Bobis:
" ... did YOU actually see with Red Line oils sitting in the pit and not just a sticker on something, cause as you well or should know, there is a lot that flash stickers and patches if someone pays for it."
That's a good point,
Bob and one I make all the time when I see corporate sponsorship on race cars ... especially with a product like oil where some teams claim they use the same oil in their race car which is available on store shelves. Most of the time it’s B.S. and their spokespeople are careful to work in some nonsense wiggle-words into any comment made about the oil companies. Ron Dennis of MacLaren has a lot of nice things to say about the Mobil corporation but doesn’t say he uses their oils straight out of the bottle in their Formula 1 cars. Likewise, Unocal 76, the official oil of NASCAR, says they “make these available” to the various NASCAR teams but you know that most teams use something else ... or at the very least they have a MAJOR sponsorship conflict.
The truth of the matter is yes, in many of the trailers and temporary garage areas at Limerock you could see the
actual bottles of Red Line oil sitting there on the benches, shelves, in chests, etc ...
I suppose those teams could have gotten some empty Red Line bottles and put something
else in them ... but that (to me) is stretching it. That sounds a little close to a conspiracy theory and I don't believe in too many of those. Likewise, I don't find myself searching the sky for black helicopters, etc ...
But, even before my trip to Limerock, I have always believed that the guys who SAY they use Red Line in their race cars (by the stickers on their vehicles)
actually use it is a matter of business and simple economics.
Let's say that what Red Line does is pay a lot of these small time (semi-pro) racers to show their logo (in locations on the car of varying prominence) on their race cars but those racers actually use some other kind of oil.
That’s possible, but then what’s the point of the sponsorship? sure, most of the big oil companies advertise this way and then they expect the motoring masses to pick THEIR oil when shopping at Wal-Mart or auto parts stores or request it when visiting their neighborhood garage. The profit from these sales covers the cost of the racing sponsorships. Red Line doesn’t do this. You can only get Red Line through specialty outlets that cater to racers and
serious hot-rodders. In this area, I’m the only guy I know who runs Red Line in an automobile locally. Where are they getting the money to pay for racing? The obvious answer is that this business model can’t work. Actual racers make up a large portion, possibly most of Red Line’s paying customers.
See what I’m saying? Taking a loss by sponsoring racers in order to appeal the consumer and industrial market doesn’t work because most of that market has never heard of Red Line and would balk at paying $6-8 for a quart of oil anyway. Racers ARE Red Line’s market. If the racers advertising Red Line actually used some other kind of oil, Red Line would have gone out of business a decade or more ago. Tell me if you see a flaw in that logic because I can’t see any other way for them to stay afloat.
As for sponsorships, Red Line probably offers some money to teams showing their logo who finish in the top positions in a given racing class/types/series with the amounts varying depending on how high-profile that race series is. But, I doubt this amounts to much.
Johnny might know more about these sponsorship deals and what they typically involve.
“Schaeffer’s racing oil, same deal: Very Low detergents and made for racing as oppose to street. You gotta remember, The main difference here is you're submitting to it being a full synth as I am with a blend, both have the high Levels of additives to resist wear, so the main difference here is extreme cold pumpability (like that is an issue for race cars) and extended long duration of oil drains. My point is, Red Line has no true benefit over Schaeffer when it comes to racing oils IMO, except making your wallet lighter.”
I’m not sure if that’s the whole story. Won’t Red Line’s synthetic base pump easier at operating temp? That is one of their selling points. Use a thinner, full-synthetic oil (at least thinner than older straight weights) and gain more horsepower through reduced pumping losses.
They also advertise the benefits of the high temp protection of polyol versus mineral and PAO-based stocks which will shear down and thin out at higher temps sometimes found in racing conditions. This is essentially what
Patman asked. My answer to him is it depends on what kind of oil temps you are running. If you run a more aerodynamic shape (fewer air inlets) and/or run a smaller radiator with reduced capacity (less weight), that is an advantage in a race ... but you’ll want to have an oil that will still perform well at temps which might run an additional 20-50F or more hotter.
Like I said above, this kind of performance is probably overkill ... even for most racers ... but if you’re turning some serious RPMs and/or are running an endurance race, the extra $$$ spent on the best lubricant is peanuts.
Johhny, how many people still use the straight weights for racing? I look at that approach as really dated in most applications. If I had a Formula Ford or an Acura Integra (high winding 4-cyl), I couldn’t imagine putting that thick goo in my ride. Too much power lost pumping that stuff through the motor. I remember seeing the on-line MSDS sheets for that “Pennzoil GT” formula but I don’t think I’ve ever actually
seen a bottle up close. I still occasionally see the Valvoline straight racing weights and years ago I used to see the Castrol straight racing grades ... but both of these have been fading from the shelves, at least around here.
Wouldn’t you love to be a part of a special Pennzoil team producing modern, custom-blended Group IV and Group V racing lubes for a handful of high-profile racing teams? It might require a bit of travel to racing tracks all over the country, possibly the globe ... think you could handle that?
