1965 Buda 4DB153

[A310]

This is the oil I drained from the sump after I bought the forklift. Hasn't been run in 15 years or so and was badly abused, no air cleaner and lots the of sludge. Despite the abuse I was able to get the engine running again and was surprised how well it ran, good oil pressure and little blow-by. I had the oil pan off and cleaned everything up and filled it with fresh Rotella T 15W40. I'll run the engine 20 hours and take a new sample and see how its doing. Here's the sample:

 

[spasm3]

If it had not been run in 15 years, the bores probably has some rust in them. I used to have a 93 olds that i bought from senior and it sat for 4 years, the iron levels were high from rust in the bore. The other levels are not bad. The lead could be from leaded fuel or particle streak from the silicon level.

 

[Kruse]

I've got a Buda 4B153 in a Cockshutt 30 tractor. If you engine ever goes bad, scrap the whole thing. Parts for this engine are available, but cost prohibitive.

 

[fdcg27]

Wow!
I'll be interested in seeing your 20 hr follow-up UOA.
Nice save of this vintage machine which would otherwise likely have ended up scrapped.

 

[andyd]

Maybe I haven't been paying attention. I don't remember ever seeing that high a count in the first 5 metals before. Copper and lead is bearing material. Any idea what the warm oil pressure is? What kinda service is the unit gonna see?

 

[BrocLuno]

Yeah, the iron is high, but to be expected

Dunno how hard it is to get the injectors out ... But a couple of tablespoons on MMO in each cylinder will help loads. Rusted bores tend to load the top ring with iron oxide. The MMO will help carry it past if small enough. If to big, it'll circulate and blow out the exhaust eventually.

 

[A310]

True, it's very nasty. I figured that when I took the pan off and the filter apart.

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: andyd
Maybe I haven't been paying attention. I don't remember ever seeing that high a count in the first 5 metals before. Copper and lead is bearing material. Any idea what the warm oil pressure is? What kinda service is the unit gonna see?


Yes very high indeed,idle oil pressure is good at 50 psi cold and 30 hot with fresh Rotella 15W40.

 

[spasm3]

Originally Posted By: A310
. I'll run the engine 20 hours and take a new sample and see how its doing.




Does it have an oil filter? If not, i'd run it far less and then wait until the change after next for a sample.

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Saw the video of your little Buda up and running again, cool to bring back old tired iron to running condition once again. Given it was run without an air filter and god knows how long that oil has been in there this could've been worse. The silicon shows the toll from countless hours without air filtration and the rest of the wear metals are what you'd expect after seeing the silicon. The lack of full flow filtration and a bypass only filter seems to be working since insolubles are low given everything else that was going on here. These little old Diesel engines, as long as they have enough compression to start can take a heck of a beating and still run as evidenced here. Thanks for sharing!

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: spasm3
Originally Posted By: A310
. I'll run the engine 20 hours and take a new sample and see how its doing.




Does it have an oil filter? If not, i'd run it far less and then wait until the change after next for a sample.


No oil filter, but has a 10 Um bypass filter, I did flush the oil system and cleaned everything up. I then ran the engine for an hr and drained the oil and replaced again with fresh oil. I've run it up for 3 hrs now flushing the very nasty coolant system and the oil is still clean. I'll keep a close eye on it for some time before I'll relax.

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: FlyNavyP3
Saw the video of your little Buda up and running again, cool to bring back old tired iron to running condition once again. Given it was run without an air filter and god knows how long that oil has been in there this could've been worse. The silicon shows the toll from countless hours without air filtration and the rest of the wear metals are what you'd expect after seeing the silicon. The lack of full flow filtration and a bypass only filter seems to be working since insolubles are low given everything else that was going on here. These little old Diesel engines, as long as they have enough compression to start can take a heck of a beating and still run as evidenced here. Thanks for sharing!


True, it's not the worst engine I've got back running, but a close second. I will say that it's the worst coolant system I've ever seen. I spent 5 days welding on that to get the cracks fixed and water tight again and flushed the coolant system 7 times before the water was clean.
I was surprised with how well it ran after countless hours working on it. I had to remove the injection pump again as the governor swivel shaft broke. I pick the new shaft up tomorrow along with 2 new injector nozzles, so that completes the engine work. Transmission is next with a throw-out bearing and fluid change.

 

[A310]

If anyone's interested following along as I get this wreck back into service here's a link to the latest video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dsygZUe9ugc

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: fdcg27
Wow!
I'll be interested in seeing your 20 hr follow-up UOA.
Nice save of this vintage machine which would otherwise likely have ended up scrapped.


Thanks, I found it being parted out and ended up buying the whole forklift for less than scrap.

 

[MONKEYMAN]

Looks like you are enjoying your project. My father was a welder. He used to say the only thing he could not fix was the crack of dawn and a broken heart. I am impressed with your progress!

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: MONKEYMAN
Looks like you are enjoying your project. My father was a welder. He used to say the only thing he could not fix was the crack of dawn and a broken heart. I am impressed with your progress!


Thank, I do love a challenge and I found one in saving this forklift. There's a lot of setbacks, but slowly it's bending to my will.

 

[Linctex]

That was a LOT of welding!


For the oil - I had one other engine similar (oil filter sludged solid):

Every single time I warmed it up & then shut it off - I drained the oil. (into a clean plastic container)

I rotated two batches of oil -
one batch in the engine,
one batch "settling out" in the white plastic 2-1/2 gallon jugs.

You would be AMAZED to find out how much crud settles to the bottom of the container!

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: Linctex
That was a LOT of welding!


For the oil - I had one other engine similar (oil filter sludged solid):

Every single time I warmed it up & then shut it off - I drained the oil. (into a clean plastic container)

I rotated two batches of oil -
one batch in the engine,
one batch "settling out" in the white plastic 2-1/2 gallon jugs.

You would be AMAZED to find out how much crud settles to the bottom of the container!



True, sludge can be very nasty indeed, I ended up taking the oil pan off and washing the engine with an engine detergent to soften up the sludge, then rinsing with diesel fuel. I did this for 2 days to clean it all up to an acceptable level before I put the pan back on and started it.
The welding was a lot of work, turned out to be around 20 hours of welding to fix the frost cracks. I wanted to keep the wet liners in the engine, so I had to cold weld the cast iron, which means basically welding 1" beads and letting them cool, then welding another bead until it's complete. Very frustrating, but was happy in the end that I managed to save the liner seals. I painted the engine today, so happy times indeed.

 

[FlyNavyP3]

Good luck on your quest for injection parts. With the age of the engine I can imagine this is quite tricky, as would finding liner kits for this engine.

 

[A310]

Originally Posted By: FlyNavyP3
Good luck on your quest for injection parts. With the age of the engine I can imagine this is quite tricky, as would finding liner kits for this engine.


Thanks Luke, I'm trying locally for the injector nozzles, but not getting anywhere. I did find an outfit in Michigan that stock liners and gaskets, so I'll be calling them this Monday and see if they have nozzles as well. I also found and purchased a copy of the repair and Owners manual, so I now have all the specs I need. On a side note they stock all the parts for Detroit's as well.