BMW E90 Ceramic Brake pads?

[edyvw]

There is no Ceramic 5.0 compound from Hawk.

Hawk doesn't advertise the HPS and HPS 5.0 compounds as ceramic though.

Though I hated the HPS in the winter, as there was no bite in the winter mornings, until the pads heated up. I have heard the HPS 5.0 compound fixes this issue.

Don’t they have something ceramic?

 

[Carmudgeon]

Don’t they have something ceramic?

HPS, HPS 5.0 and Performance Ceramic are each distinct offerings.

Nope, unless boots crack, which I have never seen happening.

I've replaced them when rebuilding calipers, and the OE Ate bushings are tough, and a bit of a PITA to deal with.

And yes, the official word is that they should be dry. I've seen what happens when a lube like forum favorite Sil-Glyde is used; it has the opposite of the desired effect and makes it harder for the pin to slide because the stuff gums up.

 

[edyvw]

HPS, HPS 5.0 and Performance Ceramic are each distinct offerings.



I've replaced them when rebuilding calipers, and the OE Ate bushings are tough, and a bit of a PITA to deal with.

And yes, the official word is that they should be dry. I've seen what happens when a lube like forum favorite Sil-Glyde is used; it has the opposite of the desired effect and makes it harder for the pin to slide because the stuff gums up.

I have not ventured into Hawk line up that much. I know offers for track, which what I am interested in, but I know they have bunch of different street stuff.

Yeah, anything on those pins will have the opposite effect. ATE stuff is exceptional IMO. I have been running their rotors on BMW for the last 35k, Made in China. Two sets of track pads, and I am about to wear out a set of regular Jurid pads. Still, have a minimum lip. They probably racked up 2,000 miles of track time out of those 35k.

 

[Pew]

I have not ventured into Hawk line up that much. I know offers for track, which what I am interested in, but I know they have bunch of different street stuff.

Yeah, anything on those pins will have the opposite effect. ATE stuff is exceptional IMO. I have been running their rotors on BMW for the last 35k, Made in China. Two sets of track pads, and I am about to wear out a set of regular Jurid pads. Still, have a minimum lip. They probably racked up 2,000 miles of track time out of those 35k.

Hawk pads are pretty aggressive on rotors and squeal like a stuck pig, even their street stuff. They're all high coefficient pads with low modularity as well. If you liked the EBC Yellows, you may like the Ferodo DS2500 if they come in your size. Very similar in feel but better less fade over continuous use.

 

[edyvw]

Hawk pads are pretty aggressive on rotors and squeal like a stuck pig, even their street stuff. They're all high coefficient pads with low modularity as well. If you liked the EBC Yellows, you may like the Ferodo DS2500 if they come in your size. Very similar in feel but better less fade over continuous use.

Will see. I found Hawk HP+ on sale super cheap for Brembo calipers. Too good to pass.

 

[BMW Dom]

Edy, have you done any brake upgrades for your e90? Like 335 calipers, or big brake conversion? Or is it still the stock setup?

 

[Craig in Canada]

Anybody switch their cars from semi metallic to ceramic brake pads? How much of a difference in terms of performance and dust?

My front wheels get so dirty from braking, and I was wondering what the best way to keep them clean is. Should I just clean them every few days? My pads have a lot of meat on them, but the car says due in 1600 miles.

What do the break experts say 😀?

My F10 came with ceramic pads (a silent switchover by the factory when the F series was released). Yep - much cleaner. But I found the bite and progressive increases brake torque lacking compared to the old school OEM dusty compounds. When my F10 needed brakes I went out of my way to find "old OE" dusty semi-metallics and did not want "new OE" ceramics. It wasn't night and day, but bite and progressive brake feel is improved. Both compounds stop the car, neither was unsafe, but if a moderate stop suddenly becomes an emergency stop when push comes to shove I have found the semi-metallics give more confidence (greater increase in brake torque for a given increase in pedal pressure) and work better. On my bed-in run I said "Now THAT's more like it" to myself. Unfortunately the wheels are dirty after a drive around the block.

For what it's worth, F30 M Performance and M Sport brake packages specifically spec "old OE" semi-metallic compounds, so does the F10 M5. What does that tell you? BMW does a better job outlining the various compound options on the 3 series. On the non-M 5 series I think you're just not supposed to take note, or have any fun driving.

So - do YOU like driving dynamics and the odd spirited run, or do you use your E90 to get from point A to point B and like clean wheels? Even though my E90 pre-LCI 328i had the smallest brakes of any of the German cars I've had, it had almost the best feel and performance (second only to a 4-piston fixed caliper Porsche set up). I noticed a decrease in braking performance and an dramatic increase in cleanliness going to ceramic. Whether it's right for you depends on what kind of driver you are - many might not even notice the difference at all.

 

[edyvw]

Edy, have you done any brake upgrades for your e90? Like 335 calipers, or big brake conversion? Or is it still the stock setup?

No.
In the spring I am installing F30 335 Brembo in front, and E82 135 Brembo in the back. Also switching master cylinder to M3.

 

[edyvw]

My F10 came with ceramic pads (a silent switchover by the factory when the F series was released). Yep - much cleaner. But I found the bite and progressive increases brake torque lacking compared to the old school OEM dusty compounds. When my F10 needed brakes I went out of my way to find "old OE" dusty semi-metallics and did not want "new OE" ceramics. It wasn't night and day, but bite and progressive brake feel is improved. Both compounds stop the car, neither was unsafe, but if a moderate stop suddenly becomes an emergency stop when push comes to shove I have found the semi-metallics give more confidence (greater increase in brake torque for a given increase in pedal pressure) and work better. On my bed-in run I said "Now THAT's more like it" to myself. Unfortunately the wheels are dirty after a drive around the block.

For what it's worth, F30 M Performance and M Sport brake packages specifically spec "old OE" semi-metallic compounds, so does the F10 M5. What does that tell you? BMW does a better job outlining the various compound options on the 3 series. On the non-M 5 series I think you're just not supposed to take note, or have any fun driving.

So - do YOU like driving dynamics and the odd spirited run, or do you use your E90 to get from point A to point B and like clean wheels? Even though my E90 pre-LCI 328i had the smallest brakes of any of the German cars I've had, it had almost the best feel and performance (second only to a 4-piston fixed caliper Porsche set up). I noticed a decrease in braking performance and an dramatic increase in cleanliness going to ceramic. Whether it's right for you depends on what kind of driver you are - many might not even notice the difference at all.

On F30 only S2NHA compound is aggressive one. It comes on M Sport.
M performance is same, low dust compound, but rotor is 370 instead of 340mm. Pads are same on all F30 Brembo set ups regardless of rotor size (except M3/4).

 

[BMW Dom]

No.
In the spring I am installing F30 335 Brembo in front, and E82 135 Brembo in the back. Also switching master cylinder to M3.

Make sure you share some pics

 

[BMW Dom]

My F10 came with ceramic pads (a silent switchover by the factory when the F series was released). Yep - much cleaner. But I found the bite and progressive increases brake torque lacking compared to the old school OEM dusty compounds. When my F10 needed brakes I went out of my way to find "old OE" dusty semi-metallics and did not want "new OE" ceramics. It wasn't night and day, but bite and progressive brake feel is improved. Both compounds stop the car, neither was unsafe, but if a moderate stop suddenly becomes an emergency stop when push comes to shove I have found the semi-metallics give more confidence (greater increase in brake torque for a given increase in pedal pressure) and work better. On my bed-in run I said "Now THAT's more like it" to myself. Unfortunately the wheels are dirty after a drive around the block.

For what it's worth, F30 M Performance and M Sport brake packages specifically spec "old OE" semi-metallic compounds, so does the F10 M5. What does that tell you? BMW does a better job outlining the various compound options on the 3 series. On the non-M 5 series I think you're just not supposed to take note, or have any fun driving.

So - do YOU like driving dynamics and the odd spirited run, or do you use your E90 to get from point A to point B and like clean wheels? Even though my E90 pre-LCI 328i had the smallest brakes of any of the German cars I've had, it had almost the best feel and performance (second only to a 4-piston fixed caliper Porsche set up). I noticed a decrease in braking performance and an dramatic increase in cleanliness going to ceramic. Whether it's right for you depends on what kind of driver you are - many might not even notice the difference at all.

Sometimes, I try to maximize fuel economy and comfort. When nobody is behind me, I’ll coast to stoplights and stop signs. It’s not fun to drive where I am. Huge pot holes, always construction, stupid drivers. Usually, I’ll just drive like a grandma. However, when I need the brakes, I like be able to have confidence and stop on a dime. It’s been about 2 weeks any my wheels still look fine. I haven’t drive this car in the winter yet, so I’ll see how long I can go before cleaning them.

 

[edyvw]

Make sure you share some pics

Of course.

 

[The Critic]

Ok, I’ll check. But I’m sure I can get a few more hundred miles until the summer. I’ll take a look at the inner pads one of these weekends

No, the 2-stage sensors must be replaced.

 

[BMW Dom]

No, the 2-stage sensors must be replaced.

Actually, that’s not true. They can still be reset, if the second stage has not been triggered

 

[The Critic]

Actually, that’s not true. They can still be reset, if the second stage has not been triggered

They'll probably break during removal anyway.

 

[BMW Dom]

They'll probably break during removal anyway.

Yes. They’re cheap anyway. I’d replace them anyway