- Joined
- Nov 20, 2013
- Messages
- 1,137
Any issues going from a 225 to a 235? (P225-65-17 to P235-65-17?
Wider tires the good and the bad?
- Thread starter Corollaman
- Start date
- Status
The 235 is about 1.75% larger in rolling circumference, so there should be only a slight difference in acceleration or fuel consumption. As stated, the wider tire will not be as good in water or snow. Ed
i always like wider tires
I quit having a desire for wider tires long ago. I much prefer matching the rim width to the tire size for the ideal contact patch.
copy & paste
Rim Width Range
Because tires have flexible sidewalls, a single tire size will fit on a variety of rim widths. A tire's rim width range identifies the narrowest to the widest rim widths that the tire is designed to fit. The width of the rim will influence the width of the tire. A tire mounted on a narrow rim would be 'narrower' than if the same size tire was mounted on a wide rim.
Note: Because the overall diameter of a steel belted radial is determined by the steel belts, there is little, if any, change to the overall diameter of the tire due to differences in rim width.
The industry rule of thumb is that for every 1/2" change in rim width, the tire's section width will correspondingly change by approximately 2/10".
For example: a tire in the P205/60R15 size is measured on a 6.0" wide wheel and this size tire has an approved rim width range from 5.5" to 7.5" wide. The tire has a section width of 8.23" (209mm) when mounted on a 6.0" wide wheel. If that tire were mounted on all of the rims within its range, the tire's approximate section width would change as follows:
Difference From
Measuring Rim Rim Width Approximate Tire
Section Width
0.5" narrower 5.5" 8.03"
Measuring Rim 6.0" 8.23"
0.5" wider 6.5" 8.43"
1.0" wider 7.0" 8.63"
1.5" wider 7.5" 8.83"
copy & paste
Rim Width Range
Because tires have flexible sidewalls, a single tire size will fit on a variety of rim widths. A tire's rim width range identifies the narrowest to the widest rim widths that the tire is designed to fit. The width of the rim will influence the width of the tire. A tire mounted on a narrow rim would be 'narrower' than if the same size tire was mounted on a wide rim.
Note: Because the overall diameter of a steel belted radial is determined by the steel belts, there is little, if any, change to the overall diameter of the tire due to differences in rim width.
The industry rule of thumb is that for every 1/2" change in rim width, the tire's section width will correspondingly change by approximately 2/10".
For example: a tire in the P205/60R15 size is measured on a 6.0" wide wheel and this size tire has an approved rim width range from 5.5" to 7.5" wide. The tire has a section width of 8.23" (209mm) when mounted on a 6.0" wide wheel. If that tire were mounted on all of the rims within its range, the tire's approximate section width would change as follows:
Difference From
Measuring Rim Rim Width Approximate Tire
Section Width
0.5" narrower 5.5" 8.03"
Measuring Rim 6.0" 8.23"
0.5" wider 6.5" 8.43"
1.0" wider 7.0" 8.63"
1.5" wider 7.5" 8.83"
First, you need to find out what the width of the rim is. If you mount a tire on a rim that is too narrow, it will arch across the tread face resulting in a tendency to wander, be sensitive to cross winds, and wear in the center.
Even if the rim is OK, there may be rubbing against the suspension, the frame, and/or the body. Unless you have access to someone who has actually measured the clearance, you won't be able to tell unless you mount the tire and try it out. Don't forget that tires deflect A LOT and you need to account for that.
And lastly, most tire properties are more dependent on the make and model of tire than tire size. While directionally a wider tire will be better for dry traction, worse for hydroplaning resistance, worse for snow traction, about the same for ride and handling, these properties are only directional and you could experience something completely the opposite depending on what you exchanged.
Even if the rim is OK, there may be rubbing against the suspension, the frame, and/or the body. Unless you have access to someone who has actually measured the clearance, you won't be able to tell unless you mount the tire and try it out. Don't forget that tires deflect A LOT and you need to account for that.
And lastly, most tire properties are more dependent on the make and model of tire than tire size. While directionally a wider tire will be better for dry traction, worse for hydroplaning resistance, worse for snow traction, about the same for ride and handling, these properties are only directional and you could experience something completely the opposite depending on what you exchanged.
Originally Posted By: Jimzz
Same tires but wider usually equals...
PRO:
Better handling
Better Dry Traction
CON:
Worse in snow/rain
Lower gas mileage
In your case that is a small change so I doubt you will notice much difference.
In my experience, grip suffers on poor road surfaces with wider tyres (partly due to the shape of the contact patch, partly due to the higher weight), but this is a small difference.
Same tires but wider usually equals...
PRO:
Better handling
Better Dry Traction
CON:
Worse in snow/rain
Lower gas mileage
In your case that is a small change so I doubt you will notice much difference.
In my experience, grip suffers on poor road surfaces with wider tyres (partly due to the shape of the contact patch, partly due to the higher weight), but this is a small difference.
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
... If you mount a tire on a rim that is too narrow, it will arch across the tread face resulting in a tendency to wander, be sensitive to cross winds, and wear in the center....
I found myself in that situation for a while a couple of years ago after replacing OE rear tires on my Challenger with wider Nittos. I went from 235-65-18 to 255-50-18, or something like that. Anyway, the combination of wider tires on the pizza cutter rims left me with a car that was prone to unpredictable behaviors at hwy speeds.
It would take all my concentration and constant correction just to keep the car in one lane at 70 mph. I wouldn't even go out late at night for fear of being mistaken for a DWI and pulled over by the cops and subjected to all that goes with that scenario.
I never paid much attention to the tires' rim width specs prior to that, but you can bet your bottom dollar I make sure to abide by them nowadays!
... If you mount a tire on a rim that is too narrow, it will arch across the tread face resulting in a tendency to wander, be sensitive to cross winds, and wear in the center....
I found myself in that situation for a while a couple of years ago after replacing OE rear tires on my Challenger with wider Nittos. I went from 235-65-18 to 255-50-18, or something like that. Anyway, the combination of wider tires on the pizza cutter rims left me with a car that was prone to unpredictable behaviors at hwy speeds.
It would take all my concentration and constant correction just to keep the car in one lane at 70 mph. I wouldn't even go out late at night for fear of being mistaken for a DWI and pulled over by the cops and subjected to all that goes with that scenario.
I never paid much attention to the tires' rim width specs prior to that, but you can bet your bottom dollar I make sure to abide by them nowadays!
Con....spare tire won't fit in your standard wheel well...
No difference that u would be able to feel. Go with the better deal u can get
It is good for protecting rims from curb rash, or if you find a tire that isn't in your size.
Otherwise it doesn't do much.
Otherwise it doesn't do much.
Also if you are comparing different tire lines in different sizes, you might find the size up is really very close to the same as what you have now. Capri could tell us what the physical size range is for a nominal size, but I think its quite significant.
Also I would probably go down a profile size to a 235/60R17. You'll get a fractional gear reduction and maybe a little sharper handling.
Also I would probably go down a profile size to a 235/60R17. You'll get a fractional gear reduction and maybe a little sharper handling.
Tires vary significantly by mfgr. Sizes that fit in one brand may be "iffy in another.
IME a wider tire is only of benefit if the suspension is able to use it. A car with worn parts or economical design may not benefit at all...
IME a wider tire is only of benefit if the suspension is able to use it. A car with worn parts or economical design may not benefit at all...
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
..... Capri could tell us what the physical size range is for a nominal size, but I think its quite significant.......
Tire manufacturers are under no obligation to meet standard dimensions. In other words, there is no tolerance. It can be 2" wide or 20" wide.
HOWEVER, it really would be foolish for a tire manufacturer to deviated much from the standard dimensions - and most don't! My best guess is that the average tire is no more than 10 mm off the nominal value (widthwise)
Oh, and the nominal dimensions are NOT what you think they are. The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are 209 mm wide, 63.6 aspect ratio and 14.938" wheel diameter. Other sizes vary in different ways - and NONE are exactly as indicated.
And having said all that, every so often you will come across a tire NOT built within those usual dimensions - and usually to fit a particular vehicle's fenders.
Yup, it's a mess. But when we are dealing with people, things usually are!
..... Capri could tell us what the physical size range is for a nominal size, but I think its quite significant.......
Tire manufacturers are under no obligation to meet standard dimensions. In other words, there is no tolerance. It can be 2" wide or 20" wide.
HOWEVER, it really would be foolish for a tire manufacturer to deviated much from the standard dimensions - and most don't! My best guess is that the average tire is no more than 10 mm off the nominal value (widthwise)
Oh, and the nominal dimensions are NOT what you think they are. The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are 209 mm wide, 63.6 aspect ratio and 14.938" wheel diameter. Other sizes vary in different ways - and NONE are exactly as indicated.
And having said all that, every so often you will come across a tire NOT built within those usual dimensions - and usually to fit a particular vehicle's fenders.
Yup, it's a mess. But when we are dealing with people, things usually are!
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are ...
Are the nominal dimensions publicly available at no charge?
The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are ...
Are the nominal dimensions publicly available at no charge?
Originally Posted By: CapriRacer
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
..... Capri could tell us what the physical size range is for a nominal size, but I think its quite significant.......
Tire manufacturers are under no obligation to meet standard dimensions. In other words, there is no tolerance. It can be 2" wide or 20" wide.
HOWEVER, it really would be foolish for a tire manufacturer to deviated much from the standard dimensions - and most don't! My best guess is that the average tire is no more than 10 mm off the nominal value (widthwise)
Oh, and the nominal dimensions are NOT what you think they are. The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are 209 mm wide, 63.6 aspect ratio and 14.938" wheel diameter. Other sizes vary in different ways - and NONE are exactly as indicated.
And having said all that, every so often you will come across a tire NOT built within those usual dimensions - and usually to fit a particular vehicle's fenders.
Yup, it's a mess. But when we are dealing with people, things usually are!
Tires are a black art indeed! What really got me looking was comparing two different 185 width tires for my Neon. The one pair so much wider than the other that I could see it when they were on the car... Both were cheap brands so I wonder if the wider tire was sharing a carcass with the 195 version but with a narrower tread?
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
..... Capri could tell us what the physical size range is for a nominal size, but I think its quite significant.......
Tire manufacturers are under no obligation to meet standard dimensions. In other words, there is no tolerance. It can be 2" wide or 20" wide.
HOWEVER, it really would be foolish for a tire manufacturer to deviated much from the standard dimensions - and most don't! My best guess is that the average tire is no more than 10 mm off the nominal value (widthwise)
Oh, and the nominal dimensions are NOT what you think they are. The nominal dimensions of - say - a 205/65R15 are 209 mm wide, 63.6 aspect ratio and 14.938" wheel diameter. Other sizes vary in different ways - and NONE are exactly as indicated.
And having said all that, every so often you will come across a tire NOT built within those usual dimensions - and usually to fit a particular vehicle's fenders.
Yup, it's a mess. But when we are dealing with people, things usually are!
Tires are a black art indeed! What really got me looking was comparing two different 185 width tires for my Neon. The one pair so much wider than the other that I could see it when they were on the car... Both were cheap brands so I wonder if the wider tire was sharing a carcass with the 195 version but with a narrower tread?
Originally Posted By: IndyIan
Tires are a black art indeed! What really got me looking was comparing two different 185 width tires for my Neon. The one pair so much wider than the other that I could see it when they were on the car... Both were cheap brands so I wonder if the wider tire was sharing a carcass with the 195 version but with a narrower tread?
Unlikely, as 185mm refers to the section width (at the widest point of the tire), not tread width. Although I've seen 2 different sets of 255s (on 255/60 and one 255/40) sitting next to each other. The 255/40s had wider tread (by about 1.5 inches), but the 255/60s were wider overall by about a 1/2 inch.
Tires are a black art indeed! What really got me looking was comparing two different 185 width tires for my Neon. The one pair so much wider than the other that I could see it when they were on the car... Both were cheap brands so I wonder if the wider tire was sharing a carcass with the 195 version but with a narrower tread?
Unlikely, as 185mm refers to the section width (at the widest point of the tire), not tread width. Although I've seen 2 different sets of 255s (on 255/60 and one 255/40) sitting next to each other. The 255/40s had wider tread (by about 1.5 inches), but the 255/60s were wider overall by about a 1/2 inch.
- Status
