94 accord wagon T/C lock-up

[berge]

hello
purchased 94 LX accord wagon with automatic transmission. T/C is not locking up, at all, car drives perfect otherwise.
I've done a 4X drain, no change.
Went through the diagnostic tree in Honda service manual, and everything checks out fine. There are no codes.
I remember a Honda mechanic friend mentioning a long time ago that the A/T's on the 94-97 Accords, 95/98 Odyssey's were prone to this problem and the tech's were advised to just keep draining/driving until lock up operation would resume as per spec. With Honda atf Z1, this is starting to get a little expensive. I would continue with the drain's if I thought it was helping, but nothing has changed.
Has anyone experienced anything like this and what did you do to resolve the issue.
thanks

 

[BearZDefect]

When I was looking for a used Accord I test drove two automatics: a 95 w/100k miles and a 97 w/80k miles. Both had lock-up issues, I didn't buy. I ended up buying a 91 wagon with a 5sp that has a different set of issues.

Anyway, have you had any luck getting advice elsewhere? You'll need input from Honda gurus, perhaps someone on the BAT Auto 'Imports' forum can offer you a suggestion.

 

[berge]

compared to my 94 sedan, I noticed the temp gauge was running a bit cooler in the wagon. thought it was a lazy sensor and didn't think much of it.
thought more of it when I went for a quiet highway cruise at a very cold night and the temp. gauge plummetted almost cold start territory.
the thermostat was sticking open.
I changed it and will report back on the t/c lockup issue.

thanks.

 

[CharBaby]

I had some reasonable success with LubeGard Red bottle in an older Accord. Seem to free up things in an auto transmission. Purchaced at NAPA. You've changed the fluid enough now! Keep us posted.

 

[ChrisW]

Umm..how do you know if the TC is lockign up? Suppose you are cruising at 40mph, let off the gas, it should keep the revs up while slowing down? Could a non-locking TC cause bad gas milage?

 

[berge]

we have t/c lockup. the thermostat was the culprit.
however, I feel that, compared to the sedan, it seems to be too eager to unlock. on the sedan, you need at least 1/4 throttle or a substantial grade to get out of lockup, with the wagon, you just touch the throttle, and whamo, +500RPM.
I guess I'm not finished yet. oh well.

 

[berge]

Char Baby
Member # 7090 posted 29-11-2005 10:22
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I had some reasonable success with LubeGard Red bottle in an older Accord. Seem to free up things in an auto transmission. Purchaced at NAPA. You've changed the fluid enough now! Keep us posted.

I was under the impression that it was lubeguard 'black' that was used to convert DEXIII to Honda specs. What exactly did the 'RED' do for your car?

 

[berge]

ChrisW
Member # 2748 posted 29-11-2005 17:34
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Umm..how do you know if the TC is lockign up? Suppose you are cruising at 40mph, let off the gas, it should keep the revs up while slowing down? Could a non-locking TC cause bad gas milage?

It is locking up, I just know. It's just a little too trigger happy to unlock, compared to my success. lifting off at cruise, it holds the revs, but if you just goose the throttle at cruise, it unlocks immediately. the lock up mechanism, if not functioning properly, will have a tremendous impact on fuel economy, which is the main reason I got an accord wagon.

 

[berge]

the throtte and transmission kickdown cables seem significantly 'tighter' than on my sedan.
will check with service manual and adjust tension.

if not, I'm fearing a bad TPS, which means I have to get a junkyard throttle body.

 

[BearZDefect]

berge, glad to hear the new thermostat helped your lock-up engage, even if it is still "trigger happy". Makes sense since many autos won't lock up while cold.

The Accord wagon is geared shorter than the sedan to handle the extra weight, etc. What kind of highway mpg do you get with your wagon?

 

[berge]

haven't done a full tank yet, actually. just replaced the leaking gas tank and now that I have a locking converter, I should know in a couple of days.

you're right about the gearing, it's 4.1 vs almost 4.3, translates to an extra 250rpm at 70mph.

 

[CharBaby]

berg member#3148: The Accord I am refering to is of the older gen3/1986-89. The transmission fluid required is DexII or any other Dexron that superceeds. The LubeGard RED bottle is only an ATF Protectant. The RED bottle helps to reduce temperatures, prevent shudder, free up torque converters lock up's, etc. The BLACK bottle is a high friction modifier (HFM). It is to be added to only Dexron type ATF so that it can convert the DEX to the brand specific ATF required by the car manufacturer. The BLACK bottle also has much if not all of the benefits of the RED bottle as well. I hope this has helped!

 

[berge]

I have the black bottle, but honestly, I kind of prefer the way it shifts with just dexIII. nice and crisp.
can't wait to finish the auto rx treatment so i can put the M1 ATF in there.

 

[CharBaby]

berg.....Typicaly, Honda auto transmissions shift quite firm, or as you say,"nice and crisp". The LubeGard black bottle(HFM), could take some of the crispness out of the shifting. If you used too much HFM for example, it may cause some slippage in the shifting, therefore allowing the transmission to shift more smoothly,(which most people like). This slippage does create more heat in the transmission. Im sure that the doseage that you used is just fine. The usual doseage of LubeGard Black is 1oz. of HFM per each qt. of ATF(Dexron of course) that you are adding to the transmission.

 

[berge]

lubeguard does make it shift just like it has honda atf z1, that's true.
call me weird, I just like the way it shifts with M1 atf much better.

 

[CharBaby]

berge,
I don't think that there is anything wrong with liking the way M1 works,(to each his own!) Actually, firmer shifting auto transmissions create less heat and therefore don't "typicaly" burn up their fluid as soon as a smooth shifting transmission. I personaly like a firm shifting transmission in, for example, a Honda, Mazda and a smooth shifting transmission in a Toyota, Buick, Caddy. Just depends on the car.

 

[berge]

problem solved.
it was the throttle cable.

 

[CharBaby]

berg,
Thanks for keeping us posted and I hope everything is working to your satisfaction now!

 

[berge]

got my first tanks results, quite pleased.
50/50 city/highway. with the highway part at cruising speeds of 80mph on the 407. still haven't completely solved the t/c lockup issue yet btw.

24mpg.

I love honda's.