auto transmission slippiage, help requested

[JHZR2]

Hi,

My mother has a 97 plymouth breeze. It has been an excellent car, delivers 30 MPG, and is nice enough to drive, while being simple and economical. She mainly uses it around town, and 4x a day, she uses it to drive 5 blocks with her school books, exam papers, laptop, etc (she is a teacher/supervisor).

Anyway, lately the transmission has gotten funny. It will move, accelerate, and drive alright, but often during acceleraion the RPMs will rise and fall like something is slipping. We tried giving it a lo of gas once, and i went up to 4000 RPM before regaining fricition and actually moving the car well.

At some point it is going to be unsafe, so we want to fix it ASAP. The fluid has been changed with chrysler ATF regularly (at the dealer). The fluid in there now is about a year old, looks bright red, smells fine, looks great.

If RPMs act funny when accelerating, hard gas will make them fly up before really moving the car, and you get 'flares' when shifting, what does this mean?

What is the best course of repair? If a trans needs to be rebuilt/replaced, would it make sense to replace the torque converter too? Once again, the ATF looked GREAT, like new, but there may be some other issue in there.

Any advice would be appreciated. Once again, this is for a 97 plymouth breeze, with the 2.0 L engine, and the 4sp- auto trans.

Thanks!

JMH

 

[brianl703]

When was the time the filter was replaced?

 

[JTK]

I'm not sure if this unit has a mode/range sensor switch attached to the shift arm, but if those dont send a clean signal to the PCM (telling PCM which gear the operator has selected), the transmission will do some strange stuff. HARSH shifts, slipping, staying in 3rd, etc. Often the mode switches will get moisture in them & corrode the internal contacts.
G/luck
Joel

 

[Mike_dup1]

I trans expert told me once, a slipping trans is the sign of a dying trans.

 

[Bret Chase]

If you're going to have the trans rebuilt (which if it's slipping, a rebuild is in order sooner or later), you'd be nuts NOT to have the TC replaced, as it's the same labor to R&R a TC as it is to R&R a transmission. an extra $150-200 now is alot better than another 1500 later if/when the TC craps out.

-Bret

 

[Chris142]

quote:

---

Originally posted by JTK:
I'm not sure if this unit has a mode/range sensor switch attached to the shift arm, but if those dont send a clean signal to the PCM (telling PCM which gear the operator has selected), the transmission will do some strange stuff. HARSH shifts, slipping, staying in 3rd, etc. Often the mode switches will get moisture in them & corrode the internal contacts.
G/luck
Joel

---

Yes! Very common problem with these cars. If this ain't it then the trans is on it's way out.

 

[JHZR2]

Thanks for the info.

So it may just be a corroded switch?!? where would I find this switch? Its directly attached to the gear selector?

Ill let my mother know this, as I think shell be taking the car in to the dealer on monday or within the next week, and it would be nice for them to check it first.

Thanks again!

JMH

 

[JTK]

Mode swtiches are usually mounted on the trans, between the shift cable/linkage and shift arm/shaft. It will have a wire harness plugged into it. Some of these switches can be disassembled, cleaned & regreased with silicone grease and that will fix them. Others are junk and replace.
G/luck
Joel

 

[MN Driver]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bret Chase:
If you're going to have the trans rebuilt (which if it's slipping, a rebuild is in order sooner or later), you'd be nuts NOT to have the TC replaced, as it's the same labor to R&R a TC as it is to R&R a transmission. an extra $150-200 now is alot better than another 1500 later if/when the TC craps out.

-Bret

---

It's usually what is inside the fluid of the torque convertor is usually why it should be changed out. If a failed transmission had anything bad in the fluid such as metal shavings, sludge, or simply bad fluid, it will be introduced in the new transmission which could quickly destroy the new one. I would be very wary of a shop that wouldn't replace the torque convertor along with a rebuild/replacement.

 

[Ray H]

What has the factory ATF been replaced with? Any supplemental fluid additives?

 

[chas3]

get the diagnostics pulled from the computer. even if you dont have a check engine the computer still might be setting some history codes.

some modern chyrsler trans do all the shifting with electronic solenoids. it makes a sort of ratcheting sound when shifting. its not unhead of for one of the solenoids to fail and not apply enough pressure.

check your transmission fluid levels. check the owners manual to make sure you did it right. it seems every trans is different (check hot, check cold, check in neutral, check in park, blah blah).

are the shifts flaring or is the trans slipping? from a stop, in drive (give the trans a few seconds to shift) give the engine gas and brake (you dont want the car to move). do enough gas make the trans slip or do you overcome the brakes first. checking to see if the trans "holds" other gears is the same except you need to be in motion.

do it flare on all the shifts or just 1-2?

 

[JHZR2]

quote:

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Originally posted by brianl703:
When was the time the filter was replaced?

---

When the fluid was done last at the dealer, less than a year ago... this only started less than a week ago.

JMH

 

[JHZR2]

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ray H:
What has the factory ATF been replaced with? Any supplemental fluid additives?

---

It has been replaced with chrysler branded ATF (I forget if it is ATF-3 or 4).

Once again, it was totally fine for the better portion of the past year, through about a week ago.

JMH

 

[Gary Allan]

Have you manually shifted the trans to see if it slips in a fixed range (gear speed). If not, then it's probably electronic/sensor in nature. Otherwise you appear to be having to produce more pump speed to get the pressure you need to engage the clutches.

 

[MN Driver]

do enough gas make the trans slip or do you overcome the brakes first. checking to see if the trans "holds" other gears is the same except you need to be in motion.

do it flare on all the shifts or just 1-2?

I wouldn't count on that test to see if your transmission is slipping. Usually the brakes are supposed to be able to stop the vehicle even if it is stuck WOT. Usually the test is to stab the brakes and when you give it gas, watch the tach(if one isn't equipped then one needs to be connected for this diagnostic) and if the tach goes beyond the spec described in the service manual with this procedure it is slipping.

I would figure if you do that for a short period (3 seconds) and the engine speed continues to increase instead of simply going up to a point quickly and staying steady then you've got slippage or at least in first gear there is slippage. I think I've heard somewhere that 2nd gear is the gear that is most likely to develop a slip first.

My 2 cents. I am not a transmission mechanic, i'm just letting people know what i've heard.