All the locked threads...why?

[TiGeo]

There seems to be quite a bit of preemptive thread locking.

Agree, would rather see rule breakers be penalized. Maybe they are. I greatly appreciate the civility here even if it's enforced. There are thousands of places one can go to be rude and use profanity.

I'm not talking about civility...sure...mod it. Why lock a thread though?

 

[TiGeo]

We just had a conversation about this on the monthly Mod's call.

We have a policy that any thread that has not had a reply in the last two years gets auto locked by the system. Replies to old threads are usually spam, so we just lock them.

If you aren't a mod on this website, you have no idea how much work we put into fighting spam. It's tiring.

We are going to start shifting our lock policy from "just lock the thread" because of bickering, personal insults, etc. to banning the individual(s) who are responsible from posting just in that thread and not lock the thread.

However, if the thread clearly violates our no RSP policy, then we will lock or remove the thread and possibly give the offender some time off.

If someone makes an egregious post, then our normal ban policy applies.

I actually do understand the mod issue you are talking about - spam. Holy cow. I mod vwatlasforum.com. The spam was so bad I almost quit. Every morning I'd spend time cleaning it. golfmk7.com is horrible to, not a mod, but the mod there complains about it. I really do get it.

You lock comment is spot-on and the point of my post. Many posts here are actually interesting but get locked b/c members are arguing which often goes south to insults etc. I went to the recent one about the dude running 0W5 in his twin turbo Ford SUV...locked b/c folks are bicking with one member going after the OP not using the quote function. Really?

Keep up the good work mods.

 

[Leo99]

I'm thinking of the thread about the gas station charged for premium but the man received regular gas. That thread was locked due to too many posts needing the moderator's attention. Seemed like an benign topic with some misbehavior.

 

[wwillson]

I would be happy to answer that question (as my name and avatar hints) - but no dice.

Send a mod alert and ask that the thread be unlocked. We most likely will.

 

[TiGeo]

I often laugh when I see fighting break out on other forums and how it ends up just fizzling out. It's rarely ever regulated. This is by far the strictist forum I've ever been on. Not saying it's good or bad. It is what it is.

It never is regulated on forums I frequent. Folks here would loose their minds in FB auto groups. I mod one and have had DMs threatening me. You can't make it up.

 

[DuckRyder]

Im sure im in the minority, but i think the off topic stuff and inaccurate/unsuported replies at least in the technical forums should be more heavily edited /deleted /warned /banned.

Feel wwilsons plan outlined above is a major step in the right direction.

I think it is weird that when you look at an oil forum, a thread about UOA or cut filter makes it a couple pages, but something about unrelated like attending a funeral or class reunion or some past actor or music legend passing quickly out paces it - i guess that's just the way it is, but this place used to be more about oil/technicalities of oil... now you post a UOA or a Cut filter you get some nimrod going "why you do that" without any meaningful contribution.

This also the only place i'm aware of that banned members fairly frequently and reasonably openly return as "fake newbs" and get to stay.

I am and have been a mod elsewhere and it's a thankless job so it isn't that i don't appreciate what they do... i just think overall the place has lost its focus. I seem to be in the minority though so i will just go sit in the corner i guess... and when in Rome, act like a Roman.

 

[hemioiler]

I honestly don't get it. If a thread doesn't interest you, can you not just skip over it?

"offtopic" threads are still interesting to many, and at the very least they help encourage members to come back and keep posting. An oil forum is already pretty specific, how many threads can you make before you've said everything there is to say and content starts to drop off waiting for new material and members start to leave?

As for banned members returning, that happens in every forum. Can't stop it, proxy ip addresses and plugins to change your browser user agent etc etc, all you can do is reblock the new account if he misbehaves.

I for one was sad to see the 0w in the Ford SUV thread locked a few hours ago. I learned a lot just reading the back and forth as members explained their opposing positions. No doubt more knowledable members got less from it then I did, but again no one is forcing anyone to read it. I didn't see any real acrimony either, compared to reddit/slashdot etc. Maybe nasty messages were deleted there but I'd prefer that then a full thread lock. What happens now, does the thread starter not get to post his test results at all? If he starts a new thread does it get locked? I was really looking forward to the updates there.

 

[dnewton3]

I have never in my 20+ year online forum life seen a forum like this where threads are locked at the rate they are here. I'm a mod on a forum and several FB groups so I get how this all works but clearly, different rules etc. for each/set by the owner/etc. and I get that/not up to me here. My question is....why not just go after/warn the folks that repeatedly are the souce of the locking? Then the folks that want to participate can enjoy the dicussion. The ones that create the bickering or post comments of zero value in those threads/incite the issues are the ones that require the moderation, not the other participants. Basicaly we all suffer b/c it's easier to lock it vs. tell long-time forum users/high post count folks to cool it?

Threads are locked for a variety of reasons:
- old ones which get locked were typically spam driven; they were getting revived and we actually got lots of "reports" on old threads being kicked back up and the topics are no longer valid, etc. Our site has an automated system which locks threads after some many months of inactivity.
- old ones were sometimes kicked back up because someone is trying to stir an old pot; again, these often are "reported" by members, for good reason
- newer threads which have "lived a good life" and are just going around and around and around and around and around and ... will get locked because tempers are beginning to flare
- any thread will get locked when the banter is turning sour, and it's nearly impossible to keep up with the posts as they happen "live". To moderate a thread for any one post, it can take 5 minutes or more to properly research the offender's record, decide upon action, take that action, send a PM. In that time, several more offending posts happen, including people "replying" (quoting) the initial offending post, which then makes us have to go clean up "reply" posts as well. So, there are many times when it's easier to lock the thread and let things cool down a bit, and in that time, the Mod can send several PMs as well as clean up any illicit or offensive posts. How bad can this get? Not long ago, I had to "delete" about every 4th post by several different members. It made sense to lock that thread so I could moderate it without it sprialing faster than I can react.

And sometimes, things are so bad, the entire thread just is sent to quarantine. It may be because of an illicit topic, or it may be because cleaning the thread of all the offending posts would make the thread impossible to read with all the deleted context missing.

I have many times locked a thread, let it cool down for a day, and then reopened it.
I have many times told everyone to "knock it off" in public.
I have many times banned or blocked folks.
I have sent many threads to quarantine.
It's my job to moderate, and I do it under the direction of the site owner.
I have moderated at many sites over my years, and I quit because the wishy-washy polices and terrible behavior of many members made things unpallatable. There are only two sites I moderate for now; this and one other (same owner).

I was a cop for 25 years; I'm used to people's feelings getting hurt when I take action. But what many folks don't realize is how many people appreciate the enforcment, but never say anything; they just go on about their daily lives in the general calm provided. The same pretty much goes on here at BITOG also. Sure, some folks don't like the way this site is managed, but FAR, FAR more people do, and they just don't say anything because they have nothing to complain about.

As for how this site is run, it's the reflection of the owner's discretion, period. The owner, and the Mods, don't really care how other sites are run, or how FB is moderated, etc. We hold ourselves to our own standards and truly could not care less how other sites are managed. We want to thrive here at BITOG, but we're not going to compromise our principles and values to do it.

As wwillson has said, if you want a thread unlocked, PM a Mod and ask for it to be reviewed. Preferrably, PM the Mod who locked it, as he'll have the most knowledge about why it was locked in the first place.

 

[Malo83]

They are quick to lock a thread than Matt Dillon quick draw on Gunsmoke.

 

[TiGeo]

Threads are locked for a variety of reasons:
- old ones which get locked were typically spam driven; they were getting revived and we actually got lots of "reports" on old threads being kicked back up and the topics are no longer valid, etc. Our site has an automated system which locks threads after some many months of inactivity.
- old ones were sometimes kicked back up because someone is trying to stir an old pot; again, these often are "reported" by members, for good reason
- newer threads which have "lived a good life" and are just going around and around and around and around and around and ... will get locked because tempers are beginning to flare
- any thread will get locked when the banter is turning sour, and it's nearly impossible to keep up with the posts as they happen "live". To moderate a thread for any one post, it can take 5 minutes or more to properly research the offender's record, decide upon action, take that action, send a PM. In that time, several more offending posts happen, including people "replying" (quoting) the initial offending post, which then makes us have to go clean up "reply" posts as well. So, there are many times when it's easier to lock the thread and let things cool down a bit, and in that time, the Mod can send several PMs as well as clean up any illicit or offensive posts. How bad can this get? Not long ago, I had to "delete" about every 4th post by several different members. It made sense to lock that thread so I could moderate it without it sprialing faster than I can react.

And sometimes, things are so bad, the entire thread just is sent to quarantine. It may be because of an illicit topic, or it may be because cleaning the thread of all the offending posts would make the thread impossible to read with all the deleted context missing.

I have many times locked a thread, let it cool down for a day, and then reopened it.
I have many times told everyone to "knock it off" in public.
I have many times banned or blocked folks.
I have sent many threads to quarantine.
It's my job to moderate, and I do it under the direction of the site owner.
I have moderated at many sites over my years, and I quit because the wishy-washy polices and terrible behavior of many members made things unpallatable. There are only two sites I moderate for now; this and one other (same owner).

I was a cop for 25 years; I'm used to people's feelings getting hurt when I take action. But what many folks don't realize is how many people appreciate the enforcment, but never say anything; they just go on about their daily lives in the general calm provided. The same pretty much goes on here at BITOG also. Sure, some folks don't like the way this site is managed, but FAR, FAR more people do, and they just don't say anything because they have nothing to complain about.

As for how this site is run, it's the reflection of the owner's discretion, period. The owner, and the Mods, don't really care how other sites are run, or how FB is moderated, etc. We hold ourselves to our own standards and truly could not care less how other sites are managed. We want to thrive here at BITOG, but we're not going to compromise our principles and values to do it.

As wwillson has said, if you want a thread unlocked, PM a Mod and ask for it to be reviewed. Preferrably, PM the Mod who locked it, as he'll have the most knowledge about why it was locked in the first place.

Moderator wilson answered my question and clearly this was an issue that had been discussed/others were asking about. I have in the past ask for threads to be unlocked and they were (good!), I've never been afraid to do that in the past here.

My post was simply talking about one issue - not all moderation on the site (which seems to be how this post is evolving) which as you sate (and I stated as well) is clearly at the discretion of the site owners. I was asking why threads were being locked regularly for simple bickering by (many times) the same folks vs. just moderating those individuals to "stop". I get why older threads are locked due to spamming. There were several of these in the last week "locked for bickering/going nowhere" or however it's worded.

My comment about modding other forums/social media was simply to give some context that "I get it" much like your comment about your law enforcement past and understanding how folks "feelings getting hurt" when you take moderation action here. My feelings aren't hurt. I donate $50 a year to this forum b/c I enjoy it and for that, I can post about a moderation issue I see. I am also deeply concerned when there are fairness issues with even-handed application of moderation which too I see here from time to time but that is for a different discussion.

 

[TiGeo]

I honestly don't get it. If a thread doesn't interest you, can you not just skip over it?

"offtopic" threads are still interesting to many, and at the very least they help encourage members to come back and keep posting. An oil forum is already pretty specific, how many threads can you make before you've said everything there is to say and content starts to drop off waiting for new material and members start to leave?

As for banned members returning, that happens in every forum. Can't stop it, proxy ip addresses and plugins to change your browser user agent etc etc, all you can do is reblock the new account if he misbehaves.

I for one was sad to see the 0w in the Ford SUV thread locked a few hours ago. I learned a lot just reading the back and forth as members explained their opposing positions. No doubt more knowledable members got less from it then I did, but again no one is forcing anyone to read it. I didn't see any real acrimony either, compared to reddit/slashdot etc. Maybe nasty messages were deleted there but I'd prefer that then a full thread lock. What happens now, does the thread starter not get to post his test results at all? If he starts a new thread does it get locked? I was really looking forward to the updates there.

Same on that thread and what promted my comment here. The OP should talk to the mods. I mean you have one member going on about how the OP in that thread wasn't using the quote button.

 

[TiGeo]

Im sure im in the minority, but i think the off topic stuff and inaccurate/unsuported replies at least in the technical forums should be more heavily edited /deleted /warned /banned.

Feel wwilsons plan outlined above is a major step in the right direction.

I think it is weird that when you look at an oil forum, a thread about UOA or cut filter makes it a couple pages, but something about unrelated like attending a funeral or class reunion or some past actor or music legend passing quickly out paces it - i guess that's just the way it is, but this place used to be more about oil/technicalities of oil... now you post a UOA or a Cut filter you get some nimrod going "why you do that" without any meaningful contribution.

This also the only place i'm aware of that banned members fairly frequently and reasonably openly return as "fake newbs" and get to stay.

I am and have been a mod elsewhere and it's a thankless job so it isn't that i don't appreciate what they do... i just think overall the place has lost its focus. I seem to be in the minority though so i will just go sit in the corner i guess... and when in Rome, act like a Roman.

The offtopic stuff - doesn't do a thing for me 99% of the time so...I just don't go to the subforum so problem solved.

 

[DuckRyder]

The offtopic stuff - doesn't do a thing for me 99% of the time so...I just don't go to the subforum so problem solved.

Y'all seem to have misunderstood me. I have a lot less issue with the OT stuff in OT forums, though i do believe it attracts more casual poster who then stray where they might not should be.

Completely off topic nonsense in a technical thread should be automatic grounds for a vacation ...

 

[ZeeOSix]

Apparently talking about oil, filters and tribology seem to always fall into the "bickering" category and has apparently now become "trivial" discussions ... lol.

There will ALWAYS be some level of "bickering", even when technical discussions are involved. Just the fact that people discuss and debate topics can be viewed to some as "bickering" since everyone will define the level differently.

A lot of times, "bickering" in technical discussions will dig deep and allow people to actual learn something they might not have known before. Seen it happen many times on this board.

 

[ZeeOSix]

There seems to be quite a bit of preemptive thread locking.

Agree, would rather see rule breakers be penalized. Maybe they are. I greatly appreciate the civility here even if it's enforced. There are thousands of places one can go to be rude and use profanity.

In technical debating threads, if a Mod doesn't like how it's going then say something instead of locking it. Like said above, when there is deep dive technical discussion going on there will always seem to be a level of perceived "bickeriing" because people with different opposing views are trying to get their points across with supporting back-up information, links, etc. People learn things from those kind of threads. As long as it doesn't start getting into the personal attack realm then I see no real harm in some technical bickering. Obviosly not everyone agrees with everyone else here, so it we can't talk about technical topics without some opposing views and why, then what use is this chat board?

 

[Lubener]

Some need locking because of the argueing. There are a lot which are interesting that get locked out too.The one which especially should be locked is the 13 year old one with 11k responses named "what are you listening to". That is long enough.

 

[ZeeOSix]

Some need locking because of the argueing. There are a lot which are interesting that get locked out too.The one which especially should be locked is the 13 year old one with 11k responses named "what are you listening to". That is long enough.

Then someone will just start a new thread about the same subject. Might as well lock the "Post your latest oil change" thread too because it's also 13 years old, lol.

 

[TiGeo]

Y'all seem to have misunderstood me. I have a lot less issue with the OT stuff in OT forums, though i do believe it attracts more casual poster who then stray where they might not should be.

Completely off topic nonsense in a technical thread should be automatic grounds for a vacation ...

Ah got it.

 

[DuckRyder]

PM the Mod who locked it, as he'll have the most knowledge about why it was locked in the first place.

As a small point of order: Unless that moderator says so there is no way for us to tell who that is. Often - even most of the time when one is locked they do post a reply though.

When it is sent to quarantine or most report replies there's no way for the unwashed masses to tell who did it.

Case in point:

I had posted an Article thread for UOAs on one of my cars based on an announcement that they were to be enabled and were for keeping running results. This did not work the way I though (and apparently not the way management thought either based on the announcement), Some effort was made to fix it but i wanted to just repost the latest examples in a new thread. I reported it and asked it be locked (because it did have 2 older results in it as well).

I get a report resolved "thread deleted"... No idea who did it or why deleted vs locked.

 

[buster]

There will ALWAYS be some level of "bickering", even when technical discussions are involved. Just the fact that people discuss and debate topics can be viewed to some as "bickering" since everyone will define the level differently.

A lot of times, "bickering" in technical discussions will dig deep and allow people to actual learn something they might not have known before. Seen it happen many times on this board.

View attachment 136549

Yeah it's human nature. Regulating/moderating content can be tricky.