Blending E85 to use as cleaner in non-FFV

[ltslimjim]

So, I've heard of some people using mixtures of e85 with e10, etc. Something like a 40/60 ratio as otherwise it generates CELs when running straight e85 for obvious reasons.

Question: Ethanol as a cleaner, any good? Particularly e85 fuels ability at cleaning? How about blended for use in a non-FFV?

Perhaps the question is two-fold, in the sense if there were differences in any benefit between FFV and non-FFV; even if e85 or ethanol in general was any good at cleaning fuel system. However, I'm not advocating it's usage in non-FFV.

 

[Trav]

It doesn't clean especially well but it can have the opposite effect if the injector internals are not SS.

 

[Rat407]

Any vehicle after 2002 can handle E85 usage to a point. Otherwise older vehicles don't have the proper fuel lines and such to accommodate it.

I would be careful and maybe use it but make sure to run it through pretty fast, like on a long trip. I wouldn't let it sit for long in an older vehicle.

My 2002 Silverado runs great on it and it's not a FF vehicle. If I run it straight I get a CE light for running lean which is understandable. But the throttle response and seat of the pants power is noticeable and nice.

 

[AVB]

E0 would be better, unless your vehicle can take advantage of running straight E85. I would rather have one or the other not at mix.

 

[Astro14]

So, if ethanol is a cleaner, why wouldn’t 10% be effective?

 

[Wolf359]

Originally Posted By: Rat407
Any vehicle after 2002 can handle E85 usage to a point. Otherwise older vehicles don't have the proper fuel lines and such to accommodate it.

I would be careful and maybe use it but make sure to run it through pretty fast, like on a long trip. I wouldn't let it sit for long in an older vehicle.

My 2002 Silverado runs great on it and it's not a FF vehicle. If I run it straight I get a CE light for running lean which is understandable. But the throttle response and seat of the pants power is noticeable and nice.


You might be getting that confused with E15 which the EPA tried to mandate, but some auto makers pushed back and said they weren't good for E15. Maybe in the short term occasional usage may be fine, but it might not be good for long term usage.

 

[Dorian]

I have wondered the same. It looks like it takes a few tanks of E85 to be very effective. All I know is that my last tank in the Camry was E0 91 octane that achieved 31 mpg. My highest tank by far. Typically the car would average 27 mpg under the same or similar conditions. That is nearly 15% greater fuel efficiency. I will take that over having slightly more carbon build up and potential issues any day of the week.

 

[mx5miata]

e 85 that's corn ethanol?

must be sticky I wouldn't use as a cleaner

 

[Crispysea]

Pure ethanol isn’t sticky. It’s a very good solvent. All the sugar was eaten by yeast.

I’ve used 50/50 E85/E10 in an ‘08 3.0 Ranger and it runs great. The timing seems to be tighter. E85 around here is roughly 60% ethanol, so my mix is about E30.

 

[oldhp]

Techron.

 

[billt460]

I don't know what you think the Ethanol is going to "clean"? All it would be good for is to remove any water that might be in the fuel lines. Water and any type of alcohol will mix. "HEET" they sell in the colder climates to prevent gas line freeze is basically alcohol / Methanol / Ethanol. It all accomplishes much the same thing.

But Ethanol can cause rust in tanks and fuel systems. Especially on occasional use engines that sit a lot, like lawn mowers, pressure washers, generators, and such. It's why small engine manufacturers insist on no more than 10% Ethanol to be used in their engines. And even then a product like Ethanol Shield should be added to counteract the corrosive effects of the Ethanol.

Automobile fuel systems are manufactured for use with Ethanol. Some up to 85%, (E85). Although here in Phoenix I have never seen an E85 pump ever. No one sells it. So I can't for the life of me, understand why anyone would buy a car that uses it? You are needlessly adding to the complexity of the fuel system, in order to take a type of fuel that no one sells.

If you want to "clean" your engine, and or fuel system, you're better off using a engine / fuel system cleaner / additive like Gumout Tune Up. That is what they are designed to do. All Ethanol does is keep farmers, the government, (EPA), and environmentalists happy. Because they have this idea it's going to magically scrub the planet clean, and save us all in the process. In reality it's nothing but a solution to a non existent problem.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: Rat407
Any vehicle after 2002 can handle E85 usage to a point. Otherwise older vehicles don't have the proper fuel lines and such to accommodate it.

I would be careful and maybe use it but make sure to run it through pretty fast, like on a long trip. I wouldn't let it sit for long in an older vehicle.

My 2002 Silverado runs great on it and it's not a FF vehicle. If I run it straight I get a CE light for running lean which is understandable. But the throttle response and seat of the pants power is noticeable and nice.


Not many vehicles could run E85 fuels that were not FF rated from the factory. Its not just material compatibility but enough overhead in the injectors the handle the 30%+ increase in flow necessary for E85.

Metal fuel tanks are out as is any aluminum or magnesium in the components of parts in the system as is rubber.
Stoichiometric is considerably lower with E85 so the engine will go lean, thats the reason for the larger injector flow requirement.

 

[SZR48207]

Ethanol is a good solvent. Gasoline is an even better solvent.

So I can see why one would think ethanol has cleaning abilities but in a vehicle with an already clean fuel system what would be dirty?

As Bill mentioned there are dedicated FI cleaners that are proven like Techron or Regane.

 

[Crispysea]

Gasoline and ethanol are two totally different solvents. Ethanol is a polar organic solvent, and gasoline isn’t. That means ethanol can dissolve things gasoline can’t and vice versa.

 

[ltslimjim]

Thanks for the replies. I personally use SI-1 and other PEA cleaners; along with the occasional B12 solvent based followup.

I do believe the long-term risks of using e85 in a system not capable of using properly; see Trav's note regarding injectors needing to allow greater volume, let alone the concerns over any material in the fuel system that could breakdown prematurely in one way or another, simply make it less than optimal. Other products exist for cleansing function and probably do it better.