Well [censored]. ARX is terrific stuff regardless. Best money I have spent in a long time.
Autorx site and high mileage oils
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Originally Posted By: MolaKule
IMHO, I don't think a conscience formulator or company would use a high concentration of seal swellers that would damage seals.
Right, and the fact that Valvoline says you can use Maxlife in a new or rebuilt engine tells me that they are not overdoing the seal conditioner/sweller.
IMHO, I don't think a conscience formulator or company would use a high concentration of seal swellers that would damage seals.
Right, and the fact that Valvoline says you can use Maxlife in a new or rebuilt engine tells me that they are not overdoing the seal conditioner/sweller.
Read more and argue less.......... That's funny! This is my substitute for watching quality TV like Jerry Springer.....
Something about the seal swell agents scare me. I would rather run a synthetic and use Auto-RX.
Maybe it is the thought of removing a transmission or engine just to replace one..........? Talk about major work.
Something about the seal swell agents scare me. I would rather run a synthetic and use Auto-RX.
Maybe it is the thought of removing a transmission or engine just to replace one..........? Talk about major work.
Seal well esters depending type and HOW much CAN ruin a seal in that seal strength CAN be reduced to the point of NO seal.
Too much or wrong type WILL cause permanent damage.
HOWEVER normally only a small amount is used and the effect is to soften the seal only a small percent basicly keeping it within its ORIGINAL hardness and strength peramiters.
ARX I'm told will do this aswell as the "HM" oils on the market.
BUT there is NO industry/Public avalible test data avalible so you must "trust" who ever makes the oil/additive that it does what it says.
When stop using a HM or seal swell additive seal will again start to harden.
Remember most seal problems are due to abrasion and wear at lip/seal area swelling or softening will only "bandaid" the leak in that the seal lip when worn and abraded from normal wear or debris looses its shape and will not have full contact with rotating shaft as such a softer seal will deform more and leak less but is still damaged and in time NO amount of seal swell additve will help if seal face is gone.
bruce
Too much or wrong type WILL cause permanent damage.
HOWEVER normally only a small amount is used and the effect is to soften the seal only a small percent basicly keeping it within its ORIGINAL hardness and strength peramiters.
ARX I'm told will do this aswell as the "HM" oils on the market.
BUT there is NO industry/Public avalible test data avalible so you must "trust" who ever makes the oil/additive that it does what it says.
When stop using a HM or seal swell additive seal will again start to harden.
Remember most seal problems are due to abrasion and wear at lip/seal area swelling or softening will only "bandaid" the leak in that the seal lip when worn and abraded from normal wear or debris looses its shape and will not have full contact with rotating shaft as such a softer seal will deform more and leak less but is still damaged and in time NO amount of seal swell additve will help if seal face is gone.
bruce
I would say also the best way to prolong seal life is to keep seal face and shaft free of any debris and varnish/lacquer buildup buy using a good oil and changeing at a resonable OCI
and keeping "gunk" out of oil wether gycol/antifreeze/PVC blow bye whatever keep oil clean and change offten.
bruce
and keeping "gunk" out of oil wether gycol/antifreeze/PVC blow bye whatever keep oil clean and change offten.
bruce
Some pretty useful info here so far.
My impression is that any lubricant in contact with a seal will have a tendency either to harden and shrink it or to soften and swell it. By shifting the balance slightly to the latter the HM oils are able to provide a needed improvement in the function of seals that have spent most of their lives in contact with lubricants that tend to promote the opposite, and in many cases their function can be substantially renewed.
I don't doubt that the seal-swelling function could be over-done. Just spray carb cleaner on some critical gasket to see how quickly you can make a rubber part swell into uselessness. If you're careful, though, a quick dousing of carb cleaner is an old trick to get something like a hardened o-ring to work like new again, often for a good long time.
Yet notwithstanding the fact that over-doing could theoretically happen, I tend to think that the HM oils are just enough biased to the seal-swelling side of the chemical continuum to keep seals good and juicy and healthy pretty much forever, if anything correcting a minor deficiency that has always been present in ordinary oils.
That is predominantly speculation on my part, perhaps with a little bit of basic understanding thrown in, but I haven't seen anything yet that makes me think to question it.
My impression is that any lubricant in contact with a seal will have a tendency either to harden and shrink it or to soften and swell it. By shifting the balance slightly to the latter the HM oils are able to provide a needed improvement in the function of seals that have spent most of their lives in contact with lubricants that tend to promote the opposite, and in many cases their function can be substantially renewed.
I don't doubt that the seal-swelling function could be over-done. Just spray carb cleaner on some critical gasket to see how quickly you can make a rubber part swell into uselessness. If you're careful, though, a quick dousing of carb cleaner is an old trick to get something like a hardened o-ring to work like new again, often for a good long time.
Yet notwithstanding the fact that over-doing could theoretically happen, I tend to think that the HM oils are just enough biased to the seal-swelling side of the chemical continuum to keep seals good and juicy and healthy pretty much forever, if anything correcting a minor deficiency that has always been present in ordinary oils.
That is predominantly speculation on my part, perhaps with a little bit of basic understanding thrown in, but I haven't seen anything yet that makes me think to question it.
Originally Posted By: MolaKule
Howwever, and IMHO, I don't think a conscience formulator or company would use a high concentration of seal swellers that would damage seals.
You guys need to read more and argue less.
Thanks Mola! Its not a issue of reading or arguing. Many may consider Frank, a sponser of this site, an expert. I don't appreciate Frank's unsubstantiated claims or suggestions that COTS HM oils damage seals. Moderaters should reproach sponsers for these type of claims.
Howwever, and IMHO, I don't think a conscience formulator or company would use a high concentration of seal swellers that would damage seals.
You guys need to read more and argue less.
Thanks Mola! Its not a issue of reading or arguing. Many may consider Frank, a sponser of this site, an expert. I don't appreciate Frank's unsubstantiated claims or suggestions that COTS HM oils damage seals. Moderaters should reproach sponsers for these type of claims.
Thank you Bruce. I really appreciate you taking the time. So then Val Syn and an ARX maintenance dose, or Val Maxlife Syn, is safe and effective insurance. That is very good to know. Thanks again.
Originally Posted By: bruce381
I would say also the best way to prolong seal life is to keep seal face and shaft free of any debris and varnish/lacquer buildup buy using a good oil and changeing at a resonable OCI
and keeping "gunk" out of oil wether gycol/antifreeze/PVC blow bye whatever keep oil clean and change offten.
bruce
So since my 120K+ mile engine, didn't have any seal leaks, I would be fine with plain Valvoline Synpower and a 3K OCI? What kind of effect does Val Synpower by itself have on seals? Is it neutral, neither swelling or hardening?
I would say also the best way to prolong seal life is to keep seal face and shaft free of any debris and varnish/lacquer buildup buy using a good oil and changeing at a resonable OCI
and keeping "gunk" out of oil wether gycol/antifreeze/PVC blow bye whatever keep oil clean and change offten.
bruce
So since my 120K+ mile engine, didn't have any seal leaks, I would be fine with plain Valvoline Synpower and a 3K OCI? What kind of effect does Val Synpower by itself have on seals? Is it neutral, neither swelling or hardening?
Originally Posted By: bruce381
............. BUT there is NO industry/Public avalible test data avalible so you must "trust" who ever makes the oil/additive that it does what it says.............
bruce
That why I log onto BITOG to learn from you GUYS.
Well said.
............. BUT there is NO industry/Public avalible test data avalible so you must "trust" who ever makes the oil/additive that it does what it says.............
bruce
That why I log onto BITOG to learn from you GUYS.
Well said.
Originally Posted By: Jim Allen
One more point to make here that has not yet been mentioned: Sometimes seals are just worn out. Or damaged. Or defective. No "magic elixir" is going to bring them back to life, whether contained in a HM oil or Auto RX.
Ah I said that:
""Remember most seal problems are due to abrasion and wear at lip/seal area swelling or softening will only "bandaid" the leak in that the seal lip when worn and abraded from normal wear or debris looses its shape and will not have full contact with rotating shaft as such a softer seal will deform more and leak less but is still damaged and in time NO amount of seal swell additve will help if seal face is gone.""
Bruce
One more point to make here that has not yet been mentioned: Sometimes seals are just worn out. Or damaged. Or defective. No "magic elixir" is going to bring them back to life, whether contained in a HM oil or Auto RX.
Ah I said that:
""Remember most seal problems are due to abrasion and wear at lip/seal area swelling or softening will only "bandaid" the leak in that the seal lip when worn and abraded from normal wear or debris looses its shape and will not have full contact with rotating shaft as such a softer seal will deform more and leak less but is still damaged and in time NO amount of seal swell additve will help if seal face is gone.""
Bruce
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