Brake Fluid Flush Dilemma
- Thread starter The Critic
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Originally Posted By: The Critic
It is brake-by-wire, so when you push on the pedal you may not be "directly connected" to the hydraulic system.
Yeah, I guess I understand the brake by wire concept, it is just the idea that cracking a brake bleeder screw triggers a fault code.
This is something that I have discussed at length with my mechanic friend. He has a new Mini and also has the uber-complicated factory BMW software-on-a-laptop that is used to perform diagnostics on the car. He can also use it on my old BMW as well. But one day he was showing me how he could do all kinds of stuff on the Mini with the laptop, stuff like put the windows up and down. I was dumbfounded. I mean, when did the window motors on cars get networked? Sheesh.
I have another friend who has a Toyota with the laser cruise control and a rock broke the sensor cover under the bumper. $1000 to fix at the dealer! My thought was, when did we start needing laser cruise controls?
Makes me not want a new car. Years ago people used to say things like "you can't work on today's cars, they have all that electronic stuff". That wasn't true then really, you could do a lot despite the electronics of that time. But it can be true now, my friend with the Mini really can't work on that car without that software. Amazing.
It is brake-by-wire, so when you push on the pedal you may not be "directly connected" to the hydraulic system.
Yeah, I guess I understand the brake by wire concept, it is just the idea that cracking a brake bleeder screw triggers a fault code.
This is something that I have discussed at length with my mechanic friend. He has a new Mini and also has the uber-complicated factory BMW software-on-a-laptop that is used to perform diagnostics on the car. He can also use it on my old BMW as well. But one day he was showing me how he could do all kinds of stuff on the Mini with the laptop, stuff like put the windows up and down. I was dumbfounded. I mean, when did the window motors on cars get networked? Sheesh.
I have another friend who has a Toyota with the laser cruise control and a rock broke the sensor cover under the bumper. $1000 to fix at the dealer! My thought was, when did we start needing laser cruise controls?
Makes me not want a new car. Years ago people used to say things like "you can't work on today's cars, they have all that electronic stuff". That wasn't true then really, you could do a lot despite the electronics of that time. But it can be true now, my friend with the Mini really can't work on that car without that software. Amazing.
Just as an update, I flushed the brake fluid myself at 35k with the assistance of the Techstream Lite software and VIM. The process is actually quite straightforward, and took about 45 min. The computer prompts you on what/when to do each wheel, and at the end, it makes you adjust the fluid level to a certain level and reinitializes the system 6 times.
The only error I made was that I used a mityvac vacuum bleeder (the large unit, with accessory kit) to do the front two calipers. Immediately after the brake flush, the braking response was more laggy than usual. I suspected that vacuum bleeding introduced air, but the issue went away entirely within several days and before I had a chance to go rebleed them.
So next time, I would probably advise that one should manually bleed each front caliper after vacuum bleeding to ensure that there is no air behind. I may still go back and manually bleed the fronts, but it may not be necessary since everything works just fine again.
For the record, I use 3 bottles of Genuine Honda DOT3 brake fluid ($14 total) since it is an OE grade DOT3 fluid that is likely better than OTC DOT3, and is a brand that is fast-moving stock.
The only error I made was that I used a mityvac vacuum bleeder (the large unit, with accessory kit) to do the front two calipers. Immediately after the brake flush, the braking response was more laggy than usual. I suspected that vacuum bleeding introduced air, but the issue went away entirely within several days and before I had a chance to go rebleed them.
So next time, I would probably advise that one should manually bleed each front caliper after vacuum bleeding to ensure that there is no air behind. I may still go back and manually bleed the fronts, but it may not be necessary since everything works just fine again.
For the record, I use 3 bottles of Genuine Honda DOT3 brake fluid ($14 total) since it is an OE grade DOT3 fluid that is likely better than OTC DOT3, and is a brand that is fast-moving stock.
critic -
If the problem went away and everything is fine, then why recommend a manual fluid change?
I believe vacuum bleeding is far safer and more reliable than manual bleeding -even with 2 experienced guys.
If the problem went away and everything is fine, then why recommend a manual fluid change?
I believe vacuum bleeding is far safer and more reliable than manual bleeding -even with 2 experienced guys.
What a dirty trick! They require special brake bleeding that only they can perform!
Anyways, you can turkey baster out the reservoir yourself, and refill it. Do this every two weeks for a while. Brake fluid does indeed mix and migrate. A very good thing to do, but it is not perfect.
You car is not spec'd for early fluid changes because of the regenerative braking it has. Brakes are not used as hard or as much. [At least this makes sense to me!]
Anyways, you can turkey baster out the reservoir yourself, and refill it. Do this every two weeks for a while. Brake fluid does indeed mix and migrate. A very good thing to do, but it is not perfect.
You car is not spec'd for early fluid changes because of the regenerative braking it has. Brakes are not used as hard or as much. [At least this makes sense to me!]
Youre lucky that is all you needed for fluid. Last Escape Hybrid we did here needed 3 gallons of DOT 3 to bleed the system with the IDS.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
I had no idea that DOT 3 fluid even came in a gallon jugs!
It does, O'Reilly's sells them. We asked the customer if they wanted to wait while we got 3 gallons of Motorcraft, and they declined.
I had no idea that DOT 3 fluid even came in a gallon jugs!
It does, O'Reilly's sells them. We asked the customer if they wanted to wait while we got 3 gallons of Motorcraft, and they declined.
Originally Posted By: Vikas
I had no idea that DOT 3 fluid even came in a gallon jugs!
You can even get it in 5 gallon pails if you know where to look.
I had no idea that DOT 3 fluid even came in a gallon jugs!
You can even get it in 5 gallon pails if you know where to look.
I have also had trouble with one specific car with a mityvac pulling air into the system around the bleeder valves. I now use a motive power bleeder - which has it's own issues, but running dry or sucking in air around a nipple aren't on the list.
I have had excellent luck for many years using the two man manual method.
I have had excellent luck for many years using the two man manual method.
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