ATF Where CHF11SS Required

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I'm wanting to swap out the 16 year old PS fluid in my Mondeo.

Manufacturer has specified CHF11S.

I have 5 litres of mineral DexIII as well as 10 litres of Comma MVATF Plus sat on the shelf.

Would an ATF be a suitable alternative?
 
Originally Posted by Bailes1992
I'm wanting to swap out the 16 year old PS fluid in my Mondeo.

Manufacturer has specified CHF11S.

I have 5 litres of mineral DexIII as well as 10 litres of Comma MVATF Plus sat on the shelf.

Would an ATF be a suitable alternative?



google is too hard to use
http://letmegooglethat.com/?q=CHF11S
 
No.

Lots of 2001-2003 Volvo owners found that out when they used Dex III in their steering systems. The manual for those years listed Dex III, when CHF-202 was actually specified.

The racks started leaking.

The rack lists for $1,400. Labor, including alignment, is over $400 because you have to lower the subframe to access the rack.

So, save $5 on fluid, spend $2,000 on repairs... Not a risk I would take...
 
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Originally Posted by Bailes1992
I'm wanting to swap out the 16 year old PS fluid in my Mondeo.

Manufacturer has specified CHF11S.

I have 5 litres of mineral DexIII as well as 10 litres of Comma MVATF Plus sat on the shelf.

Would an ATF be a suitable alternative?


No, for all the reasons the others have posted. 11S and 202 are interchangeable and mixable. IIRC the 202 is very slightly higher viscosity to address non damaging cold weather (minus 0f) pump noise that occurred in some applications.

Quote
"Note: CHF 11S and CHF 202 are fully compatible and mixable. Pentosin CHF fluids should not be mixed with ATF fluids"
 
I have an B4 Audi Cabriolet, a 1998 model, the last year that car was sold in the USA. This model Audi was used in Europe till 2000. The power steering clearly specs CHF 11.

Interesting point is the early Audi B4 chassis cars, like an Audi 90/Cabriolet from 1992 or 1993 specified ATF in the power steering.

Part number for the ZF power steering racks is the same no matter what power steering fluid was recommenced. Same deal on the PS pumps.

So I investigated. Did ZF change the seals materials in the PS racks with the CHF 11? No. The ZF rack repair kits are the same. Did the seals change in the PS pumps. No. Just Plain Jane "O" rings and seals. Nothing special.

So as an automotive experiment I swapped out the CHF 11 for Maxlife ATF in the Audi. I had to rebuild my leaking PS pump and the PS rack was leaking too.The PS pump rebuild was easy. The PS rack is another story I had nothing to lose by going with the low cost Maxlife ATF solution.

That was four years ago. The PS rack no longer leaks a drop. The PS pump is doing fine and dry too. Maxlife ATF works just fine.

I then swapped out the Pentosin CHF 202 in my Audi A6-C4. That was three years ago. No problems.

The steering is slightly firmer, which I like. The PS systems are dry. Absolutely no noises and cold winter starts and running the power steering is very good.

I know Porsche and Volvo did the same thing back in the 90s too. They changed the spec on the power steering systems to Pentosin but the parts on the cars remained the same. Some of the PS pump reservoirs still had only use ATF on the caps while the book said use only CHF 11S.

So the question is can you use ATF (I would really recommend Maxlife sythenic ATF, cheap at most FLAPS here in the USA) in place of CHF 11S or CHF 202 is an older car's power steering system? Yes, I did without any issues.

Will it work in a Ford Mondeo from the UK? I would think so. I was a former Porsche tech so researching, climbing around and experimenting with my older cars is just fine with me.I have the tools and curiosity. Your experience may be different.

I really do think the change from ATF to CHF 11S was not an engineering decision. It was a brother in law economic decision or maybe Pentosin did some super marketing back to the Euro manufactures. The Pentosin was/is super expensive at $28 a liter. Valvoline MaxLife Synthetic ATF, one Gallon is about the same price.
 
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Use CHF11S or 202
 
Originally Posted by DB_Cooper
I have an B4 Audi Cabriolet, a 1998 model, the last year that car was sold in the USA. This model Audi was used in Europe till 2000. The power steering clearly specs CHF 11.

Interesting point is the early Audi B4 chassis cars, like an Audi 90/Cabriolet from 1992 or 1993 specified ATF in the power steering.

Part number for the ZF power steering racks is the same no matter what power steering fluid was recommenced. Same deal on the PS pumps.

So I investigated. Did ZF change the seals materials in the PS racks with the CHF 11? No. The ZF rack repair kits are the same. Did the seals change in the PS pumps. No. Just Plain Jane "O" rings and seals. Nothing special.

So as an automotive experiment I swapped out the CHF 11 for Maxlife ATF in the Audi. I had to rebuild my leaking PS pump and the PS rack was leaking too.The PS pump rebuild was easy. The PS rack is another story I had nothing to lose by going with the low cost Maxlife ATF solution.

That was four years ago. The PS rack no longer leaks a drop. The PS pump is doing fine and dry too. Maxlife ATF works just fine.

I then swapped out the Pentosin CHF 202 in my Audi A6-C4. That was three years ago. No problems.

The steering is slightly firmer, which I like. The PS systems are dry. Absolutely no noises and cold winter starts and running the power steering is very good.

I know Porsche and Volvo did the same thing back in the 90s too. They changed the spec on the power steering systems to Pentosin but the parts on the cars remained the same. Some of the PS pump reservoirs still had only use ATF on the caps while the book said use only CHF 11S.

So the question is can you use ATF (I would really recommend Maxlife sythenic ATF, cheap at most FLAPS here in the USA) in place of CHF 11S or CHF 202 is an older car's power steering system? Yes, I did without any issues.

Will it work in a Ford Mondeo from the UK? I would think so. I was a former Porsche tech so researching, climbing around and experimenting with my older cars is just fine with me.I have the tools and curiosity. Your experience may be different.

I really do think the change from ATF to CHF 11S was not an engineering decision. It was a brother in law economic decision or maybe Pentosin did some super marketing back to the Euro manufactures. The Pentosin was/is super expensive at $28 a liter. Valvoline MaxLife Synthetic ATF, one Gallon is about the same price.



IIRC CHF 11S was used for its cold weather performance.
 
Pentosin EHF is the lower cost replacement fluid by Pentosin for CHF-11S, if it is available in the UK.
 
Originally Posted by dave1251
Does the owners manual list anything like FORD WSS-M2C204-A2?


Yes, that's the exact specification. But I've also read in several places that it's just a CHF11S fluid.
 
CHF is meh.

Great low temp fluid, but sucks nuts at high temps.

ATF is not a replacement.

The only fluid I found that would replace that stuff, and not crap out really quickly was Redline PSF.

ATF is a destroyer of Euro and Honda steering systems very often.
 
One forum member who lives in the middle east that regularly sees temps in the 120f + range runs CHF11S in quite a few cars and has done so for years with no issues whatsoever.
I have used it myself for a long time in many cars and also had zero issues.
 
You posted in a tread dead from 2019... the OP doesn't even has that car listed in his profile anymore.
 
i’ve heard of people putting ATF in the mercedes ABC hydraulic suspension before.

chf has a ridiculous flash point and pour point but in normal operating conditions it isn’t all that different
 
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