'10 Genesis Coupe V6 Edge EP 5w20 (9,042 mile run)

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Very interesting set of UOAs! What stands out for me are the Viscosity, TBN and how they relate to your time and mileage. Firstly, M1 thinned much more and with less mileage. Blackstone probably said wear and TBN would allow you to run it longer, but it was probably better that you didn't go much below a TBN of 2.5. Secondly, the magnesium Edge EP held its viscosity well. Though the TBN was high, remember that magnesium oils return higher TBN numbers so again, I wouldn't look at running that oil all the way down to a TBN of 1. The Ultra then proves why you should not base oil intervals on Blackstone's TBN of 1 is OK. That oil thickened up quite a bit because it starts around 8.3cst and probably thinned first. 11000 miles was way too far even though the TBN was 1.9. Your newest Edge EP uoa shows only modest thinning but your TBN of 2 is at a point where other, more knowledgeable industry experts would recommend a change. Since you've described a more robust style of driving, and taking all the UOAs into account, I think the 9000 mile oci with an EP oil, probably Edge, is a prudent maximum.
 

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I meant to change the Pennzoil at 10k miles, but stuff came up. Here are the other 3 UOA's in order from first to last.
 
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OVERKILL

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Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Trying to determine what oil wears best in the 3.8 Genesis engine. Feedback/criticism/comments welcomed.
Well, you aren't really going to be able to do that via PPM comparisons with UOA's. Each oil will have a different "signature" and the results between each are no comparable. The idea is to trend a specific lubricant and watch for anomalies which may indicate potential issues.
 
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Originally Posted By: MarcS
Originally Posted By: Ohle_Manezzini
Originally Posted By: ARCOgraphite
My experience is once you've gone the Ti pack you stay the Ti pack. You cant go back without the engine sounding like it will implode.
All of That, because of 20 to 50 ppm of Ti? Really?
I think it's safe to assume the titanium-based additive package that contains the Ti picked up on analysis is more than 20-50ppm by volume and that castrol doesn't just add 20-50PPM of titanium shavings and call it a day.
Well I was being optimist there, the analyses gave 15 to 34 ppm of Ti.
 

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Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Trying to determine what oil wears best in the 3.8 Genesis engine. Feedback/criticism/comments welcomed.
Well, you aren't really going to be able to do that via PPM comparisons with UOA's. Each oil will have a different "signature" and the results between each are no comparable. The idea is to trend a specific lubricant and watch for anomalies which may indicate potential issues.
It can tell me if one oil is giving me lower iron wear numbers which generally increases in a linear fashion, or tell me which oil is standing up better in my 3.8 better at 10k miles.
 

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Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Trying to determine what oil wears best in the 3.8 Genesis engine. Feedback/criticism/comments welcomed.
Well, you aren't really going to be able to do that via PPM comparisons with UOA's. Each oil will have a different "signature" and the results between each are no comparable. The idea is to trend a specific lubricant and watch for anomalies which may indicate potential issues.
It can tell me if one oil is giving me lower iron wear numbers which generally increases in a linear fashion, or tell me which oil is standing up better in my 3.8 better at 10k miles.
Not really. Since a UOA only samples a very narrow range of particle sizes, a few PPM difference between oils doesn't amount to anything statistically significant and each oil will have its own "signature" that does not directly correlate to how it is "wearing". Ergo, trying to compare different oils in this manner is an exercise in futility. You are better served tracking TBN retention, fuel dilution and the like, as that's truly the purpose of the tool in addition to of course spotting problems through irregularities in a trend. Doug covers it all quite well in this article: Doug Hillary article on UOA's and their use
 
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...or you can split the difference and go to a Genesis enthusiast site that will hopefully have intelligent people who've done work along those lines and generated a consensus on what oils seem to work "better" than others. If you're looking for suggestions versus empirical testing done by yourself over a period of a year or two then this might be the better option...if you haven't already done so. My take is I'd always go to an enthusiast site for your vehicle first and then come here if it doesn't have the support / info / intelligence / experience level you're looking for...I've found that if there's a good community site you can usually skip the more general pontification and get to the answer you want. Not always...but a lot of the time.
 

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Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Originally Posted By: OVERKILL
Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
Trying to determine what oil wears best in the 3.8 Genesis engine. Feedback/criticism/comments welcomed.
Well, you aren't really going to be able to do that via PPM comparisons with UOA's. Each oil will have a different "signature" and the results between each are no comparable. The idea is to trend a specific lubricant and watch for anomalies which may indicate potential issues.
It can tell me if one oil is giving me lower iron wear numbers which generally increases in a linear fashion, or tell me which oil is standing up better in my 3.8 better at 10k miles.
Not really. Since a UOA only samples a very narrow range of particle sizes, a few PPM difference between oils doesn't amount to anything statistically significant and each oil will have its own "signature" that does not directly correlate to how it is "wearing". Ergo, trying to compare different oils in this manner is an exercise in futility. You are better served tracking TBN retention, fuel dilution and the like, as that's truly the purpose of the tool in addition to of course spotting problems through irregularities in a trend. Doug covers it all quite well in this article: Doug Hillary article on UOA's and their use
In the least, I can prove some naysayers wrong that I'm killing my engine by not changing the oil every 3,000 miles and keep an eye on how my vehicle is doing. I rely on it so I kind of want to know if there are any pending issues.
Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
...or you can split the difference and go to a Genesis enthusiast site that will hopefully have intelligent people who've done work along those lines and generated a consensus on what oils seem to work "better" than others. If you're looking for suggestions versus empirical testing done by yourself over a period of a year or two then this might be the better option...if you haven't already done so. My take is I'd always go to an enthusiast site for your vehicle first and then come here if it doesn't have the support / info / intelligence / experience level you're looking for...I've found that if there's a good community site you can usually skip the more general pontification and get to the answer you want. Not always...but a lot of the time.
I am part of the Genesis Coupe forums and I get these UOA's done so I can post them there. Many of them are adamant that I am destroying my engine, so I use this as evidence I am now. Also, right now they are trying to blame Mobil 1, regardless of the viscosity, for destroying bearings but no proof of it at all. My current fill is Mobil 1 EP so I will have a UOA just to prove that wrong as well.
 
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Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
In the least, I can prove some naysayers wrong that I'm killing my engine by not changing the oil every 3,000 miles and keep an eye on how my vehicle is doing. I rely on it so I kind of want to know if there are any pending issues.
Quote:
I am part of the Genesis Coupe forums and I get these UOA's done so I can post them there. Many of them are adamant that I am destroying my engine, so I use this as evidence I am now. Also, right now they are trying to blame Mobil 1, regardless of the viscosity, for destroying bearings but no proof of it at all. My current fill is Mobil 1 EP so I will have a UOA just to prove that wrong as well.
OP, I'm with you here. You're doing all right , need not worry about 'expert opinions' from experienced owners from Genesis forum really. Edge EP and Mobil EP/standard OCI could be further extended, though I wouldn't do the same with PUP.
 
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OVERKILL

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Originally Posted By: Lethal1ty17
In the least, I can prove some naysayers wrong that I'm killing my engine by not changing the oil every 3,000 miles and keep an eye on how my vehicle is doing. I rely on it so I kind of want to know if there are any pending issues.
thumbsup I'm in 100% in agreement on that one, and that's a fine motivation smile
 
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The reports look good. A couple of things come to mind. It would have been nice to see all the oils used for the same approximate miles. In your case 9K runs would have been nice. I was also under the impression that when switching brands for UOA comparison it is best to do two runs with the same oil, and take the sample at the end of the second run. That would give a better representation of the oil in the sump and avoid mixing remnants of the oil used prior. Just some thoughts, I'm still in the UOA learning phases.
 

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Originally Posted By: demarpaint
The reports look good. A couple of things come to mind. It would have been nice to see all the oils used for the same approximate miles. In your case 9K runs would have been nice. I was also under the impression that when switching brands for UOA comparison it is best to do two runs with the same oil, and take the sample at the end of the second run. That would give a better representation of the oil in the sump and avoid mixing remnants of the oil used prior. Just some thoughts, I'm still in the UOA learning phases.
In an ideal world, yes that would have been best to run a sample at the end of the second fill of the same oil, and to run them all 9k or so. But that would be at least a year between UOA's and I also change the oil when time permits. This last one was either at 9k or at 12.5k because I was going on a long road trip. Seeing as the 11k report was mediocre I decided to change it a bit earlier so I didn't have to worry about it. Also thinking about trying a Fram Ultra filter next time to see how it affects the insolubles count and if it drops any wear numbers vs the standard OEM filter that is just plain cellulose.
 
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Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
...or you can split the difference and go to a Genesis enthusiast site that will hopefully have intelligent people who've done work along those lines and generated a consensus on what oils seem to work "better" than others. If you're looking for suggestions versus empirical testing done by yourself over a period of a year or two then this might be the better option...if you haven't already done so. My take is I'd always go to an enthusiast site for your vehicle first and then come here if it doesn't have the support / info / intelligence / experience level you're looking for...I've found that if there's a good community site you can usually skip the more general pontification and get to the answer you want. Not always...but a lot of the time.
Lethal1ty17 posted: I am part of the Genesis Coupe forums and I get these UOA's done so I can post them there. Many of them are adamant that I am destroying my engine, so I use this as evidence I am now. Also, right now they are trying to blame Mobil 1, regardless of the viscosity, for destroying bearings but no proof of it at all. My current fill is Mobil 1 EP so I will have a UOA just to prove that wrong as well. [/quote] That's too bad...it really is dependent on a good, experienced community to get things right versus pontificating about oil brands creating problems. I've had good luck with some of the vehicle-specific forums I've been a member of and will always listen to someone who has experience with my vehicle versus people who have no knowledge of, interest in, or experience with that vehicle. I can say that some of the advice given here has been less than appropriate for my vehicle but if M1 is causing the engine apocalypse as a consensus then that would be at the bottom of the barrel.
 
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Lethal1ty17

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Every time I would ask for proof of their claims or to hear from someone that actually had bearing failure there was silence. Claims were even made that certain manufacturers of aftermarket components were recommending against Mobil 1 so I called and asked, of course it was false and when I posted about it no one responded. Side note: what are the chances a Fram Ultra really would lower the insolubles under 0.3% which it seems to be stable at? There's a TSB about using OEM filters only but I'd be willing to try one of them because they have synthetic media vs the OEM plain cellulose.
 
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Originally Posted By: Vuflanovsky
My take is I'd always go to an enthusiast site for your vehicle first and then come here if it doesn't have the support / info / intelligence / experience level you're looking for...I've found that if there's a good community site you can usually skip the more general pontification and get to the answer you want. Not always...but a lot of the time.
You clearly have not tried to have an oil discussion above kindergarten level on a Jeep forum. laugh
 
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