An oil brew, thoughts or opinions?

[k24a4]

For 2004 Honda I-4 (k24), 112600 miles.


I'm considering adding a quart of M1 0w-40 to 3.5 qts Honda sm 0w-20 for my next oc. That would be approximately 78% Honda and 22% M1 with a resultant cst of 9.56 @ 100 C, high 20 weight low 30 weight. The Honda alone is 8.7 cst, the Mobil, 13.5 cst. I could also substitue a qt of 0w-30 afe (10.9 cst) instead of the 0w-40 and have a 9.14 cst.

My goal would be increased protection. My last two uoa's have shown a bit of elevated Al, relative to my first:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...070#Post2757070

I currently have the Honda SM 0w-20 in the sump and should be ready to change it out in a month or so, projected mileage on the oil 7000-7500. It will be sent to ALS for analysis.

I have quite a bit of the Honda oil on hand. I am willing to run it again without mixing if it would benefit BITOG to see consecutive UOA's of the same oil (my three uoa's have been with 3 different oils). However, because it is an oil no longer in production I'm not sure there is real interest. The next oc will take me through the warmer Summer months.

Thoughts, comments, or suggestions welcome.

 

[Donald]

I always ask WHY about mixing.

Get the TBN for UOAs.

 

[cp3]

Looking at your UOAs I would likely wait for the report on the current fill before making a decision. If this report shows the aluminum continuing to trend down then I would just carry on as is. Possibly a particle streak or some type of blip that could have happened regardless of the oil in it. I'm not sure thickening it up will necessarily help as your lowest aluminum report was also the thinnest.

 

[Hokiefyd]

I have moved up to 0W-30 for my K24, and it is loosely equivalent to what you're looking for, all in one jug. I had thought previously about using 4 quarts of M1 0W-20 and 1 quart of M1 0W-40, but tried the 0W-30 jug this time. I can't decide yet whether I like the 0W-30 better than the 0W-20.

I previously ran 5 quarts of PP 0W-20, and had an audible part throttle clackity-clack from the engine. I drained out 1 quart and re-filled with 1 quart of M1 0W-40 and the noise was immediately gone. I'm getting that same noise with M1 0W-30 as well, and I'm thinking about draining it and adding 1 quart of M1 0W-40 to see if it goes away, just for the sake of curiousity.

 

[bepperb]

Based on the little wear from the rest of your engine, and the fact that those other metal numbers don't increase, I would not be certain the increase in AL is from the viscosity of the motor oil, especially since the Honda oil isn't that much thinner to have that dramatic of an impact.

I'm not sure if it was an incident, due to weather, a particle streak... but a 10% change in viscosity doesn't have a 400% increase in wear numbers.

 

[dparm]

I'm sure it will be fine, but I'm not certain it will do much as far as reducing wear.

 

[skellyman]

Oil Brew , did you make it in your Mr. Coffee ?

 

[A_Harman]

Originally Posted By: Donald
I always ask WHY about mixing.



I know that seems like going the long way around to get a 0w30 when he could just pour in M1 AFE, but using M1 0w40 in a blend to get a 0w30 gives an advantage from the stronger additive package, and in conjunction with the Japanese OE oils gives higher Viscosity Index. I think the adpak and VI in M1 AFE are somewhat lacking.

 

[HTSS_TR]

Yeah, mixing gives you thinner at cooler temperature and same thickness at operating temperature. Also, you can get either thinner or thicker oil than you can buy on the shelf, depends on how you mix it.

 

[shell_user]

I am currently running a mix of M1 5w40 TDT, with some ancient gray jug Mobil Delvac 1300 and no problems to report. I dont know how the Widman calculator works also.

 

[CATERHAM]

Substituting a qt of M1 0W-40 will still give you a heavier 0W-20 with a HTHSV of 2.8cP and a virgin VI of about 194.
I like your mix but I think it is unnecessary to thicken up the Idemitsu 0W-20 for your Honda as it's a very robust oil on it's own. Your wear numbers are fine. Chasing a few PPM of wear numbers in a UOA is a fruitless game.
BTW, the following is the UOA of the same Idemitsu oil I ran in my track car you might find interesting:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2829459&page=1

 

[mechtech2]

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Yeah, mixing gives you thinner at cooler temperature and same thickness at operating temperature. Also, you can get either thinner or thicker oil than you can buy on the shelf, depends on how you mix it.



What the ???????

 

[electrolover]

I would just run the M1 0/40. Its seems wrong to taint it with a lower tier oil.
Then you get all the awesomeness without sacrifice.

 

[tig1]

Just use what ever your engine requires. We did this back in the 60s, but today you won't gain a thing.

 

[CATERHAM]

Originally Posted By: mechtech2
Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
Yeah, mixing gives you thinner at cooler temperature and same thickness at operating temperature. Also, you can get either thinner or thicker oil than you can buy on the shelf, depends on how you mix it.



What the ???????

I understand what HTSS_TR is saying.
He is describing in layman's terms the advantages of using or blending high viscosity index oils to creat an oil that is generally not commercially available.

 

[k24a4]

Thanks everyone for the input. I think what I will do is refill with the Honda 0w-20 when I drain and send a sample for a uoa in a month. When I get the uoa back I'll decide whether to drain a quart out and replace with M1 0w-40. Again, I have close to 24 qts of the Honda oil.

Thanks again.

 

[k24a4]

Originally Posted By: Donald
I always ask WHY about mixing.
Get the TBN for UOAs.


Wix analysis come with the TBN but no flashpoint or insolubles.

Originally Posted By: cp3
Looking at your UOAs I would likely wait for the report on the current fill before making a decision. If this report shows the aluminum continuing to trend down then I would just carry on as is. Possibly a particle streak or some type of blip that could have happened regardless of the oil in it. I'm not sure thickening it up will necessarily help as your lowest aluminum report was also the thinnest.


This is what I will do.


Originally Posted By: Hokiefyd
I have moved up to 0W-30 for my K24, and it is loosely equivalent to what you're looking for, all in one jug. I had thought previously about using 4 quarts of M1 0W-20 and 1 quart of M1 0W-40, but tried the 0W-30 jug this time. I can't decide yet whether I like the 0W-30 better than the 0W-20.

I previously ran 5 quarts of PP 0W-20, and had an audible part throttle clackity-clack from the engine. I drained out 1 quart and re-filled with 1 quart of M1 0W-40 and the noise was immediately gone. I'm getting that same noise with M1 0W-30 as well, and I'm thinking about draining it and adding 1 quart of M1 0W-40 to see if it goes away, just for the sake of curiousity.


I hear ya Hokie. The clacking is what I am trying to minimize. Not a pleasant sound, even though it only happens when it is cold outside and eventually goes away. Any mpg loss with the 0w-30?


Originally Posted By: CATERHAM
Substituting a qt of M1 0W-40 will still give you a heavier 0W-20 with a HTHSV of 2.8cP and a virgin VI of about 194.
I like your mix but I think it is unnecessary to thicken up the Idemitsu 0W-20 for your Honda as it's a very robust oil on it's own. Your wear numbers are fine. Chasing a few PPM of wear numbers in a UOA is a fruitless game.
BTW, the following is the UOA of the same Idemitsu oil I ran in my track car you might find interesting:

http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2829459&page=1


Thanks Caterham. You, Cp3 and bepperb have convinced me to forgo the M1 0w-40 until I get the analysis back.