Aussie gun laws - so as not to hijack Pablo

[engineerscott]

Originally Posted By: expat
"Read the statistics, the U.K. does indeed have a crime problem."

Granted, and it's shameful, But as far as I know the Homicide rate is still about 1/5 that of the U.S.
Many Brits, equate liberal Gun ownership with a high homicide rate, NOT freedom.


You guys have roughly 4 times the rate of violent crime compared to the U.S. and we have according to your figures 5 times the homicide rate (most recent figures put that multiplier at 3 as your homicide rates have gone up and ours have gone down).

So, pick your poison. More violent crimes and less murders or less violent crime and more murders (and more liberty btw).

Considering that most murders are committed on criminals by criminals (most drug related as a matter of fact), I submit that for the quality of life for the average citizen, having a legal weapon is an net asset. Clearly you might reach a different conclusion. For me, personal liberty sways the argument in favor of widespread gun ownership.

 

[expat]

The problem with statistics is, you or I can pick any set of stats we like, and they would still invariably be wrong, when applied to any given individuals risk.
I think it boils down to Gut feeling, and the culture we live in.

If you and I walked a mile in each others shoes, we would probably think differently.

 

[edhackett]

Ah, yes, statistics.

"Torture numbers long enough and they'll admit to anything."
M.G.

Ed

 

[Tempest]

This town has mandated that residents MUST own a firearm for about 25 years.

Surly it has mass amounts of murder and violent crime far above the national average:
http://www.homesurfer.com/crimereports/view/crime_report.cfm?state=GA&area=Kennesaw

Or not. All of this while population greatly increased.

 

[Volvo_ST1]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
This town has mandated that residents MUST own a firearm for about 25 years.


Why must they own a firearm for only for 25 years? I need a gun while I'm in my prime!

Besides peaches, has anything good ever come out of Georgia?

 

[unDummy]

I think he meant that it was passed over 25 years ago. I believe that next year is the 30th anniversary of the law.

The town is one of the least crime rate towns in the USA. And, it has had some serious population growth over the last 25 years too. So, this town is the "statistic" to beat.
Anti-gun laws are the biggest contributors to creating crime.

 

[glum]

Puh-lease! And what about the other metrics for Kennesaw? (Including some that would not be politically correct to mention.) You wouldn't look at a UOA and praise an oil for one good metric. Why automatically associate a relatively low crime rate with a supposed high rate of gun ownership?

And how many people in Kennesaw actually own guns? The town doesn't really require you to own a gun. The law includes these exemptions:

Quote:
Exempt from the effect of [the requirement to maintain a firearm] are those heads of households who suffer a physical or mental disability which would prohibit them from using such a firearm.

Further exempt from the effect of this section are those heads of households who are paupers or who conscientiously oppose maintaining firearms as a result of beliefs or religious doctrine, or persons convicted of a felony.

So basically, if you can't or don't want to own a gun, you don't have to.

 

[expat]

I can see the Perps just doing their work Out of Town (Has there been an increase in communities in the surrounding area?) and that would be just fine, if you lived in Kennesaw. But if the policy was to be adopted by the whole state, do you think the Bad Guys would just give up their Life of crime and go straight? Or just make sure they go 'packing' when they next attempt a B&E?
Regardless, some of the stats for Kennesaw are questionable, some claim that if you look at the longer term crime stats, there is little difference. or you could look at any number of small towns (pop 31 thousand)in other counties that 'have' tight Gun control, and find even lower stats.
It's been 25 years, have other towns adopted a similar policy, with the same 'spectacular' results?

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
Why automatically associate a relatively low crime rate with a supposed high rate of gun ownership?

Because the gun grabbers automatically associate gun ownership with crime. Just using the same logic.

 

[expat]

Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
Why automatically associate a relatively low crime rate with a supposed high rate of gun ownership?

Because the gun grabbers automatically associate gun ownership with crime. Just using the same logic.


I see high crime rates as a social problem. I'm not sure that high rates of gun ownership is the answer.
Now form an individuals stand point, a gun may offer a measure or feeling of a measure of security, But does that escalate the severity of crime or reduce it?

 

[Tempest]

Quote:
I see high crime rates as a social problem.

Absolutely. Though if you look, crime rates tend to be higher in big cities than they do in rural areas. Big cities also tend to have much stricter gun laws and more abundant entitlement programs.

If people have a lot of time on their hands due to being paid not to work via entitlement programs, and they have been told all their life that they are entitled to other people's stuff because the evil rich (or other group of convenience) people are oppressing them, is it really a big surprise that they don't have respect for other people and their property?

Much less themselves...

 

[expat]

"If people have a lot of time on their hands due to being paid not to work via entitlement programs, and they have been told all their life that they are entitled to other people's stuff because the evil rich (or other group of convenience) people are oppressing them, is it really a big surprise that they don't have respect for other people and their property?

Much less themselves..."

ZERO argument with that!