I drive some cars that require a 0w20 and a 5w20. I've put in everything from 10w40 to 0w20. 130k on one 90k on the other. Do I have anything scientific to provenit dosent much marret? Not really but you could say it's a long scientific experiment with the 2 cars in driving. I'll continue to buy and use good oil I find at a discount price and not worry much about grade. If they both last for 200k or more, I'll say I have enough proof for myself. I can see both cars lasting well over 200k with how clean I've kept them and how problem free they have been.
0/20 spec really?
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Originally Posted By: dblshock
is there a down side to a 5/30? I can't think of any other than efficiency.
Even with the "full synthetic" brands, you'll be buying an oil with more conventional oil and less synthetic than a 0w-20.
Originally Posted By: dblshock
lot of newer cars burning oil you'll have to admit.
That's Direct Injection, it doesn't wash off the intake valves, and sooner or later the accumulated carbon fouling interferes with operation. If this is your situation, you should be shopping by Noack, not viscosity.
is there a down side to a 5/30? I can't think of any other than efficiency.
Even with the "full synthetic" brands, you'll be buying an oil with more conventional oil and less synthetic than a 0w-20.
Originally Posted By: dblshock
lot of newer cars burning oil you'll have to admit.
That's Direct Injection, it doesn't wash off the intake valves, and sooner or later the accumulated carbon fouling interferes with operation. If this is your situation, you should be shopping by Noack, not viscosity.
Originally Posted By: Garak
But engines never have failed on thicker grades?
Not unless the oil pump stops working.
But engines never have failed on thicker grades?
Not unless the oil pump stops working.
Originally Posted By: HangFire
Originally Posted By: dblshock
is there a down side to a 5/30? I can't think of any other than efficiency.
Even with the "full synthetic" brands, you'll be buying an oil with more conventional oil and less synthetic than a 0w-20.
Originally Posted By: dblshock
lot of newer cars burning oil you'll have to admit.
That's Direct Injection, it doesn't wash off the intake valves, and sooner or later the accumulated carbon fouling interferes with operation. If this is your situation, you should be shopping by Noack, not viscosity.
re your first point, here's a Mobil synthetic blend guide...shows them to have about the same amount of synthetic in them.
Re the latter, then the 5W30 wins, wouldn't you say ?
Originally Posted By: dblshock
is there a down side to a 5/30? I can't think of any other than efficiency.
Even with the "full synthetic" brands, you'll be buying an oil with more conventional oil and less synthetic than a 0w-20.
Originally Posted By: dblshock
lot of newer cars burning oil you'll have to admit.
That's Direct Injection, it doesn't wash off the intake valves, and sooner or later the accumulated carbon fouling interferes with operation. If this is your situation, you should be shopping by Noack, not viscosity.
re your first point, here's a Mobil synthetic blend guide...shows them to have about the same amount of synthetic in them.
Re the latter, then the 5W30 wins, wouldn't you say ?
Originally Posted By: Shannow
re your first point, here's a Mobil synthetic blend guide...shows them to have about the same amount of synthetic in them.
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Re the latter, then the 5W30 wins, wouldn't you say ?
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
The NOACK, CCS, and TBN for 5W30 are all quite different from other analyses I have seens...here's an (unfortunately rather old) one from the PQIA for comparison.
http://www.pqiamerica.com/March2013PCMO/mobil1.htm
The KV@40C shown for 5W30 for the table in your post is so low that I think it must be a typo...the PQIA says 62.4, for example.
re your first point, here's a Mobil synthetic blend guide...shows them to have about the same amount of synthetic in them.
---
Re the latter, then the 5W30 wins, wouldn't you say ?
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
The NOACK, CCS, and TBN for 5W30 are all quite different from other analyses I have seens...here's an (unfortunately rather old) one from the PQIA for comparison.
http://www.pqiamerica.com/March2013PCMO/mobil1.htm
The KV@40C shown for 5W30 for the table in your post is so low that I think it must be a typo...the PQIA says 62.4, for example.
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Good point. That 5w30 is too good to be true.
Also, remember they are all PAO examples.
The 0w20 and 0w30 seem close to Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy specs.
Also, remember they are all PAO examples.
The 0w20 and 0w30 seem close to Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy specs.
Originally Posted By: CharlieBauer
Good point. That 5w30 is too good to be true.
Also, remember they are all PAO examples.
The 0w20 and 0w30 seem close to Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy specs.
I was wondering the the 5W30 shown might have been ESP, but the HTHS is too low for that.
The cold performance and NOACK were a good match for ESP, AFAIK...
Good point. That 5w30 is too good to be true.
Also, remember they are all PAO examples.
The 0w20 and 0w30 seem close to Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy specs.
I was wondering the the 5W30 shown might have been ESP, but the HTHS is too low for that.
The cold performance and NOACK were a good match for ESP, AFAIK...
Originally Posted By: dblshock
real cold starts (-20F and below) are a factor here 3.5 mo. a year, I'm o.k with 5w40 but that's my max here.
-20F starts in Wisconsin for 3.5 months? Well, there's a stretch.
real cold starts (-20F and below) are a factor here 3.5 mo. a year, I'm o.k with 5w40 but that's my max here.
-20F starts in Wisconsin for 3.5 months? Well, there's a stretch.
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
It's not an M1 recipe book, but a blending guide, so not sure how representative it is...but as others have said, it's all PAO, and that's not what M1 is anymore.
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
It's not an M1 recipe book, but a blending guide, so not sure how representative it is...but as others have said, it's all PAO, and that's not what M1 is anymore.
Originally Posted By: jongies3
Why void your warranty by running the wrong grade? It's your car, but if I was spending that kinda money on a new car I'd run what the manual says and only what the manual says until the warranty expired.
5W-20 and 0W-20 are the same at operating temperatures, and I've seen a ton of 5W-20 spec engines go well over 300k likely running off Jiffy Lube oil and filters the whole time.
Would it void the warranty? Who would prove the oil was the cause of the failure?
Why void your warranty by running the wrong grade? It's your car, but if I was spending that kinda money on a new car I'd run what the manual says and only what the manual says until the warranty expired.
5W-20 and 0W-20 are the same at operating temperatures, and I've seen a ton of 5W-20 spec engines go well over 300k likely running off Jiffy Lube oil and filters the whole time.
Would it void the warranty? Who would prove the oil was the cause of the failure?
Originally Posted By: CT8
Originally Posted By: dblshock
so the consensus is a 0/20 offers equal protection from wear as a 5/30?
No !
Certainly there is no consensus here on Bitog, but in the end our consensus is meaningless of course. No one on this board has either the resources or the data to mine such facts. Only the manufacturer would be able to come up with statistically meaningful numbers regarding the overall reliability of engines since the use of XW-20 oils.
People can come along and say whatever they feel like saying both pro and con, but without actual reliability data it's all conjecture.
Originally Posted By: dblshock
so the consensus is a 0/20 offers equal protection from wear as a 5/30?
No !
Certainly there is no consensus here on Bitog, but in the end our consensus is meaningless of course. No one on this board has either the resources or the data to mine such facts. Only the manufacturer would be able to come up with statistically meaningful numbers regarding the overall reliability of engines since the use of XW-20 oils.
People can come along and say whatever they feel like saying both pro and con, but without actual reliability data it's all conjecture.
Originally Posted By: Shannow
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
It's not an M1 recipe book, but a blending guide, so not sure how representative it is...but as others have said, it's all PAO, and that's not what M1 is anymore.
OK, I get it now. Thanks for the clarification.
Originally Posted By: Virtus_Probi
Shannow, do you know if the guide you posted is representative of the Mobil 1 oils sold in the US?
It's not an M1 recipe book, but a blending guide, so not sure how representative it is...but as others have said, it's all PAO, and that's not what M1 is anymore.
OK, I get it now. Thanks for the clarification.
Originally Posted By: CT8
Originally Posted By: jongies3
Why void your warranty by running the wrong grade? It's your car, but if I was spending that kinda money on a new car I'd run what the manual says and only what the manual says until the warranty expired.
5W-20 and 0W-20 are the same at operating temperatures, and I've seen a ton of 5W-20 spec engines go well over 300k likely running off Jiffy Lube oil and filters the whole time.
Would it void the warranty? Who would prove the oil was the cause of the failure?
So let's say the OP has an engine failure. And let's say Honda says (with or without foundation ) it's an oil-related failure caused by using the wrong viscosity or wrong spec. Now what? What experts does he have have to go up against Honda's? Especially experts that will say using a HDEO is just fine.
This whole scenario may be unlikely (engine failures are really rare, dealers may not be that curious, etc.) but it could be an expensive, time-consuming and maybe futile exercise to prove Honda wrong. Why take the chance?
And if the OP insists on a different viscosity at least go with something recommended by an oil manufacturer if not Honda; like Mobil 1 0w-30. That would at least give him a leg to stand on.
Originally Posted By: jongies3
Why void your warranty by running the wrong grade? It's your car, but if I was spending that kinda money on a new car I'd run what the manual says and only what the manual says until the warranty expired.
5W-20 and 0W-20 are the same at operating temperatures, and I've seen a ton of 5W-20 spec engines go well over 300k likely running off Jiffy Lube oil and filters the whole time.
Would it void the warranty? Who would prove the oil was the cause of the failure?
So let's say the OP has an engine failure. And let's say Honda says (with or without foundation ) it's an oil-related failure caused by using the wrong viscosity or wrong spec. Now what? What experts does he have have to go up against Honda's? Especially experts that will say using a HDEO is just fine.
This whole scenario may be unlikely (engine failures are really rare, dealers may not be that curious, etc.) but it could be an expensive, time-consuming and maybe futile exercise to prove Honda wrong. Why take the chance?
And if the OP insists on a different viscosity at least go with something recommended by an oil manufacturer if not Honda; like Mobil 1 0w-30. That would at least give him a leg to stand on.
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Originally Posted By: dblshock
I settled on standard Mobil 1 5w30 for winter and a used oil analysis.. then probably a 5w40 once the warmer weather rolls back in toward the end of April.
You have another PM.
I settled on standard Mobil 1 5w30 for winter and a used oil analysis.. then probably a 5w40 once the warmer weather rolls back in toward the end of April.
You have another PM.
Originally Posted By: Hounds
Originally Posted By: dblshock
I settled on standard Mobil 1 5w30 for winter and a used oil analysis.. then probably a 5w40 once the warmer weather rolls back in toward the end of April.
You have another PM.
so I bought the right HTO 5/30?
Originally Posted By: dblshock
I settled on standard Mobil 1 5w30 for winter and a used oil analysis.. then probably a 5w40 once the warmer weather rolls back in toward the end of April.
You have another PM.
so I bought the right HTO 5/30?
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