Additive activation

[RROC_guy]

I am engaged in a debate on activating oil additives. My understanding is that oil needs to be heated to normal operating temperature to activate R&O and anti-wear additives. Therefore if a car is to be idle for a period of time, after changing oil it is important to run the car to fully warm up the engine before storage so the R&O additives will be fully active during the period of storage.

Any comment or good technical reference substantiating this?

 

[Jim Allen]

Interesting question. I don't know enough to answer it definitively, but it doesn't sound right. Oil is often heated for blending, so if your theory is correct,and you have to heat it once to activate, then that's taken care of during the blending process.

In any case, kudos for a much more interesting topic than most of the recent ones (my oil's better than your oil, nyah-nyah-na-nyah nyah).

 

[rg200amp]

I do not believe so. The OIL needs to be at operating temp for the OIL to work at its prime yes.

However, heat activated is not how I would put it. The additives are there regardless. The overall oil(base oil included) is what works best at operating temp.

Now, some people will change there oil after a long storage.

So, going with heat activated additives are non exsistant, no I have never heard of anyone "warming up" there car with new oil before storage. Pleople run the cars hard and long if there storing it with old oil to evaporate any water or fuel dilution.

Futhermore, even if there was a thing as "heat activated" additives, there is no reason to "activate" them since the car will not be used. Why would you activate anti wear additives when the car is sitting and getting no wear?

Also; there would be no reason to start and run a car with new oil in it before you store it. It defeats the whole point of putting new oil in there. All you risk is storing your car with a little water/fuel dilution in it.


That is my take on the subject.


Welcome to BITOG RROC_guy

 

[AEHaas]

Additives each have a temperature range at which their intended function works best. There is a single temperature where the performance is highest then a sort of a bell shaped curve of decreasing function above and below. This bell can be severely skewed in one of the directions.

It is different for each additive based on the physical/chemical properties. There are often several additives with the same function that work at different temperatures so that the overlapping ranges cover the areas of normal use.

All this adding to the complexity of formulating an oil for general use and one of the many reasons you should not be mixing oils of different types. They may be "compatible" but this does not mean they work appropriately at best efficacy.

aehaas

 

[Tempest]

What Dr Haas has stated is good info.

The additives from your current oil will have built up films on the metal to protect it. There is NO reason to idle the car after an oil change. This may even be more damaging...at some tiny scale.

 

[bruce381]

IMHO so called actiavation applys mostly to AW and EP type additives

 

[mechtech2]

The anti foaming additive does not depend on heat. Neither does the anti acid additive.
Some friction or wear additives may require a certain temperature or pressure to be of maximum benefit.

 

[itchrelief]

This is completely an uninformed layman's opinion.

"Heat activation" IMO only applies as long as the additive is at the heat activated temperature.

In your example, once the engine cools down, the additives will be deactivated as they drop out of the activated temperature range.

If you would like to argue otherwise, then I would reply with:

If the additive does not deactivate once it cools down, then you would only ever have to reach activation temperature once, then your additive would forever be activated until your next OCI. Then, you could have an infinite number of cold starts after that first activation event (disregarding viscosity effects_ and you would have no adverse wear. But that sounds wrong, right?

Thus, I say that it is pointless to heat the oil before storage, because the additives will all de-activate once they cool down.

P.S. I'm massively smashed and drunk while I post this, so if the logic doesn't pan out, then I can blame the booze.

cheers

 

[edhackett]

My understanding is that the EP/AW additives are activated by the heat and pressure created at a metal to metal contact point or from the higher friction found under boundary lube conditions. They are activated when and where needed.

Ed

 

[Liquid_Turbo]

This might not be directly related to your question, but here's a technical paper with a section regarding additive depletion:

http://cid-ada1e19227939272.skydrive.live.com/self.aspx/Public/Drain Intervals.pdf

 

[steve20]

Thanks Brian-great articles
Steve

 

[toocrazy2yoo]

Originally Posted By: itchrelief
This is completely an uninformed layman's opinion.

"Heat activation" IMO only applies as long as the additive is at the heat activated temperature.

In your example, once the engine cools down, the additives will be deactivated as they drop out of the activated temperature range.

If you would like to argue otherwise, then I would reply with:

If the additive does not deactivate once it cools down, then you would only ever have to reach activation temperature once, then your additive would forever be activated until your next OCI. Then, you could have an infinite number of cold starts after that first activation event (disregarding viscosity effects_ and you would have no adverse wear. But that sounds wrong, right?

Thus, I say that it is pointless to heat the oil before storage, because the additives will all de-activate once they cool down.

P.S. I'm massively smashed and drunk while I post this, so if the logic doesn't pan out, then I can blame the booze.

cheers


Yeah, I always sit down with a case of beer and BITOG..How about you guys?