2026 BMW m340i 0W-12 Only?

[RBT]

They’re not hiding anything. They are bound by the EPA award and obligated to strenuously dissuade the consumer from using any grade which wasn’t used for the fuel consumption testing. If you think that is hyperbole then read one of the EPA letters to the manufacturer.

None of the mechanical stuff you list has anything to do with it. That engine will operate just fine on a 50-grade as @edyvw noted.

That is very interesting. Another reason they need to be reigned in. Are these letters publicly available? Thank you.

 

[GW.]

That is very interesting. Another reason they need to be reigned in. Are these letters publicly available? Thank you.

Here’s an older copy. If I remember correctly a current letter is even more strict.

 

[RBT]

Thank you. I need to get my glasses but will read it/

Edit: Quick read without glasses is that they really need to be reigned in.

Unrelated but I think illustrative aside: Had to recently buy a water heater (electric). Wanted to get a 75 gallon like the one that was there. Turns out that, thanks to our friends at the EPA, any water heater over a certain size (think it is 55 or 60 gallons) has to have a heat pump built into the heating element to increase efficiency. And these heaters now cost substantially more because of said added complexity. So as a consumer, I get to buy something that is almost twice as expensive (if not more for certain brands) and more complex and likely to break so I can save a small increment of electricity. It's not to say I am OK with waste - not at all, I am actually a fairly conservative person when it comes to money. But with water, you save by, for example, doing large loads of laundry and telling the teenagers to hang their towels up a few times (or hang the pool towels outside a few times) before just throwing them into the wash. The level of complexity and cost to gain an increment of efficiency is out of hand.

 

[GW.]

Thank you. I need to get my glasses but will read it/

Edit: Quick read without glasses is that they really need to be reigned in.

Unrelated but I think illustrative aside: Had to recently buy a water heater (electric). Wanted to get a 75 gallon like the one that was there. Turns out that, thanks to our friends at the EPA, any water heater over a certain size (think it is 55 or 60 gallons) has to have a heat pump built into the heating element to increase efficiency. And these heaters now cost substantially more because of said added complexity. So as a consumer, I get to buy something that is almost twice as expensive (if not more for certain brands) and more complex and likely to break so I can save a small increment of electricity. It's not to say I am OK with waste - not at all, I am actually a fairly conservative person when it comes to money. But with water, you save by, for example, doing large loads of laundry and telling the teenagers to hang their towels up a few times (or hang the pool towels outside a few times) before just throwing them into the wash. The level of complexity and cost to gain an increment of efficiency is out of hand.

That’s crazy. Plus heat pump water heaters require ample room for installation and correct operation.

 

[Nessism1]

I'm considering an M340i as my "retirement" car. How do you like the car? Do you have the adaptive dampers, and how is ride quality? Regarding the oil, 0W-12 is ridiculous. If I get one of those cars I'll be looking for something thicker.

 

[billt460]

It simply cannot be a mechanical requirement of all that stuff - or the engine would fail to function properly when it was cold, and the oil was a hundred times thicker than it is at operating temperature.

This is my argument with all of these "ONLY" thin oil viscosity recommendations.... A vehicle sitting in a driveway in Fairbanks in January, with a crankcase full of 0W-16, is going to have a much thicker startup viscosity, than that same vehicle with a crankcase full of 10W-40 sitting in a driveway in Palm Springs in July.

 

[CleanSump]

It actually makes sense. The manufacturer can't use a special oil to cheat the test - it must be the oil they will use in production and if they're going to put gas mileage numbers on window stickers, documentation, and advertising, they must place the oil used to get those numbers in the documentation given to the consumer. From a Gov side of the picture, it's antifraud protection for the consumer.

 

[jackal2001]

They’re not hiding anything. They are bound by the EPA award and obligated to strenuously dissuade the consumer from using any grade which wasn’t used for the fuel consumption testing. If you think that is hyperbole then read one of the EPA letters to the manufacturer.

None of the mechanical stuff you list has anything to do with it. That engine will operate just fine on a 50-grade as @edyvw noted.

I should have clarified that they state in articles and videos those new technologies require 0W-12, making me think it is a mechanical requirement, when in fact it isn't. It doesn't help the consumer that every sticker and statement in the manual says to only use 0W-12 also.

 

[jackal2001]

I'm considering an M340i as my "retirement" car. How do you like the car? Do you have the adaptive dampers, and how is ride quality? Regarding the oil, 0W-12 is ridiculous. If I get one of those cars I'll be looking for something thicker.

This is my plan. I'm 53 and I'm done leasing a new car every 3 years and only putting less thank 10k miles on them at turn in time. Yes I have the m adaptive suspension. I have every option except the drivers assistance pro package. Even with adaptive suspension, some bumps/ potholes are still rough.

 

[shortyb]

That is very interesting. Another reason they need to be reigned in eliminated.

Fixed it for ya .

 

[wemay]

Hey,
Welcome to BITOG.
1. You have to think about warranty. The chances of BMW checking what oil you use are small, but they are there. In case something happens, they might ask for receipts etc. I personally would change oil at BMW during warranty every 10k. In between, I would do my own oil changes every 5K. I personally would never run such oil, BUT warranty is warranty.
2. You have GPF I think. That means you must run something that is low/mid SAPS, preferably approved for LL04. BMWs have a very stringent timing chain test. While Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 is exceptional stuff, and I use it, I would go Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 since it is LL04. That is after warranty. But if you don't care about warranty, that is the oil I would go with if you are going with over the shelf stuff.
3. If you are going with something boutique, check HPL Euro stuff that meets LL04 in 0W30 and 5W30 flavor, or Amsoil 5W30 AEL. Redline has Euro 5W30 that also meets LL04.

With this engine, the VANOS is not using oil pressure, but it is electronically controlled. However, keep in mind that your engine, when cold, runs much, MUCH thicker oil and it survives. Running thicker oil than recommended is never an issue. Running thinner oil is. Now, since it is a mild hybrid, there is an argument that thinner oil is better. But again, that system also works when the oil is thicker during warming up. I personally would stick to 30 grade (not 40) in LL04 flavor. If it doesn't have GPF, then we can talk LL01 options.

Also, that link you provided. Is absolutely useless. When I read this sentence: "Thinner oil flows faster at startup, reduces pumping losses, and allows BMW to run tighter bearing clearances without sacrificing hydrodynamic lubrication," I knew where this is going. 0W is 0W. It does not matter is it 0W12, 20, 30 or 40, it has to meet certain requirements when it comes to dynamic viscosity to be 0W. He confuses cold cranking performance (measured in CCS and MRV) with HTHS. Absolutely useless article.

This, 100%. Stick with the "required" oil for the warranty period, then switch to whatever you'd like. That 0w-12 is more viscous in a Canadian winter than a 5w-30 is here in Miami.

 

[jackal2001]

Hey,
Welcome to BITOG.
1. You have to think about warranty. The chances of BMW checking what oil you use are small, but they are there. In case something happens, they might ask for receipts etc. I personally would change oil at BMW during warranty every 10k. In between, I would do my own oil changes every 5K. I personally would never run such oil, BUT warranty is warranty.
2. You have GPF I think. That means you must run something that is low/mid SAPS, preferably approved for LL04. BMWs have a very stringent timing chain test. While Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 is exceptional stuff, and I use it, I would go Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 since it is LL04. That is after warranty. But if you don't care about warranty, that is the oil I would go with if you are going with over the shelf stuff.
3. If you are going with something boutique, check HPL Euro stuff that meets LL04 in 0W30 and 5W30 flavor, or Amsoil 5W30 AEL. Redline has Euro 5W30 that also meets LL04.

With this engine, the VANOS is not using oil pressure, but it is electronically controlled. However, keep in mind that your engine, when cold, runs much, MUCH thicker oil and it survives. Running thicker oil than recommended is never an issue. Running thinner oil is. Now, since it is a mild hybrid, there is an argument that thinner oil is better. But again, that system also works when the oil is thicker during warming up. I personally would stick to 30 grade (not 40) in LL04 flavor. If it doesn't have GPF, then we can talk LL01 options.

Also, that link you provided. Is absolutely useless. When I read this sentence: "Thinner oil flows faster at startup, reduces pumping losses, and allows BMW to run tighter bearing clearances without sacrificing hydrodynamic lubrication," I knew where this is going. 0W is 0W. It does not matter is it 0W12, 20, 30 or 40, it has to meet certain requirements when it comes to dynamic viscosity to be 0W. He confuses cold cranking performance (measured in CCS and MRV) with HTHS. Absolutely useless article.

Also a question. According to this chart I don't see ll04 as approved.

https://g30.bimmerpost.com/forums/a...d=3423135&d=1711912638&utm_source=chatgpt.com

I see LL 22, 17, 12 all approved for the b58b30m2 , b58n with GPF. I don't see anything else listed which is confusing me with all these.

 

[edyvw]

Also a question. According to this chart I don't see ll04 as approved.

https://g30.bimmerpost.com/forums/a...d=3423135&d=1711912638&utm_source=chatgpt.com

I see LL 22, 17, 12 all approved for the b58b30m2 , b58n with GPF. I don't see anything else listed which is confusing me with all these.

Yes. BMW stuff and “recommendations.”
They are only recommending FE (fuel efficiency) oils. However, LL12 could have HTHS 3.49cP. Oils like Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 has HTHS of 3.5cP (HTHS is what matters, not grade).
LL04 is pretty much thicker version of LL22, LL17 or LL12, and generally has more stout base stocks while additive package might be same.

 

[RBT]

It actually makes sense. The manufacturer can't use a special oil to cheat the test - it must be the oil they will use in production and if they're going to put gas mileage numbers on window stickers, documentation, and advertising, they must place the oil used to get those numbers in the documentation given to the consumer. From a Gov side of the picture, it's antifraud protection for the consumer.

Respectfully, if I put my lawyer hat on the issue could just as easily be addressed by telling the consumer that the fuel economy ratings were achieved with a given viscosity and that if you use a “heavier” viscosity then you will see lower economy ratings by X percent and let the owner decide. It is the owners car and the owner’s decision about the trade off between fuel economy and engine protection. Moreover the language they use, and I am sure the manufacturers are just fine to go along with it, gives the manufacturer wiggle room to reject legitimate warranty claims, or at least blow enough smoke that people will refrain from doing anything other than what is in the book or what the dealer says. It actually a lot worse than I thought. And the connection to actual environmental protection is tenuous at best. I mean no disrespect, but this is really breathtaking to exert that degree of regulatory oversight via letter that is not an official agency action and is not subject to public notice (government rule making has to be done per the administrative procedure act).

 

[edyvw]

Respectfully, if I put my lawyer hat on the issue could just as easily be addressed by telling the consumer that the fuel economy ratings were achieved with a given viscosity and that if you use a “heavier” viscosity then you will see lower economy ratings by X percent and let the owner decide. It is the owners car and the owner’s decision about the trade off between fuel economy and engine protection. Moreover the language they use, and I am sure the manufacturers are just fine to go along with it, gives the manufacturer wiggle room to reject legitimate warranty claims, or at least blow enough smoke that people will refrain from doing anything other than what is in the book or what the dealer says. It actually a lot worse than I thought. And the connection to actual environmental protection is tenuous at best. I mean no disrespect, but this is really breathtaking to exert that degree of regulatory oversight via letter that is not an official agency action and is not subject to public notice (government rule making has to be done per the administrative procedure act).

Lower HTHS creates less resistance = less consumption and emissions. Can you notice that? Probably not. However it makes a ding in millions of vehicles. Now, we could argue that advances in technology just led to a fact that people started to drive bigger cars, so here we are.
European manufacturers since 1991 have their own approval process. I explained this to details in several posts and don’t want to repeat it. But, it is designed to help consumers to get the right oil.

 

[RBT]

Right, it’s really not to protect the individual it is for the overall number. Thx.

 

[jackal2001]

Yes. BMW stuff and “recommendations.”
They are only recommending FE (fuel efficiency) oils. However, LL12 could have HTHS 3.49cP. Oils like Mobil 1 ESP 5W30 has HTHS of 3.5cP (HTHS is what matters, not grade).
LL04 is pretty much thicker version of LL22, LL17 or LL12, and generally has more stout base stocks while additive package might be same.

This crap is way too complicated for me.
I guess when it is time for my first oil change I can ask the dealer to put in the approved 0W-20 BMW oil at the dealership instead of the 0w-12 it calls for in the sticker.
If I wanted to do it myself instead of going to the dealer I'm guessing either the BMW TT oil or Mobile 1 ESP 0w20 or 0w-30 is also fine. It really isn't about cost as I only do annual oil changes and I'm under 5k miles annually. I'm looking for something to keep it simple and still get the best protection.

 

[edyvw]

This crap is way too complicated for me.
I guess when it is time for my first oil change I can ask the dealer to put in the approved 0W-20 BMW oil at the dealership instead of the 0w-12 it calls for in the sticker.
If I wanted to do it myself instead of going to the dealer I'm guessing either the BMW TT oil or Mobile 1 ESP 0w20 or 0w-30 is also fine. It really isn't about cost as I only do annual oil changes and I'm under 5k miles annually. I'm looking for something to keep it simple and still get the best protection.

No it is not fine. Mobil 1 ESP 0W20 and 30 don’t carry BMW approvals! Yes you can put oil yourself (keep receipts). BMW has the most stringent requirements when it comes to oxidation. ESP 0W20/30 (0W not 5W) have esters in it (good) but esters bump initial oxidation. It is actually irrelevant, but BMW has its requirements.
If you doing 0W20 get approved oil. I think (I THINK) Castrol Edge 0W20 Extended Performance in Wal Mart carries LL17FE.
After warranty, I personally would use Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 which carries MB229.51/52 (overall most stringent approvals) and it is equivalent of LL04.

 

[jackal2001]

No it is not fine. Mobil 1 ESP 0W20 and 30 don’t carry BMW approvals! Yes you can put oil yourself (keep receipts). BMW has the most stringent requirements when it comes to oxidation. ESP 0W20/30 (0W not 5W) have esters in it (good) but esters bump initial oxidation. It is actually irrelevant, but BMW has its requirements.
If you doing 0W20 get approved oil. I think (I THINK) Castrol Edge 0W20 Extended Performance in Wal Mart carries LL17FE.
After warranty, I personally would use Mobil 1 ESP 0W30 which carries MB229.51/52 (overall most stringent approvals) and it is equivalent of LL04.

You confused me by stating mobil 1 ESP is not fine but then later say it is fine at 0W-30. And eq to ll04.

I know Castrol 0W-20 is LL-17Fe but if I'm looking to go to a 0W-30 should I just buy the bmw TT oil which is LL01 FE?

 

[BIGROCCO]

Thank you. I need to get my glasses but will read it/

Edit: Quick read without glasses is that they really need to be reigned in.

Unrelated but I think illustrative aside: Had to recently buy a water heater (electric). Wanted to get a 75 gallon like the one that was there. Turns out that, thanks to our friends at the EPA, any water heater over a certain size (think it is 55 or 60 gallons) has to have a heat pump built into the heating element to increase efficiency. And these heaters now cost substantially more because of said added complexity. So as a consumer, I get to buy something that is almost twice as expensive (if not more for certain brands) and more complex and likely to break so I can save a small increment of electricity. It's not to say I am OK with waste - not at all, I am actually a fairly conservative person when it comes to money. But with water, you save by, for example, doing large loads of laundry and telling the teenagers to hang their towels up a few times (or hang the pool towels outside a few times) before just throwing them into the wash. The level of complexity and cost to gain an increment of efficiency is out of hand.

FWIW, I chose to buy a GE heat pump water heater when we built our new house 10 years ago. I won't go into all the detail but it has saved me $20/month x 120 months = $2,400 in electric bills so far. And we have pretty low electric rates where we live (SRP utility in Phoenix). It does make a little noise, so I wouldn't want one where it would be in a living space, but ours is in the garage. I have it on the most efficient heat pump only mode, so no resistive elements ever go on, and we have never run short of hot water and knock on wood I have never had to do any repairs. I have replaced the anode rod every 2 years or so...and it's been necessary, probably in part because we also have a water softener.