Originally Posted by burla
Not really baseless at all,
No, it's entirely baseless bovine excrement that you are eschewing because you have nothing better to do than troll BITOG.
Originally Posted by burla
Ravenol tells you with their oils that they are pao based,
Yes, Ravenol chooses to advertise that their oils are PAO-based
Originally Posted by burla
Redline tells you they are ester/pao based, even redline's second lineup states that they use pao base oil.
Where, on the Redline website, does it explicitly state they use PAO and esters?
From the High Performance line:
Originally Posted by Redline
Full-synthetic ester formula for passenger cars, light trucks, performance vehicles and marine applications
From the Professional series:
Originally Posted by Redline
FULL SYNTHETIC -- OEM-required Group III/Group IV PAO Base Stocks
In fact most of the lore surrounding Redline being "all esters" was hashed out, on this board, through MSDS sheets which showed that their top-tier product was majority PAO, not ester-based at all.
Oh, and the Professional 5w-30 is majority Group III. Check out the MSDS.
Originally Posted by burla
Now, I haven't seen Amsoil commit to those base oil likes ravenol and redline do,
Based on the Redline website, their verbiage is no more clear than AMSOIL's:
Originally Posted by AMSOIL
Signature Series Synthetic Motor Oil does not contain paraffins (wax) and stays fluid in temperatures of -58ºF and lower.
No paraffins = PAO based, as Group III still requires PPD's to prevent the formation of wax crystals.
Originally Posted by burla
and in fact the fact the hths drops suggests that under high heat the base oil doesn't hold up as well as group 4/5 oils.
You have no idea what you are talking about. I'd suggest starting with XOM's PAO base oil catalogue. Want to make a wild guess at what the HTHS is of PAO 4? What about PAO 6?
The HTHS isn't "dropping". These oils are being INTENTIONALLY blended with lighter bases to hit the GF-5 viscosity range. Look at this Ravenol product:
https://www.ravenol.de/en/products/usage/d/Product/show/p/ravenol-fes-sae-0w-30.html
It has an HTHS of 3.0cP!!! Does that mean it must be blended from bull urine and beaver vomit?
Oh wait, it says it's PAO-based, how is that possible when burla said that low HTHS means it's blended from junk?
Again, you'd have learned this already if you were more inclined to read and process rather than just troll and start fights.
Originally Posted by burla
What proof do you have that amsoil is like ravenol and redline and use pao as their base oil?
Well, aside from the no wax quote above, and the fact that their pour points are extremely low for the Signature Series line, which, while useless for cold temperature performance, does tell a story of base oil selection, we have this quote from Pablo, the resident AMSOIL rep:
Originally Posted by Pablo
They don't give Gary or me proprietary info.
The XL line is the only one that is Group III.
The other synthetic oils are various mixes of Group IV and V. In general the more expensive Amsoil oils contain more esters. And that's the main issue with esters, cost.
Unfortunately, like Redline has now chosen to do, AMSOIL's MSDS doesn't explicitly state what base is in it.
