$1,300+ monthly payment????!!!!!!

[Astro14]

The financial situation of the up and coming generation is largely the result of a broken family IMO.
You are a good example of an intact family and the security, help and most important IMO, guidance it can provide to the young adults.

There are plenty of people and corporations that want to capitalize on young adults. Schools and universities are a prime example. Things take a snow ball effect after that IMO. Because once you’re saddled with $100-$150k debt, what’s another $30-$40k on a car?

Thank you.

It’s hasn’t been easy, but we managed to get each kid through college without student loans. We managed to get each of them into a car after graduation.

Used car. But good enough to get them “launched” - so that they avoided so many of the financial traps and pitfalls to which their peers fell prey.

To have the resources available for those goals, my wife and I sacrificed a lot. We bought a very modest house. We drove very used cars. We each worked two jobs.

Each.

But I think you’re right on the guidance part - seeing the kids make good decisions now, and planning for their futures - it’s clear to us that skill set is of greater value than the financial position in which we are able to have them starting out.

 

[Astro14]

I gave my kids a copy of The Total Money Makeover and tickets to a live Dave Ramsey event. They are doing quite well and don't have debt beyond their homes. They drive nice vehicles, but not extravagant ones. Perhaps if schools taught more of that and less of indoctrination it would help.

Completely agree that financial literacy should be taught in school.

It shocks me how many people are financially illiterate. This whole thread is about the financially illiterate.

If you grow up with financially illiterate parents, how do you learn?

How do you break the cycle?

 

[KrisZ]

I gave my kids a copy of The Total Money Makeover and tickets to a live Dave Ramsey event. They are doing quite well and don't have debt beyond their homes. They drive nice vehicles, but not extravagant ones. Perhaps if schools taught more of that and less of indoctrination it would help.

And that’s the mistake that many make IMO (not you obviously), thinking that schools will prepare the children for adulthood. Why would they teach financial and personal restraint? It’s not in the interests of the “system”. Do banks make money if people save instead of borrow? Do corporations make money when people buy only what they need? Of course not, the whole thing revolves around people spending as much as they possible can. The school system is no different. They want worker bees, nothing more.

You cannot expect the wolf to protect the hens. Hence, my previous post about the importance of family and having people around you that want what’s best for you, not their pocketbook.

 

[jeepman3071]

We agree on much.

My youngest daughter has spent the last five years in New Haven. No car needed, she walks, takes the train, or uses Uber/Lyft, so the First Bank of Dad has declined to support a car. She is frugal, so she hasn’t even asked.

But next year, as she starts medical school, she will need one. A legitimate need.

So, the First Bank of Dad is already underwriting her first car. An 18 year old Volvo XC90 with over 200,000 miles on it.

Not expensive. Nowhere near new. But durable, practical, safe, and most importantly:

well within budget.

That's awesome, and good on you for being able to help her out with that. I know I help family any way I can. I'm sure most kids right out of school would think of an 18 year old Volvo with 200k miles as "too old" and "too expensive to keep running". I'm so thankful that my dad with his limited mechanical knowledge taught me about researching things and being fiscally responsible, many my age were not that fortunate, and go off of limited recommendations they receive from others within their circle. I know this because of how many coworkers gasp when they find out I daily drive a 14 year old vehicle, a German one even, and how I manage to not be on a tow truck weekly.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Lots of old men yelling at clouds here...


Driving what you can afford sounds great, but there are a lot of factors. Used cars aren't exactly cheap these days. I'm fortunate that I can buy cars with cash, and have the ability and the space/tools to work on them. If I lived in an apartment I'd be SOL, and have to take everything to a shop for repair. Living in the rust belt, used cars are also harder to source since they rot out after 10 years. For many, car payments are just a fact of life, because they have no other option, and many new cars have better financing than buying something used (and questionable to many non-car savvy people). Being able to fix modern cars yourself is a big undertaking that requires scan tools, software, expensive tools, space, and time spent researching fixes. Gone are the days where a homeowner tool kit would do most of what you needed.

I work at a University, and many of the students here graduate with mountains of debt, no savings, and need a car so they can get from their apartment to whatever entry level job they will have.

You would have saved me a lot of reading whiny, cry-baby words if you'd just said that in the first sentence.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

I gave my kids a copy of The Total Money Makeover and tickets to a live Dave Ramsey event. They are doing quite well and don't have debt beyond their homes. They drive nice vehicles, but not extravagant ones. Perhaps if schools taught more of that and less of indoctrination it would help.

 

[jeepman3071]

Completely agree that financial literacy should be taught in school.

It shocks me how many people are financially illiterate. This whole thread is about the financially illiterate.

If you grow up with financially illiterate parents, how do you learn?

How do you break the cycle?

It's really difficult. I've dated a few women my age who had financially illiterate parents. I've seen both ends of the spectrum, those who accumulate insane amounts of debt that they could easily be without, and the ones who have been taught to be extremely frugal, but in a penny-wise pound foolish sort of way. I dated a girl who was basically taught to avoid spending money if at all possible. I can't count the number of times she had tire blowouts or close calls from driving on bald tires, drove vehicles that were pretty unsafe and in sad shape, or lived in apartments in bad areas because the rent was way cheaper. At what point does safety take a priority? There is a balance. Very intelligent person otherwise with a Master's degree and a good paying job.

 

[jeepman3071]

You would have saved me a lot of reading whiny, cry-baby words if you'd just said that in the first sentence.

Would you care to elaborate or is this just a dig at me? As a society we should be concerned about the financial well-being of our youth, as it impacts all of us. Even though I work at one, I still feel really disgusted that we push the narrative that young adults should take on huge amounts of debt for degrees with questionable value to their career paths.

 

[Hillbilly Deluxe]

Not my problem, but I'm sure I will be made to care. I don't recommend college to ANYONE first. I recommend pursing a TRADE where you use your brain as well as your hands. What a great idea, huh?

A tradesperson learns to fix things, not just related to their trade. They learn to communicate, they learn social skills, they learn to budget, they learn to logistically think about things, they learn to build, they learn to deal with problems.

Sounds like a well-rounded individual, huh? I remember that phrase being used as the best reason to send a kid to college years ago, like it was the only place someone could become this epitome of a productive citizen.

I see very, very low percentages of students come out of college being PRODUCTIVE citizens. I see a lot of social ineptness, a lot of confused individuals, a lot of misguided people, a lot of activists who have no desire to pursue income, housing or family, a see a lot of very bad financial decisions made and these people aren't 30 years old yet.

Don't talk to me about straddling kids with debt they can't recover from. There's ONE way to cure that and I can cure it within 6 months, I guarantee you. How? Get 50% of the kids to stay out of college for ONE SEMESTER. The entire college system across the United States will crumble into the shame it really is.

Housing around colleges - either pricing will drop 50%, the owners of the elite, luxury apartments will go bankrupt or worse.

Dead weight at colleges - yeah, all the non-applicable Professors of Sociology, gender studies, proper decision making for HR, etc. - gone. Half of the staff shouldn't be there, who cares.

Book publishers - ha. Karma will come to roost.

All the fees, fees and fees. Gone.

SODEXO - oh boy, this is the big'un. Hope the bankruptcy attorney doesn't hit ya too hard.


You want to know why college is soooo expensive? All that crap.

 

[Astro14]

Not my problem, but I'm sure I will be made to care. I don't recommend college to ANYONE first. I recommend pursing a TRADE where you use your brain as well as your hands. What a great idea, huh?

A tradesperson learns to fix things, not just related to their trade. They learn to communicate, they learn social skills, they learn to budget, they learn to logistically think about things, they learn to build, they learn to deal with problems.

Sounds like a well-rounded individual, huh? I remember that phrase being used as the best reason to send a kid to college years ago, like it was the only place someone could become this epitome of a productive citizen.

I see very, very low percentages of students come out of college being PRODUCTIVE citizens. I see a lot of social ineptness, a lot of confused individuals, a lot of misguided people, a lot of activists who have no desire to pursue income, housing or family, a see a lot of very bad financial decisions made and these people aren't 30 years old yet.

Don't talk to me about straddling kids with debt they can't recover from. There's ONE way to cure that and I can cure it within 6 months, I guarantee you. How? Get 50% of the kids to stay out of college for ONE SEMESTER. The entire college system across the United States will crumble into the shame it really is.

Housing around colleges - either pricing will drop 50%, the owners of the elite, luxury apartments will go bankrupt or worse.

Dead weight at colleges - yeah, all the non-applicable Professors of Sociology, gender studies, proper decision making for HR, etc. - gone. Half of the staff shouldn't be there, who cares.

Book publishers - ha. Karma will come to roost.

All the fees, fees and fees. Gone.

SODEXO - oh boy, this is the big'un. Hope the bankruptcy attorney doesn't hit ya too hard.


You want to know why college is soooo expensive? All that crap.

What about those kids for whom college is exactly what they need?

To further their education. To create opportunities. To open doors to worthwhile and important careers? To prepare them in highly technical fields?

It’s not all a scam.

Doctors, for example, have to learn a lot, and critical building blocks of that career require a college education.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Debt scares the H-E-Double Toothpicks outta me.
Education is key; I have been a proponent of grade school and high school personal finance forever. Give kids a fighting chance.

I am also a proponent of tuition free Community College, something that is in the works around here. There are wonderful 2 year programs in Mechanics and other trades as well as 4 year transfer programs. The trades programs are always impacted and the grads are highly sought after. By the way, I understand the trades degrees include a class in finance... Laney College in Oakland is pioneering this right now!

Would you rather have a group that is in dire straits financially (and emotionally due to financial problems) or one that can prosper and pass it on? It's called investment in the future.

 

[Pew]

Basic car knowledge is free and widely available. Public transit is better than it’s ever been. It still may require a wee bit of walking or waiting but that’s not torturous is it? Dreaming up excuses for everything is 75 percent of the problem.

We just went through this on the other thread. In the USA, public transportation outside of major metro areas like NY, DC, LA, and Chicago is extremely unreliable or plain nonexistent. Even in these major metro areas, after a certain time the buses and trains run less, stop running, or is too dangerous to be on. I know I wouldn't want to wait at 99% of the bus stops here in Chicago when it gets dark.

Making excuses for not saving and living within one's means, is arguably worse than this made up ageist nearly racist phrase.

You like to complain about the younger generations but you want to call that a "nearly racist phrase"?

Not my problem, but I'm sure I will be made to care. I don't recommend college to ANYONE first. I recommend pursing a TRADE where you use your brain as well as your hands. What a great idea, huh?

A tradesperson learns to fix things, not just related to their trade. They learn to communicate, they learn social skills, they learn to budget, they learn to logistically think about things, they learn to build, they learn to deal with problems.

Sounds like a well-rounded individual, huh? I remember that phrase being used as the best reason to send a kid to college years ago, like it was the only place someone could become this epitome of a productive citizen.

I see very, very low percentages of students come out of college being PRODUCTIVE citizens. I see a lot of social ineptness, a lot of confused individuals, a lot of misguided people, a lot of activists who have no desire to pursue income, housing or family, a see a lot of very bad financial decisions made and these people aren't 30 years old yet.

Medical advances weren't done by tradesman. Neither were technological advancements. The device you're typing your complaint on isn't made by a tradesman. Your vehicle wasn't designed or developed by a tradesman. Most of them can't keep a clean appearance, smoke and/or drink like there's no tomorrow.

Most of them like to talk down to people too, exactly like what you do all the time on this forum.

 

[Pablo]

Debt scares the H-E-Double Toothpicks outta me.
Education is key; I have been a proponent of grade school and high school personal finance forever. Give kids a fighting chance.

I am also a proponent of tuition free Community College, something that is in the works around here. There are wonderful 2 year programs in Mechanics and other trades as well as 4 year transfer programs. The trades programs are always impacted and the grads are highly sought after. By the way, I understand the trades degrees include a class in finance... Laney College in Oakland is pioneering this right now!

Would you rather have a group that is in dire straits financially (and emotionally due to financial problems) or one that can prosper and pass it on? It's called investment in the future.

Well except colleges and really all schools teach success and even fundamentals are evil. They teach capitalism is death and even mathematics are racist. People are sick of their money going to this garbage.

 

[Warlord]

Completely agree that financial literacy should be taught in school.

It shocks me how many people are financially illiterate. This whole thread is about the financially illiterate.

If you grow up with financially illiterate parents, how do you learn?

How do you break the cycle?

You can learn by reading books. My parents were great people but not good with money. I had no clue how money worked and made some stupid choices early until one day I decided to learn and took out a few books at the library that changed my entire outlook on finance. “Rich Dad, Poor Dad”, “The Wealthy Barber”, and “The Richest Man In Babylon” we’re the ones that got me thinking differently than the rest of my heavily indebted peers. Finances became fascinating and fun rather than something to stress about. I’ve probably read a hundred or more finance books now but I think most people could be set straight just by reading one or two of the classics.

 

[Pablo]

You like to complain about the younger generations but you want to call that a "nearly racist phrased “?

I was not complaining about the younger generation. When was that?

And yes it is more than implied in that phrase

 

[KrisZ]

Well except colleges and really all schools teach success and even fundamentals are evil. They teach capitalism is death and even mathematics are racist. People are sick of their money going to this garbage.

Yup, it all would’ve been fine if they weren’t also teaching our youth all that marxist garbage on the side.

What’s ironic is that the schools themselves are a prime example of capitalism at work. But they teach their students the evils of capitalism.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Well except colleges and really all schools teach success and even fundamentals are evil. They teach capitalism is death and even mathematics are racist. People are sick of their money going to this garbage.

What? I majored in Management of High Tech Business at San Jose State, minored in Economics and Computer Science.
You understand I live in the most Economically prosperous and progressive place in the world. We are the very definition of Capitalism and practice the result of Capitalism; it has raised more people out of poverty than any other system.
SJS (and the local Community Colleges) has fueled the Valley. Throw in Stanford, Santa Clara and Berkeley Schools of Business...

 

[supton]

Not my problem, but I'm sure I will be made to care. I don't recommend college to ANYONE first. I recommend pursing a TRADE where you use your brain as well as your hands. What a great idea, huh?

Honest question: my son will be in a power scooter in a few years--he can barely make it up a flight of stairs right now. Muscular dystrophy sucks.

What trade would recommend for someone who will forever have a problem lifting their hands above their head, never mind getting up off the floor?

 

[Pablo]

What? I majored in Management of High Tech Business at San Jose State, minored in Economics and Computer Science.
You understand I live in the most Economically prosperous and progressive place in the world. We are the very definition of Capitalism and practice the result of Capitalism; it has raised more people out of poverty than any other system.
SJS (and the local Community Colleges) has fueled the Valley. Throw in Stanford, Santa Clara and Berkeley Schools of Business...

You don’t know Seattle and you don’t know what is now taught in schools.

SVIB prime example

 

[Warlord]

Come on this isn’t a thread to pit blue collar people against white collar people. It’s about poor financial decisions which people of all collars make with concerning regularity.