2007 Civic LX, 2nd drain/fill with RP Max ATF

[Lyondellic]

I performed the 1st drain/fill using the new RP Max ATF formula about 2 weeks ago. Two things were immediately obvious following the 1st drain/fill. First, transmission noise was greatly reduced. The 2007 Civic LX AT makes a very distinct whining noise, especially when using the reverse gear. This noise was virtually eliminated. Second, shifts were slightly more firm, but were well within acceptable limits. Though it is difficult to put into words, the transmission just felt more solid.

About one week after the 1st drain/fill, I noticed that the transmission felt a little bit "notchy" when coming to a complete stop. This has always been an issue with the Civic AT, though it typically feels more like a slight shudder with the Z1 ATF. With the RP Max ATF, I can feel the last down-shift before each stop. I don't particularly like this, but I have a theory as to why it is happening. Since it took several days after the 1st drain/fill for the "notcy" down-shift issue to become apparent, I feel that it took a little while for the Royal Purple Max ATF to thoroughly mix with the Z1 ATF. The 65% Z1 and 35% RP Max ATF mix seems to affect the last down-shift. I believe that a higher percentage of RP Max ATF will return the shift performance that I observed immediately following the 1st drain/fill. One other interesting observation, I saw a 1 MPG increase in fuel economy after the 1st drain/fill. It is too early to tell if this is a result of the RP Max ATF.

I performed a 2nd drain/fill with RP Max ATF this afternoon. The shift quality felt like it did immediately following the 1st drain/fill. The "notchy" down-shift issue disappeared and the transmission felt even more solid than it did after the 1st drain/fill. Transmission noise is slightly reduced from the 1st drain/fill too, but this is really subjective. I am curious to see if the last down-shift will start to feel "notchy" in a few days. If it does I will need to make a decision as to whether or not to revert back to Z1 ATF or to perform a 3rd drain/fill with Max ATF.

Any thoughts or feedback are appreciated.

 

[Donald]

I would guess the two fluids were about 100% mixed in say 15 minutes or so and not several days. Many of the things you describe are pretty subjective and it would be natural to "look" for things after a transmission drain & refill especially if you did it yourself.

Not sure I would attribute a 1 MPG to a change in ATF. Too many other factors. If you are mostly at highway speeds and the TC is in lockup, then the ATF should have almost no effect on mileage.

Did you consider doing the cooler line flish vs multiple drain & refills. Trying to get a high percentage of new synthetic ATF in a transmission via drain & refills is an expensive proposition compared to a cooler line flush.

 

[Lyondellic]

Originally Posted By: Donald
I would guess the two fluids were about 100% mixed in say 15 minutes or so and not several days. Many of the things you describe are pretty subjective and it would be natural to "look" for things after a transmission drain & refill especially if you did it yourself.

Not sure I would attribute a 1 MPG to a change in ATF. Too many other factors. If you are mostly at highway speeds and the TC is in lockup, then the ATF should have almost no effect on mileage.

Did you consider doing the cooler line flish vs multiple drain & refills. Trying to get a high percentage of new synthetic ATF in a transmission via drain & refills is an expensive proposition compared to a cooler line flush.


I agree that the Z1 and Max ATF would have mixed very quickly. I just can't explain why the transmission felt one way immediately after the 1st drain/fill and then seemed to change a little bit. Perhaps the transmission's fuzzy logic is responsible for this? I am not saying that the shift quality is unacceptable by any stretch, just a little bit different on the last down-shift.

As for the MPG increase, I agree that it would be difficult to attribute this to the Max ATF. There are a lot of other factors, but my driving is fairly consistent and the car is basically used to go to/from work. I will need to monitor the fuel efficiency over the course of a few tanks to see if anything changes.

I prefer to do the drain/fills rather than mess with the cooler lines. My wife and kids already give me a hard time for trying new things out on our vehicles and I don't feel like having to listen to them while they "help" me. All told, three drain/fills with Max ATF will cost ~$90.

Thanks for your feedback!

 

[unDummy]

If the older fluid has sheared to 5.5cst, and you change it out with 7.5cst new fluid, then maybe there will be a mild drop in MPG. But, the new fluid will shear too. So, MPG should jump back up. And, full synthetics flow better. So, from cold and during warmup, MPG should be better with the synth.

Transmission programming will adapt to the shift quality. Any change in fluid in most new transmission will be felt, even if using the OE fluid as the 'fuzzy logic' adapts to a sudden change in friction level condition(new vs spent fluid) and line pressure(thicker new ATF visc vs sheared old ATF).
And, it will take some time for the additive package to completely soak into the friction materials.

Being that RP maxATF is a new universal-multivehic fluid, I hope that it works well for you.

 

[Donald]

He got an increase in MPG and not a drop.

Have you looked at the trans drain calculator to see how many drain and refills it will take to get you to a high percentage, like 90%?

What percentage are you looking to get to? What is the total capacity vs the drain & refill (if you do not know its listed on the Amsoil website).

If your drain and refill is less than 1/2 of the total capacity, its more cost effective to get to a high percentage of synthetic by bringing the car and a case of synthetic to a trusted mechanic to have him do a flush. If you are happy at say 75% then that is a different story.

A Magnefine filter will be your next big benefit to long life for your transmission. Its available at NAPA under a NAPA part number.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: Lyondellic
.. I am curious to see if the last down-shift will start to feel "notchy" in a few days. If it does I will need to make a decision as to whether or not to revert back to Z1 ATF or to perform a 3rd drain/fill with Max ATF.

Any thoughts or feedback are appreciated.


I'm new to Honda, but from the reading I've done over the last few weeks, the 'notchiness' you feel with the Honda 5spd AT, is the nature of the beast. Honda ATs are designed differently than most. You can feel the up/down shifts. Keep in mind you also have an inline filter on your 5spd AT. It's p/n 25430-PLR-003 and I can almost guarantee Honda service doesn't know it's there.

Joel

 

[Bulli]

i have a 07 civic lx sedan and i just have 5k miles on it. will do a drain and fill later in when i reach the 25k mile mark. I heard in a honda a/t transmission u cant use nothign else but honda fluids. is this true?

Ps to the poster. i was just wondering what kind of oil you are running in your car?

and if you transmission makes loud clunking noise when switching gears from R-D
or D-R?

 

[Lyondellic]

Originally Posted By: Donald
He got an increase in MPG and not a drop.

Have you looked at the trans drain calculator to see how many drain and refills it will take to get you to a high percentage, like 90%?

What percentage are you looking to get to? What is the total capacity vs the drain & refill (if you do not know its listed on the Amsoil website).

If your drain and refill is less than 1/2 of the total capacity, its more cost effective to get to a high percentage of synthetic by bringing the car and a case of synthetic to a trusted mechanic to have him do a flush. If you are happy at say 75% then that is a different story.

A Magnefine filter will be your next big benefit to long life for your transmission. Its available at NAPA under a NAPA part number.


I plan to complete 4 drain/fills. This should get me close to 90% Max ATF based on 2.5 quart drain/fills and the 6.3 quart system capacity. I am thinking about installing a Magnefine filter at some point later this year. I just don't feel like messing around with hoses and hose clamps right now.

 

[Lyondellic]

Originally Posted By: JTK
Originally Posted By: Lyondellic
.. I am curious to see if the last down-shift will start to feel "notchy" in a few days. If it does I will need to make a decision as to whether or not to revert back to Z1 ATF or to perform a 3rd drain/fill with Max ATF.

Any thoughts or feedback are appreciated.


I'm new to Honda, but from the reading I've done over the last few weeks, the 'notchiness' you feel with the Honda 5spd AT, is the nature of the beast. Honda ATs are designed differently than most. You can feel the up/down shifts. Keep in mind you also have an inline filter on your 5spd AT. It's p/n 25430-PLR-003 and I can almost guarantee Honda service doesn't know it's there.

Joel


I agree that Honda is not known for their automatic transmissions. The difference between 100% Z1 and 35% Z1 with 65% Max ATF is not that pronounced now that I have performed two drain/fills. I am pleased so far, but will reserve judgment for a few more days.

Where is the inline filter that you mention? Is it somewhere accessible?

 

[Lyondellic]

Originally Posted By: Bulli
i have a 07 civic lx sedan and i just have 5k miles on it. will do a drain and fill later in when i reach the 25k mile mark. I heard in a honda a/t transmission u cant use nothign else but honda fluids. is this true?

Ps to the poster. i was just wondering what kind of oil you are running in your car?

and if you transmission makes loud clunking noise when switching gears from R-D
or D-R?


Some here on BITOG will say to use only Honda Z1 ATF. If you decide to go that route I would perform your first drain/fill at 15,000 miles. Using 15,000 mile drain/fill intervals from that point onward will keep your ATF in good shape.

I have been using Amsoil 0W-20 since my first oil change (1,500 miles).

 

[Bulli]

thanks for the info. Im going to be running m1 5-20 with wix filters for a long time untill my 7 year old extended warrenty is up then i might switch make a swith.
Yah honda a.t. transmissions i heard were never really good so it probably is a good idea to service that earlier.
anyway hows your honda working.
im anxious to get mine out of storage.!

 

[Donald]

There are many fluids that can be used and are Honda Z1 compatible. Amsoil synthetic ATF for one.

 

[JTK]

Originally Posted By: Lyondellic

Where is the inline filter that you mention? Is it somewhere accessible?


For your Civic 5spd AT, it's #7 here:
http://www.slhondaparts.com/browse.asp?M...&ViewParts=true

To get the same exploded parts views, p/n's, etc, mash your info into the ahm-ownerlink. com. "American Honda Motors" site. It's pretty nice. You can see parts break-downs of anything on your Honda.

Joel

 

[ThirdeYe]

Originally Posted By: Donald
There are many fluids that can be used and are Honda Z1 compatible. Amsoil synthetic ATF for one.


That's what I use, and I love the way it feels. Every time I do a drain/refill in my car it feels a lot smoother than before.