them. Yeah that suuuuure sounds like a sales disappointment. GM right now needs a car that will SELL. And the camaro definitely sells. Stop hating on GM, give them a chance. It seems since even the beginning of the year, they have really gotten their act together, if the new cars they are coming out with is any indication.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: rudolphna
Why does everybody WANT to hate GM and their products? No matter what it is, people look for an excuse to bash them. Hey, everybody saying GM shouldn't have built a muscle car in this economy- the camaro is selling faster than the factory can sell them. Yeah that suuuuure sounds like a sales disappointment. GM right now needs a car that will SELL. And the camaro definitely sells. Stop hating on GM, give them a chance. It seems since even the beginning of the year, they have really gotten their act together, if the new cars they are coming out with is any indication.
They were given a whole lot of chance, something to the tune of 75 billion dollars of a chance so far.
I don't see the poor fit and finish of this car as an indicator of them getting their act together. The trucks? Yes, they are great! So why couldn't they have got it right, like they have on the trucks, across the board?
Why does everybody WANT to hate GM and their products? No matter what it is, people look for an excuse to bash them. Hey, everybody saying GM shouldn't have built a muscle car in this economy- the camaro is selling faster than the factory can sell them. Yeah that suuuuure sounds like a sales disappointment. GM right now needs a car that will SELL. And the camaro definitely sells. Stop hating on GM, give them a chance. It seems since even the beginning of the year, they have really gotten their act together, if the new cars they are coming out with is any indication.
They were given a whole lot of chance, something to the tune of 75 billion dollars of a chance so far.
I don't see the poor fit and finish of this car as an indicator of them getting their act together. The trucks? Yes, they are great! So why couldn't they have got it right, like they have on the trucks, across the board?
Chevy Malibu, Chevy Equinox, Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, Buick Lacrosse, GMC Acadia, Cadillac CTS, XLR roadster, as you mentioned the Silverado/Sierra pickups, and SUVs are excellent. All of these cars are recent GM releases, all are fantastic.
The Camaro's problem is it's a high profile media event and a premium vehicle. GM is putting out a sub-standard product in the easiest way for even a casual observer to notice. Paint not matching? that's bad I don't' care what the excuse/manufacturing technique is. The absolute cheapest (made somewhere else) economy vehicles still have good fit and finish, even the paint matches on all panels!
My humble opinion concerning the Camaros is a strong running nice handling car for kids or adults who act like kids. Seems that buyers get stars in their eyes with the shape & power & bling and completely overlook the build quality.
Originally Posted By: Eddie
My humble opinion concerning the Camaros is a strong running nice handling car for kids or adults who act like kids. Seems that buyers get stars in their eyes with the shape & power & bling and completely overlook the build quality.
I agree with that but I also own a rattle trap GN too.
My humble opinion concerning the Camaros is a strong running nice handling car for kids or adults who act like kids. Seems that buyers get stars in their eyes with the shape & power & bling and completely overlook the build quality.
I agree with that but I also own a rattle trap GN too.
Drove a new 09 malibu for about a week. Great car, build quailty is right up there with toyota, and honda..
I had the fleet trim malibu with the cheap plastic interior, a higher trim model would be very nice. I have seen the higher trim, and its a fine interior.
I had the fleet trim malibu with the cheap plastic interior, a higher trim model would be very nice. I have seen the higher trim, and its a fine interior.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: rudolphna
Chevy Malibu, Chevy Equinox, Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, Buick Lacrosse, GMC Acadia, Cadillac CTS, XLR roadster, as you mentioned the Silverado/Sierra pickups, and SUVs are excellent. All of these cars are recent GM releases, all are fantastic.
I'll agree with most on that list. But the vans are horrendous, as are some of some of the small cars. And its hit and miss, they aren't ALL bad, but some of the ones that are, WOW.
Chevy Malibu, Chevy Equinox, Chevy Traverse, Buick Enclave, Buick Lacrosse, GMC Acadia, Cadillac CTS, XLR roadster, as you mentioned the Silverado/Sierra pickups, and SUVs are excellent. All of these cars are recent GM releases, all are fantastic.
I'll agree with most on that list. But the vans are horrendous, as are some of some of the small cars. And its hit and miss, they aren't ALL bad, but some of the ones that are, WOW.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
No idea on the build date. Didn't LOOK like an accident car. The parts that appeared a different shade were of course plastic. Perhaps they are using junk or thin paint?
Looks can be deceiving.
No idea on the build date. Didn't LOOK like an accident car. The parts that appeared a different shade were of course plastic. Perhaps they are using junk or thin paint?
Looks can be deceiving.
OVERKILL
$100 Site Donor 2021
Originally Posted By: postjeeprcr
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
No idea on the build date. Didn't LOOK like an accident car. The parts that appeared a different shade were of course plastic. Perhaps they are using junk or thin paint?
Looks can be deceiving.
Well I can always LOOK at it again
That being said, the comments about the 'vette a few posts back sort of confirmed it being a "GM thing" with the paint.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
No idea on the build date. Didn't LOOK like an accident car. The parts that appeared a different shade were of course plastic. Perhaps they are using junk or thin paint?
Looks can be deceiving.
Well I can always LOOK at it again
That being said, the comments about the 'vette a few posts back sort of confirmed it being a "GM thing" with the paint.
I got rid of my 87GN in 89-too many trips to the dealer: how are you liking those nitrogen filled master cyclidners? or the hot air blowing through the tape deck, or the leaky O ring at the oil filter mount---finally had to have a short block put in cause thye could not pinpoint the location of a knock-which reappeared about 1500 miles after the new short block. The only thing I did NOT have problems with were the transmission and windshiel wipers.
That biing said, I have purchased 4 Chevys and 1 Olds and they have all been winners
Steve
That biing said, I have purchased 4 Chevys and 1 Olds and they have all been winners
Steve
I advise you all to actually take the time and sit in and drive one. I actually got the chance to at my local Chevy dealer and the cars interior is very well put together, nice leather, it does not feel cheap inside. Outside it looked immaculate as well.
The one you looked at could have been traded in for a variety of issues but you would need to really look at the car yourself, in person(for everyone else) and maybe look at another Camaro before you think they are all like that. The car was actually a dream to drive and again looked fantastic(at all angles as I was checking out the body up close, engine and even saw the little wheel weights).
The one you looked at could have been traded in for a variety of issues but you would need to really look at the car yourself, in person(for everyone else) and maybe look at another Camaro before you think they are all like that. The car was actually a dream to drive and again looked fantastic(at all angles as I was checking out the body up close, engine and even saw the little wheel weights).
Originally Posted By: Eddie
My humble opinion concerning the Camaros is a strong running nice handling car for kids or adults who act like kids. Seems that buyers get stars in their eyes with the shape & power & bling and completely overlook the build quality.
People get too hung up on friggen panel gaps or whatever. That does not mean jack to most people.
I am not a GM person but took a look at a Camaro sitting on the local lot. it was the 300 Hp V6 with stick. Sticker was 23K, car got 29 MPg highway and looked OK to me. Only thing lacking was alloy wheels. I would take it in a heartbeat over a stinking 4 cylinder Accord, Scamry, Civic or Corralla toilet. Sorry guys but when people on this list will pay 19K for a dinky Fit or Corrolla and bypass something sporty for a couple grand more, I have to question things.
My humble opinion concerning the Camaros is a strong running nice handling car for kids or adults who act like kids. Seems that buyers get stars in their eyes with the shape & power & bling and completely overlook the build quality.
People get too hung up on friggen panel gaps or whatever. That does not mean jack to most people.
I am not a GM person but took a look at a Camaro sitting on the local lot. it was the 300 Hp V6 with stick. Sticker was 23K, car got 29 MPg highway and looked OK to me. Only thing lacking was alloy wheels. I would take it in a heartbeat over a stinking 4 cylinder Accord, Scamry, Civic or Corralla toilet. Sorry guys but when people on this list will pay 19K for a dinky Fit or Corrolla and bypass something sporty for a couple grand more, I have to question things.
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