California grid officials ready to ask for conservation as extreme heat wave approaches

Status
Not open for further replies.
en.m.wikipedia.org

Duck curve - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org en.m.wikipedia.org

Gotta wonder how closely we match the duck curve if we are hitting power limits mid day?

I would think (as I had done in the past) that you match your personal heavy hitters (electric water heater, AC, freezer overcool, EV charge) to hit around 11am

AKA Charge at work and put your other stuff on timers to excessively heat cool, then let things settle.

My previous residence could get cooled enough during cheap power to leave the ac off when power wasn’t cheap, same said for water heating.

I had the tank insulated enough that it could only need to run once per day and be good enough.

Cali might consider shifting folks work hours like Spain and Mexico have done for centuries as well

www.utilitydive.com

APPA: Deregulation has not achieved intended results

According to APPA's annual review of retail rates since 1997, customers in deregulated and regulated states have seen almost the exact amount of average rate increases.
www.utilitydive.com www.utilitydive.com
 
OVERKILL said:
They went over last night. CAISO said they didn't load shed, and maybe they didn't directly, but several of the smaller distributors did execute rolling black-outs:
View attachment 115962
View attachment 115963View attachment 115964
Click to expand...
That's odd that CAISO didn't order load shedding but a couple of providers said they did.

Maybe there is some sort of max load limit per provider.

Btw, any load shedding ordered by CAISO has to be done by the providers. CAISO isn't a provider.
 
CharlieBauer said:
That's odd that CAISO didn't order load shedding but a couple of providers said they did.

Maybe there is some sort of max load limit per provider.

Btw, any load shedding ordered by CAISO has to be done by the providers. CAISO isn't a provider.
Click to expand...
Correct, they are the grid operator, like our IESO is here in Ontario, while our largest provider is HydroONE, but we have some smaller ones as well, similar to the ones noted there in Cali.

Twitter energy peeps are questioning CAISO not calling for controlled black-outs (load shedding) while clearly some of the providers were doing it. There's definitely some inconsistency there.
 
JeffKeryk said:
For those of you keeping score, it is a downright comfortable 98* right now; it is amazing how much difference 7* makes.
Click to expand...
Really key to this is how much you can cool your home overnight. The other day, I opened the garage door at 6am and it got near the outside 68f in minutes. It had only cooled to 80f with the door closed having reached 90f during the previous day.

There are home designs that can far better cool homes overnight with no fan assistance. And maybe CA should consider large subsidies for whole home fan installations as that could really help reduce how much energy is required during the day, although it seems the problem is from 4pm onwards when the solar contribution falls off.
 
SC Maintenance said:
I find this website interesting even though I am nowhere near California.

My question is - when they exceed max capacity thats when they start doing rolling blackouts or?
Click to expand...

I'm only talking Oz here...we have a "reserve capacity" mechanism, where some "unconventional" mechanisms are used for that last push, and at considerable price, but it really is the last push before rolling blackouts.
People who have backup generators (breweries, airports etc.) can offer their load, and the (equivalent) to COSTCO and WALMART with beig refrigeration hubs can shut them down for an hour or two, and be paid as though the energy they didn't use was energy that they generated.
 
Shannow said:
Disagree with the fires being started by old grid...that's near impossible unless they stopped cutting down trees...

When I was in transmission, 30 years ago, there was a group explaining the dangers of EMF, and putting on National TV stories that "plants don't grow under High Voltage power lines", compelte with fottage. Our regional manager countered with a picture our team of 6 blokes, with chainsaws' weedwhackers, 4WDs and 6WD trucks who spend every working day cutting them down.

As to upgrades, it's going to be an interesting conundrum...transmission lines do funny things with low power flows...the new world will require that they (some) carry three times the load, a third of the time, and either idle of reverse the rest of the time.
Click to expand...
They did
 
CharlieBauer said:
Really key to this is how much you can cool your home overnight. The other day, I opened the garage door at 6am and it got near the outside 68f in minutes. It had only cooled to 80f with the door closed having reached 90f during the previous day.

There are home designs that can far better cool homes overnight with no fan assistance. And maybe CA should consider large subsidies for whole home fan installations as that could really help reduce how much energy is required during the day, although it seems the problem is from 4pm onwards when the solar contribution falls off.
Click to expand...
Home owners can buy their own fans.
 
Shannow said:
I'm only talking Oz here...we have a "reserve capacity" mechanism, where some "unconventional" mechanisms are used for that last push, and at considerable price, but it really is the last push before rolling blackouts.
People who have backup generators (breweries, airports etc.) can offer their load, and the (equivalent) to COSTCO and WALMART with beig refrigeration hubs can shut them down for an hour or two, and be paid as though the energy they didn't use was energy that they generated.
Click to expand...
We have a lot of surplus generation in Ontario (though that will change if Pickering shutters) so we don't really have to deal with those mechanisms. This is a bit of a legacy of having a previously fully vertically integrated publicly owned monolith operator/generator/deliverer, that, while broken up, most of it is still publicly owned, so having reserve capacity isn't the issue it would be for for-profit enterprises.
 
UG_Passat said:
The reason that 4 to 9 pm is the strain on the electrical grid, a big assumption is up to around 4 pm, people would be working at their respective job place of employment, not working from home.

If you’re working from home, then you should try to do your part to reduce the electrical load all day

In more desert parts of the state, if you signed up for the climate control with the electric company, then the electric company controls your thermostat
Click to expand...
Do people just leave the lights and a/c on at work? I don’t really get the reasoning. The same people are either home or at work. They should be using power at either one or the other.
 
ripcord said:
Except for hydro-electric dams, the technology does not exist for utility scale electrical storage.
Click to expand...
Build some gigantic storage batteries for dam produced power and store it when you can ... might get enough to power a small town for 30 minutes, lol.
 
Last edited:
PimTac said:
Tesla built a huge battery farm down in Australia. I am still not sure what it really does but it did catch on fire which made the news.


Click to expand...

Yes, and California has one that's been on fire 2 or 3 times now. You know what didn't catch fire? The pumped storage projects. Trying to jam Lithium into the grid storage role seems ridiculous, as it's a horrible fit, being extremely costly, short-lived and appears to be inclined to catch fire.
 
JeffKeryk said:
I'm telling you this is a wonderful place to live. I love it here.
Click to expand...
Same here, love it, I like the heat, Ocean, Mountains and people. We are moving closer to the coast next year and Ill have to adjust to near 90 degree summers vs near 100 degree summers, Ill manage though. hehe
We do get cold in the winter and sort of reminds me of my home state of LI, NY around the holidays, thankfully winters are short here and not very cold except for a few weeks..
 
8:00 AM and a nice 74* (and rising). Hoping for 100* max but it could be more.
By the way, I tried my version of the cooling recommendation (cool to 70* and set to 78* at 4:00PM).
I cooled to 74* after lunch and then reset to 78* at 4:00PM. It hit 78* around 6:30 I think. Low 80's after that. Seemed pretty good to me.
But then again I have better insulation than many homes and lotsa fans. I am mainly concerned about my elderly cat who is nearing his time.

Costco strawberry lemon popsicles are the best!
Tomorrow should see about a 6* drop over all; Saturday even better at around 80* high. We are going to see Moulon Rouge, whatever that is.
Sunday is 9er game and then Einstein at the Lick Observatory.
 
JeffKeryk said:
8:00 AM and a nice 74* (and rising). Hoping for 100* max but it could be more.
By the way, I tried my version of the cooling recommendation (cool to 70* and set to 78* at 4:00PM).
I cooled to 74* after lunch and then reset to 78* at 4:00PM. It hit 78* around 6:30 I think. Low 80's after that. Seemed pretty good to me.
But then again I have better insulation than many homes and lotsa fans. I am mainly concerned about my elderly cat who is nearing his time.

Costco strawberry lemon popsicles are the best!
Tomorrow should see about a 6* drop over all; Saturday even better at around 80* high. We are going to see Moulon Rouge, whatever that is.
Sunday is 9er game and then Einstein at the Lick Observatory.
Click to expand...
👍(y)
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top