Accord hybrid or Camry Hybrid, pre-purchase inspection?

[MoneyJohn]

Now that Sentra's transmission went kaput, I need to buy a car. While the time is not right, I don't have much choice. Looking at hybrids due to commuting distance.

Hardly any hybrids in the used car market and all local dealerships still have 'market adjustments'. Looking at Camry hybrid and accord hybrid. I understand that Toyota's hybrid system is more mature, so it commands premium. I wonder how does Honda's hybrid system stack against it in terms of reliability.

Added question, what entails in hybrid's pre-purchase inspection?

Thanks in advance.

Edit: My daily commute now is 48 miles round trip. 50-50 highway-city driving. City driving is usually crawling bumper to bumper traffic.

 

[meep]

Honda has had hybrids from around the early 2000s, so it should be solid tech for them by now - I have yet to hear a single complaint against them. It’s a more conservative system with a single motor/generator inline with the engine/transmission, I think directly in between them. No reliability issues I’m aware of. You are right, they don’t get a lot of press on it.

note, hybrid tech has a greater impact on city driving than highway. I do feel hybrid tech is the sweet spot right now for efficiency.

my son‘s 2018 civic MT with the 1.5t gets remarkable mpg, probably close to if not equal to a civic hybrid *on the highway*. I’ve always considered a Jetta tdi would be a *great* distance commuter if you are comfortable with the VW around it (not everyone is).

 

[supton]

Was not aware of Honda’s setup having issues, not with the transmission anyhow. 1.5L turbos and fuel dilution maybe, but not with their CVT/eCVT?

Dumb question, the Sentra’s transmission went out, but, what is the cost differential between repairing vs buying a new car? If the answer is, I hate the Sentra and want to move on, fine, just playing devil’s advocate. Buying a car when under pressure is never fun, and can sometimes lead to regret later.

 

[eljefino]

The first gen honda civic hybrid was trash, nothing like the Prius. Not sure where they stand now, though.

 

[meep]

The first gen honda civic hybrid was trash, nothing like the Prius. Not sure where they stand now, though.

@eljefino - I had no idea… a friend had one and loved it. I rode in it often and it seemed well sorted, to my limited exposure. what kinds of problems did they have?

 

[MoneyJohn]

Dumb question, the Sentra’s transmission went out, but, what is the cost differential between repairing vs buying a new car? If the answer is, I hate the Sentra and want to move on, fine, just playing devil’s advocate. Buying a car when under pressure is never fun, and can sometimes lead to regret later.

Not a dumb question at all. While I don't really *like* Sentra, it was much better than having car payments. And since I like Benjamins, I would have ran Sentra till the wheels fall off. But the rust is eating the car up and fixing it would not have lasted much. The motor mounts just broke and the mechanic was not in favor of replacing it. I still asked him to change. Plus, due to the rust, in an event of crash, safety would be compromised.

You are absolutely correct, buying car under pressure is no fun. I was quite disappointed when I read the code and then the mechanic gave his verdict.

 

[SC Maintenance]

Which models / years are you looking at. The situation varies.

Early Honda Hybrids weren't very good - they were a kneejerk reaction to the Prius. They were underpowered and didn't save that much gas. I think they have caught up.

The Toyota system has been pretty good, but there are some minor issues. Some of the earlier Hylander Hybrids had rear differential issues at high miles - so I read - and the only solution was to replace the whole thing as its integrate with the motor.

Newer Rav4 Hybrids have had issues with corrosion on the main cable that goes to the rear diff - they only come in AWD.

As mentioned, highway miles hybrids aren't that much more efficient than ICE, so again if its a long highway commute, it may not be worth it anyway.

 

[slacktide_bitog]

Since you mention PPI, that means you're buying used and not new. You might like the Ford C-Max. It borrows Toyota's hybrid tech, and if you're lucky, you can find a plugin hybrid called Energi.

How old are you willing to go? If you're willing to buy an "older" car, consider the Echo or Yaris. Toyota makes awesome cars.

 

[skyactiv]

A ECVT is not a CVT. The auto makers made a mistake naming it ECVT because it has made for internet misinformation and some lost sales.


I'd have to get a very good deal on buying a used hybrid because a new battery isn't cheap. Buying a used hybrid battery off eBay that is so-called tested is a gamble.


There are people that can't think outside the box and can't imagine buying anything but a Toyota or Honda.

My wife bought a 2021 Corolla Hybrid. I drive it a lot. The 23's have more power but are rated less EPA highway.

I would have bought a Jetta 1.4 with a stick. Those get great gas mileage and are reliable enough. VW's are better than Honda and Toyotas dealing with long ownership rust issues I think. I also think VW steering, brakes and suspension holds up better.

 

[atikovi]

My daily commute now is 48 miles round trip. 50-50 highway-city driving. City driving is usually crawling bumper to bumper traffic.

Hybrids have many high tech and expensive components that few shops can service, and for what, to get maybe 45 mpg instead of 35 mpg in a non-hybrid. You're only saving about $300 a year on gas. With that said, the Camrys are pretty trouble-free and have EV mode which I don't think Hondas do until a bit later. Also look at Kia Optima hybrids which have a real transmission instead of a CVT. Maybe consider a first gen Leaf instead that should do 48 miles and is pretty cheap now, or even a plug-in like the Volt.

 

[atikovi]

I would have bought a Jetta 1.4 with a stick. Those get great gas mileage and are reliable enough.

The Jetta hybrid only came with an automatic and those transmissions have many problems of their own.

 

[supton]

Hybrids have many high tech and expensive components that few shops can service, and for what, to get maybe 45 mpg instead of 35 mpg in a non-hybrid. You're only saving about $300 a year on gas.

Just paid $3.39 a gallon; the savings would be $538 as we drive 25k/yr. Not average but if one “needs” to buy new, it can help defray the fuel cost.

*

My Jetta definitely held up better and was more fun to drive, no doubt.

 

[atikovi]

Just paid $3.39 a gallon; the savings would be $538 as we drive 25k/yr. Not average but if one “needs” to buy new, it can help defray the fuel cost.

*

My Jetta definitely held up better and was more fun to drive, no doubt.

OP said 48 miles a day which is 12,000 miles a year. 342 gallons at 35 mpg vs. 266 at 45 mpg. He would save maybe $300 a year on gas. A new battery pack alone is going to cost 10 times as much. PHAD has one right now,

 

[riverblue]

Honda's new iMMD system has been in their hybrid products since 2014 and has nothing in common with the older IMA system. There is no CVT or eCVT in the iMMD system; it's essentially transmission-less.

Straight from the source, if you want to learn how the system works:

Honda Global | Sport Hybrid i-MMD - Picture Book

Honda Motor Co.,Ltd. Honda Global Site - Visit the official Honda global web site and find information on all Honda Motor and its subsidiaries and affiliates.

global.honda

 

[skyactiv]

The Jetta hybrid only came with an automatic and those transmissions have many problems of their own.

I was talking about if I had my choice at the time we bought the Corolla in 2021. I would have got a non hybrid 2021 Jetta 1.4 with a stick.

 

[MoneyJohn]

@skyactiv

Your points are valid. I have been seriously thinking about maintenance cost of hybrids. Overall, I don't find much problems with toyota hybrids. The current gen Honda hybrids are newer and do not have much information.

I did consider Jetta (automatic), but I am not informed about the maintenance costs, and City mpg in mid 20s, not too sure if I will get any different mileage than current Forester.

 

[MoneyJohn]

@atikovi

I am trying to stay out of HyunKia world because of the way they royally messed up Theta engine issue. It is safe to say, if there are any issues, there will no support from the manufacturer.

I thought of Bolt but I live in a rental and they are not interested in installing chargers. I do not have a way to charge at work. So that idea fell off quickly.

 

[atikovi]

@atikovi

I am trying to stay out of HyunKia world because of the way they royally messed up Theta engine issue. It is safe to say, if there are any issues, there will no support from the manufacturer.

No support? They have been replacing engines for free even on cars with over 100,000 miles.

 

[wemay]

I owned a Hyundai Ionic hybrid for some time and really liked it but IMO, no one does Hybrid better than Toyota.

As a total package, I'd prefer a Hyundai. But strictly speaking powertrain smoothness...Toyota.

 

[MoneyJohn]

No support? They have been replacing engines for free even on cars with over 100,000 miles.

It took a lot of hand twisting though. The cars were going up in flames and they were trying to blame the drivers rather than admitting the fault, and issuing a recall. Canada's public broadcaster even had to do an episode on the issues.
In contrast, Forester I have has known transmission issue. Although we have had no problems Subaru preemptively extended transmission warranty. So HyunKia do not get thumbs up in my book.