$1,300+ monthly payment????!!!!!!

[Pew]

The guy asked Ken and Karen OP to stick his nose in it.

It wasn't an explicit post against the OP, but rather towards others who can't believe the payment and don't know the financials of the OP's coworker.

You two have terrible memories or are too young to have fully experienced "too big to fail" and bailouts of the century.

The biggest recessions in my time were the Dot com bust and 2009 sub prime lending with AIG and bailouts of several American auto manufacturers. I remember them both pretty well for family reasons. Neither recessions were tied to vehicle finances though and in the OP's case, he could have several million saved in the bank, no house payment, kids moved out, and can easily afford a $1800 on a truck he wants. Or he could have all the above and can barely make the payment leaving him with no spare cash (which would be the bad situation.)

Yeah but the average age of the senate is 63.9 years old and the house is 57.5… most of which are completely out of touch with reality for most Americans.

Watching parts of Congress vs Zuckerberg/FB was extremely cringe worthy with how Congress was trying to use/misuse basic computer and tech terms that an 8 year old would know.

 

[Corollaman]

When we financed cars the magic number was "keep it under $300 a month", I guess that shows how old I am. We had one vehicle that ended up being $299 a month, I just put more down. The majority of car buyers pay their car payments on time. Now I ask what's the price? Not how much down and how much a month and that's a good feeling.

 

[wpod]

i will admit that I know people that can buy almost anything they fancy and unless it is a business write off they can write the check and not fret about the spending the $$$$

 

[wpod]

It wasn't an explicit post against the OP, but rather towards others who can't believe the payment and don't know the financials of the OP's coworker.


The biggest recessions in my time were the Dot com bust and 2009 sub prime lending with AIG and bailouts of several American auto manufacturers. I remember them both pretty well for family reasons. Neither recessions were tied to vehicle finances though and in the OP's case, he could have several million saved in the bank, no house payment, kids moved out, and can easily afford a $1800 on a truck he wants. Or he could have all the above and can barely make the payment leaving him with no spare cash (which would be the bad situation.)


Watching parts of Congress vs Zuckerberg/FB was extremely cringe worthy with how Congress was trying to use/misuse basic computer and tech terms that an 8 year old would know.

But Zuckerberg probably owns the politicians. We pretty much reelect the incumbents for life.

 

[350Rocket]

Today I am having a conversation with a guy at work and he said... "I need you to pull me back to reality." I asked... whatsup.

He said he is about to purchase a 2021 Ford F250 Power Stroke Diesel 4x4, but the kicker is..... $69,990 price tag for a two year old pickup with 31k miles on it.

It'll be financed for 84 months. There is $5,600 in sales tax. and over the life of the loan, at 7%, he will pay over $11,000 in interest. They will pay him $26,000 for his trade in. Total cost is over $86k. $727.00 monthly payments for 7 years..... Maintenance, Annual Registration and Insurance are on top of all this.


I told this story to my little brother and he said.... "That's nothing..... I have a friend that just purchased a 2023 GMC Denali 3500.... no trade in... only $3000 down payment and the $8,000 sales tax and the vehicle cost was $97,000. Payment is over $1,300 a month for 8 years.

In 2014 I paid $37k for my Ram1500 EcoDiesel. Today it is running perfectly and has 140,000 miles on it. I plan to keep it 10 more years, minimum.


Can I ask.... what are people thinking? I understand the painful decision if you need a certain Pickup for your work/business needs, but to pay $750-$1,300 a month for 7-8 years is just nuts to me for your personal vehicle. My youngest son is the Business Mgr at a VW dealership and he tells me all the time..... "Dad, people don't look at or care about the financial specifics.... They just want to know that their payment will fit their monthly budget."

#PoundingMyHeadAgainstBricks.....


........

I just priced the most bare bones new f150 XL regular cab 4x4 with only the minimum features I really need for work and it was $60,000 Canadian. Since I really can't downgrade to a regular cab I priced it with a super cap and it was $70,000 Canadian. Currently driving a 2005 Silverado extended cab 4x4 well equipped (for 2005) that was $27,000 new. It's got 240k miles, 10,500 hours and I have to use it for work every day. It seems to just keep going without major issues other than fighting off minor rust but I can't help but worry about how long before I wear it out completely. It was abused by previous employees who drove it (i bought it from the owner) and it's been carrying near max payload since before 120k miles.
Oh and my mileage payments are usually between $600-800 a month.

 

[billt460]

I have a friend that just purchased a 2023 GMC Denali 3500.... no trade in... only $3000 down payment and the $8,000 sales tax and the vehicle cost was $97,000. Payment is over $1,300 a month for 8 years.

$1,300 X 12 months = $15,600.00 a year..... $15,600.00 X 8 years = $124,800.00 - $97,000.00 purchase price = $27,800.00 in interest alone.

And you can bet this guy is saddled with a ton of other debt as well. He's nuts.

And then people are astounded when they read that over half the population cannot come up with $500 cash to cover an emergency expenditure. When this economy finally goes, it's going to make 1929 look like a Sunday school picnic.

And just to keep things in perspective. You used to have to put at least 20% down on new vehicles....... With a bare minimum of other debt. 20% down on that truck would amount to $19,400.00. Insane.

 

[AmBeRnEcTaR]

You should see the idiocy here in the suburbs of Vancouver.
Asinine...

 

[daves66nova]

my daily driver is an '87 Toyota pickup,22R.

 

[350Rocket]

my daily driver is an '87 Toyota pickup,22R.

I'd love to have that as a backup truck, and to take to jobs where I need to squeeze down ATV trails or drive through fields on bigger surveying jobs. I've taken the Silverado places most guys wouldn't but now the roof is all scratched up and if I get it stuck in a field, it weighs 6400 lbs loaded.
Unfortunately rust has taken most of those trucks and what's left are considered collector items.

 

[supton]

I'd love to have that as a backup truck, and to take to jobs where I need to squeeze down ATV trails or drive through fields on bigger surveying jobs. I've taken the Silverado places most guys wouldn't but now the roof is all scratched up and if I get it stuck in a field, it weighs 6400 lbs loaded.
Unfortunately rust has taken most of those trucks and what's left are considered collector items.

I took a quick look but it’s over my head, just what FMVSS requirements are. I know IIHS and NHTSA test vehicles, and rate them, but I don’t think it’s federally mandated that all cars are 2 star rated or better? but auto makers compete with each other to best one another in the categories. Which leads to the problem of, it’s pretty hard to bring back small trucks, even the small ones today seem pretty bloated. And of course… market demand seems to show little demand, BITOG members notwithstanding.

But if vehicle prices don’t come down, or pay go up, I wonder if there might not be some competition in the 1 star class again. Hard to say, and I suspect many of the bells and whistles actually don’t cost that much to add, especially not when they’re already designed and used in so many places (what would it cost to design a crank window, and install it in 0.5% of your vehicles, since almost everyone is going to pick the upper trim level anyhow?).

Just what could be tomorrow’s loss leader? A 2WD 2 door RCSB pickup, with power windows and locks, but no a/c, an FM only stereo (because of the mandated backup camera), rubber floor mat… just a stab at things “cheap” to remove/replace/leave off. I’m not sure if they could leave off power assisted brakes and steering, cheaper (for them) to keep power locks and windows (I could be wrong, maybe you can still get trucks w/o that?). Stuck with ABS, VSC, airbags, crumple zones.

How are Maverick sales doing? I wonder if, if they are doing ok, if we might not see a FWD 2 door “pickup” before long. They’ve come and gone in the past, but while such a thing won’t meet many needs, I wonder if demand might not grow before long. I’m guessing not, 4 door vehicles are just too useful to too many.

 

[350Rocket]

I took a quick look but it’s over my head, just what FMVSS requirements are. I know IIHS and NHTSA test vehicles, and rate them, but I don’t think it’s federally mandated that all cars are 2 star rated or better? but auto makers compete with each other to best one another in the categories. Which leads to the problem of, it’s pretty hard to bring back small trucks, even the small ones today seem pretty bloated. And of course… market demand seems to show little demand, BITOG members notwithstanding.

But if vehicle prices don’t come down, or pay go up, I wonder if there might not be some competition in the 1 star class again. Hard to say, and I suspect many of the bells and whistles actually don’t cost that much to add, especially not when they’re already designed and used in so many places (what would it cost to design a crank window, and install it in 0.5% of your vehicles, since almost everyone is going to pick the upper trim level anyhow?).

Just what could be tomorrow’s loss leader? A 2WD 2 door RCSB pickup, with power windows and locks, but no a/c, an FM only stereo (because of the mandated backup camera), rubber floor mat… just a stab at things “cheap” to remove/replace/leave off. I’m not sure if they could leave off power assisted brakes and steering, cheaper (for them) to keep power locks and windows (I could be wrong, maybe you can still get trucks w/o that?). Stuck with ABS, VSC, airbags, crumple zones.

How are Maverick sales doing? I wonder if, if they are doing ok, if we might not see a FWD 2 door “pickup” before long. They’ve come and gone in the past, but while such a thing won’t meet many needs, I wonder if demand might not grow before long. I’m guessing not, 4 door vehicles are just too useful to too many.

I just did a "build and price" on a new f150. Just like last time, even though I tried to get the most basic work truck other than being 4 door and 4x4 (I'm sick of wind noise from extended cab - my doors open over and over all day long for work...in and out of the truck 20+ times) but I go to add something very basic, like a $250 option...but they force you to add a $2500-5500 package to get it. Really ticks me off. Last time I did this I tried a Tundra and it let me buy individual options without forcing expensive packages...this morning.... Toyota also forces the extra packages.
They try to give the impression of options but if you want the option you have to upgrade the truck. It's not really a pick what you want deal.
It actually makes me angry enough that I would possibly put $20,000 into rebuilding my 2005 Silverado just in order to not feed the new truck market or even the value of trade ins.

But I guess they don't care about us middle class because all the rich lawyers and managers etc will keep buying overpriced new trucks they don't need....or people I see on construction sites buying new trucks likely going to get repoed eventually or these people will just never get to move out of their parents house or buy a house.

It's frustrating.

 

[0W-16]

Can I ask.... what are people thinking? I understand the painful decision if you need a certain Pickup for your work/business needs, but to pay $750-$1,300 a month for 7-8 years is just nuts to me for your personal vehicle.

#PoundingMyHeadAgainstBricks.....


........

Some people make more money than you and can afford nice vehicles without hampering their budget. Stop being jealous and get a higher paying job.

 

[SaberOne]

I remember back in 1984 when I was paying $400 a month, and I felt that I was way overextended. Now that the new standard has been set, banks don’t think twice about granting loans with enormous car payments. There’s no way I could afford a car payment that’s higher than my mortgage payment.

 

[billt460]

....... Now that the new standard has been set, banks don’t think twice about granting loans with enormous car payments.

They're being foolish. The problem with such low down payments, and such insanely high purchase prices, is it doesn't take much before the loan is underwater due to depreciation.

This has all gotten much worse, as banks got away from the standard of 20% down on new vehicles and home mortgages. And vehicle prices have soared through the stratosphere. This is greatly adding to the instability of a lot of these banks.

They've got tens of millions out, in what are basically unsecured car loans. Then people start tanking on payments, they come with the hook, and the car gets repossessed. Only the lender, (bank), finds they can't dump it for what is owed on it.

This is what started the whole 2008 housing collapse. Too much borrowed money. These ridiculously structured car loans are all but guaranteeing a repeat performance. Same tune. Different dance.

This can't continue without something going bang. As there is never a short supply of people willing to make foolish financial moves.

 

[odie]

I think close to $48,000 is the new national average for vehicle loans .

 

[wander2039]

We're still going back and forth on getting another RV.. That's what the payment would be if we go new. Not sure if spending that much over just a little bit of discomfort with our current. Now paying that just for a regular vehicle.. insanity! On our recent trip to Galveston and back so many lots are packed.. cars, truck, RV and boats. We've also thought about getting a Jeep for a toad but can't talk ourselves into paying a premium for one. Every lot we saw had Jeep stock galore and I bet I didn't see 20 Jeeps on the road in 1700 miles, garage queens? This came up on here once but makes me wonder how many vehicles never get sold.

 

[Warlord]

Earn interest. Don’t pay it.

 

[SubieRubyRoo]

Today I am having a conversation with a guy at work and he said... "I need you to pull me back to reality." I asked... whatsup.

He said he is about to purchase a 2021 Ford F250 Power Stroke Diesel 4x4, but the kicker is..... $69,990 price tag for a two year old pickup with 31k miles on it.

It'll be financed for 84 months. There is $5,600 in sales tax. and over the life of the loan, at 7%, he will pay over $11,000 in interest. They will pay him $26,000 for his trade in. Total cost is over $86k. $727.00 monthly payments for 7 years..... Maintenance, Annual Registration and Insurance are on top of all this.


I told this story to my little brother and he said.... "That's nothing..... I have a friend that just purchased a 2023 GMC Denali 3500.... no trade in... only $3000 down payment and the $8,000 sales tax and the vehicle cost was $97,000. Payment is over $1,300 a month for 8 years.

In 2014 I paid $37k for my Ram1500 EcoDiesel. Today it is running perfectly and has 140,000 miles on it. I plan to keep it 10 more years, minimum.


Can I ask.... what are people thinking? I understand the painful decision if you need a certain Pickup for your work/business needs, but to pay $750-$1,300 a month for 7-8 years is just nuts to me for your personal vehicle. My youngest son is the Business Mgr at a VW dealership and he tells me all the time..... "Dad, people don't look at or care about the financial specifics.... They just want to know that their payment will fit their monthly budget."

#PoundingMyHeadAgainstBricks.....


........

There’s no way this is sustainable. This is the housing bubble of the late 00’s. I wonder what % of vehicles over $600/mo get repo’d or traded in at a huge loss. I’m betting it’s probably 25% or greater. The worst part is, vehicles are ALWAYS going to depreciate, so whatever you were upside down and rolled into the next loan will hang over your head for a long time. Pay cash for cars wherever possible!

 

[PandaBear]

You know it is one thing they buy for that much, it is another if someone is willing to finance the loan, I mean even at 7% you are talking about quite a loss if the market crash.

Then you talk about gap insurance and all that, and we aren't even talking about fuel yet.

For 70k-100k, I'd rather buy some quality stocks and just sit on it for years and wait for it to give me either growth or dividend.

 

[PandaBear]

They're being foolish. The problem with such low down payments, and such insanely high purchase prices, is it doesn't take much before the loan is underwater due to depreciation.

This has all gotten much worse, as banks got away from the standard of 20% down on new vehicles and home mortgages. And vehicle prices have soared through the stratosphere. This is greatly adding to the instability of a lot of these banks.

They've got tens of millions out, in what are basically unsecured car loans. Then people start tanking on payments, they come with the hook, and the car gets repossessed. Only the lender, (bank), finds they can't dump it for what is owed on it.

This is what started the whole 2008 housing collapse. Too much borrowed money. These ridiculously structured car loans are all but guaranteeing a repeat performance. Same tune. Different dance.

This can't continue without something going bang. As there is never a short supply of people willing to make foolish financial moves.

They better pray the supply shortage won't be resolved for the entire loan term, or else either the bank or the insurance company (legit accident or fraud) will be eating it.

I'm more concerned what kind of investment "product" these loans and insurance policies are packed into and who are they selling to.