Wrong oil grade

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Oops, you're right.

What does Fiat use 5W-40 in the regular 500 here? Is the Abarth available in the NA yet, what do they use here?
 
That's interesting. Its the first time I've heard of a European petrol engine specifying ACEA C3 oil. From a viscosity standpoint, the 10w60 will do for one oil change interval, but I would switch to the Selenia 10w50 for the next change out of respect for the low-SAPS requirement. Over the long run, it will build up fewer engine deposits.
 
Originally Posted By: Herc
Hi guys, i need your help. My car manual specifies using a 10w50 oil meeting the c3 specifications and suggests using the Selenia Abarth 10w50. I had my car serviced last week and the dealer used Shell Helix Racing 10w60. Can you help me decide if i should change the oil used to a more appropriate or just leave it as it is? Here are the specs?

Shell Helix Ultra Racing 10w60
API SM/CF
ACEA A3/B4
Ferrari, VW 505.00, MB 229.1, Fiat 9.55535 H3
Density: 0.850
KV@40: 151
KV@100: 22.8
VI: 181 (est)
Flash: 215C
Pour: -39C
TBN: ?
HTHS: 5.42
NOACK: ?
Cold crank: ?

Selenia Abarth 10w50
Density @15: 0.850
Viscosity@100: 17,5
VI: 170
Flash: 220C
Pour: -40C
TBN: 7.4



Does the Greek Shell website have a lubematch tool like they do on the UK site

If so use that, I had a look but my Greek is a little rusty

It will be okay for one change if it turns out to be incorrect but change it to the 10w-50 C3 as it will give better flow

On the UK lubematch tool there are a couple of 500 Abarth's the 2008 1.4 turbo lists 5w30 C3 (should be 5w-40 C3) but the 2009- (yours)it says refer to dealer implying that they don't recommend the Racing 10w-60 for it.
 
I feel like I'm in the twilight zone. I read BITOG's "Motor oil university" article. I thought I understood what Bob was explaining. I thought he said that engine oils are all way too thick for cold starting an engine - AT 75F IN FLORIDA. Now I'm trying to learn more and read comments like..."If it's always above 0 (and even if it's a bit below) I'd leave it."..."Going thicker (10w50-10w60) won`t hurt a thing. Now going thinner than spec is something I`d never do."..."The oil you have in now and the temps you will be operating in should not effect the performance or integrity of your emgine. Just keep it in."..."I'd be inclined to leave it assuming you wouldn't have many below freezing starts. "

I thought Bob recommended running the absolute thinnest grade oil you can find, that will provide 10psi per 1000RPM at full operating temps. He repeats over and over that 5W and 10W are all way too thick at balmy cold-start temps. Much less 0 degrees C.

I'm brand new here so I want to learn! Is Bob's University information all out-of-date now? Is there some new knowledge out there that completely reverses what he states over and over in his "university" articles?
 
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: cyclehead
I thought Bob recommended running the absolute thinnest grade oil you can find, that will provide 10psi per 1000RPM at full operating temps. He repeats over and over that 5W and 10W are all way too thick at balmy cold-start temps. Much less 0 degrees C.


You might be reading too much into it. Ideally, an lubricant would flow exactly the same at -40 as it would at operating temperatures. We all know, however, that isn't going to happen.

The point is that the thinnest 0w-20 is thicker even at 75 F than is a 20w-50 at operating temperatures. That's the point. The point is, in my opinion, designed to correct misconceptions like 0w30 being too thin where 10w30 is acceptable, and other things like that.

Ideally, an oil should be as thin as possible for cold starts and short tripping. Realistically, though, as long as one chooses a suitable oil for the expected temperatures, one should be okay. Also, some engines do have issues, big and small, with thinner oils. I wouldn't try to run the average BMW, Audi, or Benz on a high speed autobahn run with a 0w-20. It's probably too thin, and doesn't meet most specifications. Also, my old Audi 200 Turbo burned thinner oils, and by thinner, I mean anything in a 30 grade.

The issue is (and I'm guilty myself) not to obsess about temperature differences. Don't use 20w-50 when it's -40, but if it falls a hair below the 10w30 cutoff point on the oil chart, it's not the end of the world. A 0w30 or 5w30 will provide better cold start protection at all temperatures. In the grand scheme of things, what's it going to mean for the longevity of your engine? In non-extreme temperatures, probably not a lot.

In general, as CATERHAM has pointed out many times, to really know if you can successfully go to a thinner grade than recommended, you need to know your oil pressure and oil temperature.
 
Thanks Garak. I like the idea of reducing cold start engine wear, if I can do it without hurting something else. i can get oil temps from OBD screens, but
I would need to add an aftermarket oil pressure gauge to see pressures. I am thinking of temporarily installing a cheap mechanical gauge for that purpose. ($17). I generally keep my cars to high miles so I might actually realize some benefit down the road. Thinking of my Lexus V-8 and a Toyota 1.8litre.


Has anyone here added a gauge and done the checks on their car?
 
I suppose that's one reason a lot of German cars simply use 0w-40 all year. It's synthetic for extended drains, is reasonably thin on startup, and thick enough for their concern over high speed driving.

CATERHAM has undoubtedly done the oil temperature/pressure gauges. My Audi had them both from the factory. I may do it on the G down the road when warranty expires; the OBDII doesn't supply all I want. I'm certainly considering it for my old F-150, considering it never came with a lot of gauges in the first place and it's a fairly straightforward job.

Personally, I'm a believer in the 0w-xx grades. I've used them where appropriate. However, I don't much like the cost of synthetic for my OCIs (and even the Audi didn't require them), and I do have a heated garage. I'd rather have 5w30 or 10w30 at 10 C ambient temperatures than 0w30 and a -40 C start outside.
 
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