2013 Subaru Outback Solenoid Replacement

[BHopkins]

Yesterday, the dashboard on my wife's Outback lit up like a Christmas tree. This morning I was able plug in my diagnostic tool, and the predominant codes were P2764 and P0700. From everything I've found, it looks like the torque converter lockup solenoid, on the control valve body, is faulty.

Subaru doesn't list a p/n for the individual solenoids, but instead, they sell the entire control valve body assembly as a repair for the CVT. However, I found where Dorman offers a replacement solenoid, and others have had success with using it to rebuild the control valve body. I don't have a lot of confidence in Dorman parts, so I did some more searching, and found a few other options, and ordered a Fusch lockup solenoid.

I'm curious if anyone else has any experience with replacing solenoids on the control valve body in a Subaru TR580 CVT. Was the Fusch solenoid a good choice, or is there another that would be a better choice? Perhaps @SubieRubyRoo or someone else has done this?

 

[Hirev]

You might check out MrSubaru1387

 

[CarbonToast]

I replaced this solenoid on our 2015 Forester about 6 months ago with a Dorman Part. You also need the 2 orings that go between the valve body and transmission. I used a new cover gasket as well.
There is a ground eyelet on the solenoid harness that I broke. So I had to crimp on a new eyelet.

 

[BHopkins]

I replaced this solenoid on our 2015 Forester about 6 months ago with a Dorman Part. You also need the 2 orings that go between the valve body and transmission. I used a new cover gasket as well.
There is a ground eyelet on the solenoid harness that I broke. So I had to crimp on a new eyelet.

Thanks for sharing your experience with this. I watched a video of a guy (Doing Stuff With Dylan) who has quite a bit of experience with doing this solenoid replacement, and he says he almost always breaks off the ground eyelet. I guess I need to plan on it.

I picked up the o-rings and a new gasket from the nearest Subaru dealership yesterday. I also got the o-ring and seal for the CVT fill and drain plugs, as I'm planning on doing a drain and fill at the same time. I just ordered 8 quarts of HPL CVT fluid, and paid almost to the dollar, what I would have for Subaru CVTII fluid.

Besides the ground wire eyelet, were there any other surprises or hiccups that may help me?

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

I haven’t had any issues so far with the unit in my Ascent. I’d ask @Trav on his opinion.

 

[BHopkins]

Thanks for sharing this Mr. Subaru video, @Hirev. I'm assuming the reason you shared it, is where, starting at about 8:30, he talks about the solenoid failures on the valve body, and says that the aftermarket replacement solenoids tend to fail at a much faster rate, and suggests just replacing the entire control valve body.

I did a lot of searching on the SubaruOutback discussion board, and while I did find one person, who said the Dorman solenoid failed after 4 months, no one else reported early failures. Time will tell.

But the total cost of solenoid, gasket and o-rings is less than $60. The quote I got from a local Subaru dealership for valve body, gasket and o-rings is $983.61. And, contrary to what Mr. Subaru implies, it isn't necessary to change the CVT fluid when changing out the solenoid, or the entire valve body. Even the Subaru service manual says only to "adjust the CVTF level" after completing the job.

To me, it is worth the risk. Even if I have to replace the solenoid a few times, before I got one that lasted, it would be worth it. After all, the labor really isn't too bad. It's only about an hour job.

At 159k miles, my wife's Outback is right in that 150k - 200k mile range where he says the failure typically occurs. It is also interesting that he says 90% of the time, it is the torque converter lockup solenoid that fails. There are two other solenoids on the valve body that I believe are interchangeable. If the aftermarket solenoids prove to be as unreliable as Mr. Subaru claims, it may be an option to pull a control valve body out of a CVT, at a pull-a-part, and use a solenoid from a position other than torque converter lock-up, since they get nowhere near the same cycle.

 

[D60]

Using Dorman electrical parts inside a transmission......well, there's a fine line between genius and insanity

 

[IveBeenRued]

I just had those same codes on my 2012 Impreza. I went with the Dorman part and OEM gasket and o-rings. It was a few hours but not complex stuff. Very few reviews the Dorman solenoid and one mentioned it only lasted 4-6K miles. At $64 including the gasket, o-rings, and solenoid vs $800+ for the new valve body, I figure it’s a good enough gamble. This car only does 3K per year so even I have to do this job annually, it’s not a big deal.

Can’t comment on longevity of the Dorman solenoid as it has less than 50 miles on it. I can confirm that I didn’t have to do the whole “CVT Relearn” process. You will likely have to do that if you replace the entire valve body.

Oh, and I called three different dealers about the codes. I got answers ranging from “rodents probably chewed a wire” to “needs a new transmission”. The one dealer quote $2300 for parts and labor to replace the valve body.

 

[BHopkins]

@IveBeenRued, thanks for sharing. It's helpful to hear from someone else that has just done the same job. Even though I'm replacing only the one solenoid, I think I'm going to do the relearn process, since my diagnostic tool does it. I've watched a couple videos on the process, including one from Mr. Subaru, and if a person knows how to follow instructions, it looks pretty straightforward, and should only take a few minutes.

 

[IndyIan]

This may have something useful for you too

 

[CarbonToast]

Thanks for sharing your experience with this. I watched a video of a guy (Doing Stuff With Dylan) who has quite a bit of experience with doing this solenoid replacement, and he says he almost always breaks off the ground eyelet. I guess I need to plan on it.

I picked up the o-rings and a new gasket from the nearest Subaru dealership yesterday. I also got the o-ring and seal for the CVT fill and drain plugs, as I'm planning on doing a drain and fill at the same time. I just ordered 8 quarts of HPL CVT fluid, and paid almost to the dollar, what I would have for Subaru CVTII fluid.

Besides the ground wire eyelet, were there any other surprises or hiccups that may help me?

The cover has 2 dowels which were corroded so it took a little effort to get it off. That was the main suprise.

I didn't reprogram anything, just drove easy for a few days.

It's a good time to clean the throttle body. I think the coolant lines were a little tough coming off.

 

[CarbonToast]

Using Dorman electrical parts inside a transmission......well, there's a fine line between genius and insanity

My Subaru has Dorman balljoints, control arm bushings, and the solenoid. I must be insane!

 

[CarbonToast]

Thanks for sharing this Mr. Subaru video, @Hirev. I'm assuming the reason you shared it, is where, starting at about 8:30, he talks about the solenoid failures on the valve body, and says that the aftermarket replacement solenoids tend to fail at a much faster rate, and suggests just replacing the entire control valve body.

I did a lot of searching on the SubaruOutback discussion board, and while I did find one person, who said the Dorman solenoid failed after 4 months, no one else reported early failures. Time will tell.

But the total cost of solenoid, gasket and o-rings is less than $60. The quote I got from a local Subaru dealership for valve body, gasket and o-rings is $983.61. And, contrary to what Mr. Subaru implies, it isn't necessary to change the CVT fluid when changing out the solenoid, or the entire valve body. Even the Subaru service manual says only to "adjust the CVTF level" after completing the job.

To me, it is worth the risk. Even if I have to replace the solenoid a few times, before I got one that lasted, it would be worth it. After all, the labor really isn't too bad. It's only about an hour job.

At 159k miles, my wife's Outback is right in that 150k - 200k mile range where he says the failure typically occurs. It is also interesting that he says 90% of the time, it is the torque converter lockup solenoid that fails. There are two other solenoids on the valve body that I believe are interchangeable. If the aftermarket solenoids prove to be as unreliable as Mr. Subaru claims, it may be an option to pull a control valve body out of a CVT, at a pull-a-part, and use a solenoid from a position other than torque converter lock-up, since they get nowhere near the same cycle.

Your idea about using the other solenoids is awesome. Maybe even rotating the OE solenoid into the lockup position and then putting the Dorman in the lighter duty cycle spot.

 

[Marcozi]

Your idea about using the other solenoids is awesome. Maybe even rotating the OE solenoid into the lockup position and then putting the Dorman in the lighter duty cycle spot.

Pure genius!

 

[BHopkins]

Well, yesterday I pulled to valve body to replace the bad solenoid, and I learned things that I had not expected. Let me share. This is a little long, but imho, well worth the read.

When I got the valve body out and on the bench, I decided to verify the bad solenoid with a resistance check. Yea, I know - I should have done this before pulling the valve body from the tranny. I checked the resistance from the connector on the valve boy, and the lock-up solenoid read 1.52 Ohms. Spec. is 10 - 13.5 Ohms. This confirmed that the lock-up solenoid was bad - or so I thought.

I pulled the solenoid, and when I did, I noticed a black film on the lead wires, particularly the negative. It easily wiped off, and I realized it was very fine metal shavings. Being OCD as I am, I cleaned the bad solenoid before I set it aside. I checked resistance on the new solenoid, and it read 12.5, so I installed it, and was about to reassemble the valve body when I did another resistance check on the bad solenoid. It read 12.1 Ohms! I tested it again and again, with the same results.

I finally concluded that the fine metal shaving had created a conductive path between the terminals, which resulted in the 1.52 Ohms, and the P2764 and P0700 codes being generated. And I suspect the reason the lock-up solenoid is more susceptible to buildup, is because it cycles more, thus creating a magnetic field more often than the other solenoids, thus attracting the metal particles at a much faster rate.

After thoroughly testing the "bad" OEM solenoid, and determining that now, once clean, it was good, I decided to reinstall the OEM solenoid, but only after also removing the Primary Up solenoid from the valve body, cleaning it up, and swapping position between these two solenoids. I reassembled the valve body, took resistance readings at the connector on all the solenoids, and found them all to read in spec. So I put everything back together, and put the aftermarket solenoid on the shelf as a spare.

I haven't test drove the car yet, as I'm waiting for HPL CVT fluid to be delivered tomorrow, so I do a drain and fill, but with all solenoids now in spec, I don't expect any problems.

Has anyone else ever seen anything like this? It raised the question in my mind - how many solenoids, or even valve bodies, have been replaced unnecessarily, when all that was needed was a thorough cleaning?

 

[CarbonToast]

Wow. Really good catch! I wonder if mine had the same failure mode. I'll be checking for this issue if it even happens again.

 

[BHopkins]

This whole experience has left me wondering, could the risk of valve body solenoid failures be significantly reduced by regularly dropping the transmission pan, and replacing the filter/screen and thoroughly cleaning the metallic sludge from the magnet that is in the bottom of the pan? This guy touches on this, and his point about the magnet losing its ability to be effective, once it is covered with metallic sludge, seems sound.



Admittedly, with almost 160k miles on my Outback, I have never dropped the pan when doing a fluid drain and fill, but instead I have always just drained through the drain plug. This is partly because of my misunderstanding that the only filter in the TRS580 CVT, is impractical to replace, except with a full tranny teardown. I didn't know until studying up for this valve body repair, that there is also a traditional style transmission filter in the TRS580 CVT. So I picked one up today, and will be replacing this filter as soon as the HPL CVT fluid that I ordered has arrived.

 

[RF Overlord]

@BHopkins: That's some mighty fine sleuthing, son.

Be interested to see how much sludge is on the magnet when you change the pan filter.

 

[BHopkins]

Here is the latest update. After getting my delivery of HPL CVT fluid, I replaced the filter, cleaned the magnet in the bottom of the transmission pan, refilled the transmission with fluid, did a second drain and fill, and then proceeded to do a transmission relearn.

When I tried to do the relearn, my dash lit up again, and now I had codes for the position where I had moved the suspect solenoid to. So I went to a local pull-a-part, and was fortunate enough to be able to pull a valve body from a '23 Forester. The whole valve body cost less than the aftermarket solenoid that I had ordered off of Amazon.

After installing the "new" valve body, I was able to successfully relearn the CVT, and my wife's Outback is running great.

But here is the kicker. When I pulled the valve body with the suspect solenoid, I took resistance readings, at the valve body connector, of all the solenoids, and even the temperature sensor. Every measurement was within specification. Even the suspect solenoid measured in specification.

Now that the car is up and running, with an almost new valve body that will probably outlast how long we keep the Outback, I should let it go. But it still bothers me, as to why the solenoid can measure in specification, but still result in a failure. The only thing I can think of, is that although the solenoid reads ok with multimeter, when 12vdc is applied, it is failing. But how could it be intermittent like that?

 

[CarbonToast]

Here is the latest update. After getting my delivery of HPL CVT fluid, I replaced the filter, cleaned the magnet in the bottom of the transmission pan, refilled the transmission with fluid, did a second drain and fill, and then proceeded to do a transmission relearn.

When I tried to do the relearn, my dash lit up again, and now I had codes for the position where I had moved the suspect solenoid to. So I went to a local pull-a-part, and was fortunate enough to be able to pull a valve body from a '23 Forester. The whole valve body cost less than the aftermarket solenoid that I had ordered off of Amazon.

After installing the "new" valve body, I was able to successfully relearn the CVT, and my wife's Outback is running great.

But here is the kicker. When I pulled the valve body with the suspect solenoid, I took resistance readings, at the valve body connector, of all the solenoids, and even the temperature sensor. Every measurement was within specification. Even the suspect solenoid measured in specification.

Now that the car is up and running, with an almost new valve body that will probably outlast how long we keep the Outback, I should let it go. But it still bothers me, as to why the solenoid can measure in specification, but still result in a failure. The only thing I can think of, is that although the solenoid reads ok with multimeter, when 12vdc is applied, it is failing. But how could it be intermittent like that?

If it's shorted to ground but still has continuity through the coil.