Brake Job Upsell

Status
Not open for further replies.
Originally Posted by Kira
Just a side note here.

We're all willing to condemn any "up-sell" but you gotta consider two things, maybe more.

1) The up-sell here isn't too egregious given the age and thinness of the pads AND that the OP was in the shop already.

2) Imagine trying to explain to customer after customer the small variances among in-use parts in order to explain / excuse the bit of waste which is going to occur with timely maintenance.

It adds up to many cars being neglected.


I rarely agree with your posts but I agree with you here.
 
Originally Posted by Variant_S
When I took the Subaru to the dealer for the airbag recall, they asked if I wanted the courtesy inspection. I declined.

The independent mechanic that I use is as Chris142 suggests: do this now, do these other things later.

When I took my Audi for the airbag recall, I asked if they could do courtesy inspection but the dealer declined.
 
IME Honda dealers don't remove wheels for the "Courtesy Inspection". So they are trying to measure through the wheels or from behind the wheel... I ofter wonder how many actually have a gauge suitable for such measurements.

I'd lean toward careless measurement or out right estimation before willful and intentional misinformation.

FWIW, Honda dealers around here say Honda "requires" them to do a "Courtesy Inspection" unless the customer definitively declines.
 
Originally Posted by Kira
Just a side note here.

We're all willing to condemn any "up-sell" but you gotta consider two things, maybe more.

1) The up-sell here isn't too egregious given the age and thinness of the pads AND that the OP was in the shop already.

2) Imagine trying to explain to customer after customer the small variances among in-use parts in order to explain / excuse the bit of waste which is going to occur with timely maintenance.

It adds up to many cars being neglected.



And the fact that it sounds like there's a pretty serious vibration when braking. You can't just machine the rotors and put the same pads back on when you have an issue like that. Well, you could, but if a mechanic offered that as an option to me if I had warped/vibration when braking, I'd wonder if he cared fully about my safety.

Should the dealer have been more complete in their explanation. Yes, IMO. Is this an example of a dealer taking a customer for a ride? No, IMO. Telling someone with a Honda K series they need a timing belt replacement and it could be done the same day as the warrantied headlight fix is a dealer trying to take a customer for a ride. Things like that are my bad dealer experiences.
 
Originally Posted by UncleDave
Where is the rivet?

One typically can't simply measure to the bottom of the pad -

Typically there will be at least 2 mounting holes the there will be a rivet sticking up a few MM.

If you measure the distance to the top of the rivet how close was the dealer then?

UD

This is the other issue. The total thickness of my old Civic's pads included a portion of the pad that wasn't usable pad.
 
Rule of thumb we used to go by when I was in the business was RIVITED pads were replaced when pad thickness was equal to backing plate thickness; Bonded pads we let get much thinner. The pad in the picture I assume is bonded, I would not recommend replacement yet as there looks to be plenty of life left.
 
Originally Posted by Wolf359
My only real question is did you measure all 4 brake pads?

5mm was the lowest of the four brake pads up front.

I removed all 4 rear brake pads and cleaned the bracket clips so each rear pad was also measured.

Originally Posted by DuckRyder
IME Honda dealers don't remove wheels for the "Courtesy Inspection". So they are trying to measure through the wheels or from behind the wheel... I ofter wonder how many actually have a gauge suitable for such measurements.

I'd lean toward careless measurement or out right estimation before willful and intentional misinformation.

FWIW, Honda dealers around here say Honda "requires" them to do a "Courtesy Inspection" unless the customer definitively declines.

I just rechecked the invoice and apparently, the dealer also installed 4 new tires during this visit. So yes, the tires were off the car.

Originally Posted by Kira
Just a side note here.

We're all willing to condemn any "up-sell" but you gotta consider two things, maybe more.

1) The up-sell here isn't too egregious given the age and thinness of the pads AND that the OP was in the shop already.

2) Imagine trying to explain to customer after customer the small variances among in-use parts in order to explain / excuse the bit of waste which is going to occur with timely maintenance.

It adds up to many cars being neglected.

You bring up valid points. However, they should have mentioned that the rear pads may/may not make it to the next service and for the sake of convenience, the customer should consider doing them today.

Originally Posted by UncleDave
Where is the rivet?

One typically can't simply measure to the bottom of the pad -

Typically there will be at least 2 mounting holes the there will be a rivet sticking up a few MM.

If you measure the distance to the top of the rivet how close was the dealer then?

UD

No rivets are present on these pads. These are "bonded."

Originally Posted by HowAboutThis
You can't just machine the rotors and put the same pads back on when you have an issue like that. Well, you could, but if a mechanic offered that as an option to me if I had warped/vibration when braking, I'd wonder if he cared fully about my safety.

From an OEM standpoint, rotors can be machined (on-car) as long as the rotors are above minimum thickness. Every OEM has taken this position. While I agree with you on this position, this is technically not true; the rotors can be machined and placed back into service.
 
Originally Posted by The Critic
Originally Posted by Wolf359
My only real question is did you measure all 4 brake pads?

5mm was the lowest of the four brake pads up front.

I removed all 4 rear brake pads and cleaned the bracket clips so each rear pad was also measured.

Originally Posted by DuckRyder
IME Honda dealers don't remove wheels for the "Courtesy Inspection". So they are trying to measure through the wheels or from behind the wheel... I ofter wonder how many actually have a gauge suitable for such measurements.

I'd lean toward careless measurement or out right estimation before willful and intentional misinformation.

FWIW, Honda dealers around here say Honda "requires" them to do a "Courtesy Inspection" unless the customer definitively declines.

I just rechecked the invoice and apparently, the dealer also installed 4 new tires during this visit. So yes, the tires were off the car.

Originally Posted by Kira
Just a side note here.

We're all willing to condemn any "up-sell" but you gotta consider two things, maybe more.

1) The up-sell here isn't too egregious given the age and thinness of the pads AND that the OP was in the shop already.

2) Imagine trying to explain to customer after customer the small variances among in-use parts in order to explain / excuse the bit of waste which is going to occur with timely maintenance.

It adds up to many cars being neglected.

You bring up valid points. However, they should have mentioned that the rear pads may/may not make it to the next service and for the sake of convenience, the customer should consider doing them today.

Originally Posted by UncleDave
Where is the rivet?

One typically can't simply measure to the bottom of the pad -

Typically there will be at least 2 mounting holes the there will be a rivet sticking up a few MM.

If you measure the distance to the top of the rivet how close was the dealer then?

UD

No rivets are present on these pads. These are "bonded."

I've had the bonded pads crumble when worn to far. Maybe I'm just unlucky, but it happened to me twice with my Civic's rear pads when they were worn down to me thinking it was time to replace. Not sure if that's normal or not...
 
Even though it has a shimmy when braking, I doubt they actually drove the car. This is likely an upsell, but who can blame them? That's how these things work and is sales 101. It is important for customers to be informed, and while I don't normally take sides with the shop I wouldn't be enraged over them recommending it. Recommending it is totally different than those crooks who hold cars hostage or tell young mothers they will crash on the way home. Those people should be in jail, however not every shop is out to scam you.
 
Originally Posted by DuckRyder
FWIW, Honda dealers around here say Honda "requires" them to do a "Courtesy Inspection" unless the customer definitively declines.

Could be true based on our son taking his Accord in for an airbag recall. They did their "inspection" and he said he was in and out of the place in barely 45 minutes so I wonder how in-depth they really went. They only referred to an oil change on their recommendations and the guy told our son their system automatically includes this if they don't have a record of previous oil changes (which this dealer wouldn't have).
 
Originally Posted by atikovi
Service writer and tech works on commision. Nuf said.

fixed. The tech gets a small cut out of the sale, on top of the difference between book and actual time at a flat-rate shop.
 
Its definitely a slight upsell but its not too bad. They work on commission so a few things constitue slight exag recommendations. If you are having the front pads done, they probably figure the customer might wana just have all 4 done at once. I wouldnt have my dealer do pads or rotors though..id do the job myself or have my indy do it for half or less but I would likely swap them all.
 
I used to hate free inspections. If the customer wanted an inspection I would charge them 1hour then remove charge if vehicle repair is sold. No way you can inspect brakes, transmission etc without a test drive. 100 point inspection for free I would pass. You have to rack car for oil leaks as well as other things. Seen many techs take these and make a killing but with 100k tune up being sold at 50k no thanks.
 
The dealer shop could and should have been more honest with their customer.
The van did obviously need a front brake job and why the customer put up with what you describe as violent shaking on braking I can't quite grasp.
A simple pad slap on the rear would have been cheap and easy and would have ensured that the customer would have had zero further brake issues for years to come, but here again the dealer shop should have been more honest with the customer.
In the end, the customer was only mildly upsold but was also dealt with in a dishonest manner.
 
Originally Posted by fdcg27
The dealer shop could and should have been more honest with their customer.
The van did obviously need a front brake job and why the customer put up with what you describe as violent shaking on braking I can't quite grasp.
A simple pad slap on the rear would have been cheap and easy and would have ensured that the customer would have had zero further brake issues for years to come, but here again the dealer shop should have been more honest with the customer.
In the end, the customer was only mildly upsold but was also dealt with in a dishonest manner.

Thing is they are dishonest by nature, any bashing dealers receive is well deserved, and they even know it.
The auto repair industry is one of the sleaziest in the country right up there with lawyers.
 
Last edited:
Thus ends another dealership service topic.

Apparently they are great fun for some, however when they become pointless they will be stopped.

Enough members are fed up with them to alert.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top