My wife's Audi A4 sees once a year changes of M1 0W-40. That turns out to be about 8k/yr. I change it due to her short trips and running up against that year mark. I was doing 10k changes on my old '86 Audi, but it burns a quart every 1500. So I decided to do 5k intervals with Pennzoil dino.
Why such short intervals on Synthetic
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I change my oil alot, because I try to change as much as my funds allow. Yea the oil may be able to handle higher mileage. But just because you can doesn't mean you should. Nor is there anything wrong with going the opposite. But just so I get more out of my engine.
I posted a similar thread awhile ago. Cary, I agree with you. I run synthetic oil in my LS1 for 10,000 miles with good result. However, now I am doing 5,000 mile interval because I am experimenting with various oils.
To me the central issue has always been inertia. The observable issue most often mentioned is cost. The truth is either oil conventional and or synthetic( GIVEN THE STANDARDS) will do wonderfully with oem manufacturer's recommendations and/or the 3,4,5,6,7.5 k intervals.
I personally use Mobil One products with 10,000 to more normal 15,000 and in one application 25,000 mile OCI's.
One application which indicates the conventional oils are getting better all the time is the 10,000 mile OCI recommendation by Honda (in my case Honda Civic) with CONVENTIONAL oil!!! Most folks look at this in disbelief, all the way to declaring someone doing this, certifiably nuts.
I personally use Mobil One products with 10,000 to more normal 15,000 and in one application 25,000 mile OCI's.
One application which indicates the conventional oils are getting better all the time is the 10,000 mile OCI recommendation by Honda (in my case Honda Civic) with CONVENTIONAL oil!!! Most folks look at this in disbelief, all the way to declaring someone doing this, certifiably nuts.
^ I told my dad about longer OCIs and just get a "oil is cheap, engines are expensive." answer back.
Like Ray said, Warranty is a big reason for many, it is for me. I do 7500 miles, and would love to do 10,000+ miles. UOA's show I can.
Why is waranty an issue? If you change the oil yourself, how is the dealership going to know how long it's been in there? If you are doing a reasonable OCI ,but beyond the recommendations, I don't see the problem.
I work at a GM dealership and we rarely have any oil-related problems, never any waranty related ones. Although we had a intrepid with a 2.7 V6 that had about 1f" of sludge build-up all over everything. But that's another story
I work at a GM dealership and we rarely have any oil-related problems, never any waranty related ones. Although we had a intrepid with a 2.7 V6 that had about 1f" of sludge build-up all over everything. But that's another story
I agree with the above 100% The dealer has know Idea what oil is in there and how many miles are on it. And really do you think the dealer is going to have the oil analized?? I was a ford tech for 5 years from 95-2000 and if a customer had a warranty problem and the engine was knocking we would just replace the motor to keep the customer happy and have there vehicle back on the road as soon as possible. Oil was not a concern.
As long as the correct weight and clasification is used a synthetic oil will very highly surpass anything the dealer puts in there.
Really what do you people think is realy going to happen??? I have never heard of and engine failing under warranty using a synthetic oil being in there for 10k as long as the level is good threw out the service of the oil nothing is going to happen to it.
I think another thing here is oil consuption threw out the service of the oil happens and people think it needs to be changed. This is not the case keep it at the full mark and the oil level will stablize with time.
Alot of people dont check there levels and I think is the main reason why people change there oil so soon.(Its what uncle mechanic joe told us when we were young)
Us people on hear are all worry freaks about every thing and trust very little including myself.
You will see in the generations to come that the 3k oil change will faze itself out but may take our kids making this change when they start driving.
Your grand kids are the ones going to be brought up on changing it at may be 20k by that time but it will happen its just going to take some time.
As long as the correct weight and clasification is used a synthetic oil will very highly surpass anything the dealer puts in there.
Really what do you people think is realy going to happen??? I have never heard of and engine failing under warranty using a synthetic oil being in there for 10k as long as the level is good threw out the service of the oil nothing is going to happen to it.
I think another thing here is oil consuption threw out the service of the oil happens and people think it needs to be changed. This is not the case keep it at the full mark and the oil level will stablize with time.
Alot of people dont check there levels and I think is the main reason why people change there oil so soon.(Its what uncle mechanic joe told us when we were young)
Us people on hear are all worry freaks about every thing and trust very little including myself.
You will see in the generations to come that the 3k oil change will faze itself out but may take our kids making this change when they start driving.
Your grand kids are the ones going to be brought up on changing it at may be 20k by that time but it will happen its just going to take some time.
Laugh if you want, but there are three strong, valid reasons I use Mobil 1 on a 3k mi /5k km schedule:
1) city (i.e., "severe service") driving;
2) 1.8T (small sump, hot-running turbo);
3) VWoA (MUCH MUCH MUCH less customer-friendly than Ford or GM on warranty issues).
Visit PassatWorld.com, MyVWLemon.com, or VWVortex.com sometime to learn about the evils of oil sludge and coke.
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"Got sludge?"
1) city (i.e., "severe service") driving;
2) 1.8T (small sump, hot-running turbo);
3) VWoA (MUCH MUCH MUCH less customer-friendly than Ford or GM on warranty issues).
Visit PassatWorld.com, MyVWLemon.com, or VWVortex.com sometime to learn about the evils of oil sludge and coke.
___
"Got sludge?"
What you or I see may be irrelevant. Nor will I presume to vouch for any particular automaker's franchised dealership policies, but, the automakers, who ultimately are the grantors of warranties, are all within their rights to reject a warranty claim if you can't present evidence of adhering to recommended service intervals spelled out in your owner's manual. Presuming you, or an independent shop, do your oil changes, I imagine the first thing the dealer's service manager or the automaker's rep will want to see in the event of oil-related failure under warranty are receipts for adequate quantities of the correct viscosity range motor oil and service and your personal date log for timely oil service if you're a do-it-yourselfer. If you've had the dealer do the routine servicing, your particulars will already be on the automaker's national service database.
so guess the do-it-yourselfer is just screwed then.
As a former service manager, I can't remember a time that maintenance records were an issue unless the car was clearly abused when dealing with factory warranties. Aftermarket warranties were another matter. They often required maintenance records. If there was no strong evidence of abuse, a simple log kept by the owner was usually enough.
We often talk here about synthetics ability to handle longer oil changes, but when I look at the UOA's, I see very few people going over 5,000 mile intervals. I would say about 80% are less than 5,000 miles, and 90-95% are less than 7500 miles.
For those that are getting UOA's and finding low wear numbers and high remaining TBN, why are you not extending your interval?
For those that are getting UOA's and finding low wear numbers and high remaining TBN, why are you not extending your interval?
Breach of warranty concerns. This from my old Honda Accord owner's manual:
"Synthetic Oil
You may use a synthetic oil if it meets the same requirements given for conventional motor oil; energy conserving, a service classification of SL, and the proper weight as shown on the chart. When using a synthetic oil, you must follow the oil and and filter change intervals given in the maintenance schedule."
My Hyundai Sonata owner's manual doesn't even mention synthetic oil at all.
"Synthetic Oil
You may use a synthetic oil if it meets the same requirements given for conventional motor oil; energy conserving, a service classification of SL, and the proper weight as shown on the chart. When using a synthetic oil, you must follow the oil and and filter change intervals given in the maintenance schedule."
My Hyundai Sonata owner's manual doesn't even mention synthetic oil at all.
Would it not make sense then, if you wanted to do a 10K OCI to just go and buy a case of cheap SM oil and three cheap filters every ten thousand miles to go with the synthetic you really run for the 10 K? At least you'd have proof that you bought oil and filters..
Sorry guys, but the whole "dealership / warranty" argument makes no sense:
1. What if you are like the typical BITOG'er who stocks up on dozens of oil filters and a few dozen quarts of oil and then uses it to do DIY oil changes over the course of a few years? How would you prove regular oil changes were done when the receipts wouldn't correspond to the oil change dates? The dealership cannot deny warranty coverage to such a person.
2. If you are concerned the dealer might do a UOA (extremely unlikely): as a BITOG'er, you are aware of optimal OCIs for your vehicle / oil. Therefore, you know the oil will test fine, so that should not be a problem.
3. If you are still concerned about (2), then if you have an engine problem for which you are trying to get warranty work done, just change the oil again before you go to the dealer.
If you really want to do 3k oil changes because you are of the old-school mindset, just admit it. All this dealership/denial-of-warranty-repair talk makes absolutely no sense.
1. What if you are like the typical BITOG'er who stocks up on dozens of oil filters and a few dozen quarts of oil and then uses it to do DIY oil changes over the course of a few years? How would you prove regular oil changes were done when the receipts wouldn't correspond to the oil change dates? The dealership cannot deny warranty coverage to such a person.
2. If you are concerned the dealer might do a UOA (extremely unlikely): as a BITOG'er, you are aware of optimal OCIs for your vehicle / oil. Therefore, you know the oil will test fine, so that should not be a problem.
3. If you are still concerned about (2), then if you have an engine problem for which you are trying to get warranty work done, just change the oil again before you go to the dealer.
If you really want to do 3k oil changes because you are of the old-school mindset, just admit it. All this dealership/denial-of-warranty-repair talk makes absolutely no sense.
A nice thing about Honda is that their owner link site has a "service records" feature where the "Do it yourselfer" can enter maintenance as it is done.
Granted, you'd have to stick to their recommended maint schedule, but they'd have a hard time busting you if you regularly entered your maintenance on their website.
Granted, you'd have to stick to their recommended maint schedule, but they'd have a hard time busting you if you regularly entered your maintenance on their website.
High performance street/strip beast use synthetics for the performance aspects more so that the extended drain properties....we dump tons of fuel in the oil during our "playtime"...thus many will change 8 quarts of Amsoil or Royal Purple after less than 5 miles....1/4 mile at a time
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