Why is e85 still for sale everywhere?

[Klutch9]

Who's buying it? Many stations around here (metro Detroit) still sell e85. But why? Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't even think many cars are compatible with it. Seems there was a push in the mid/late 2000's for e85 compliant vehicles, mostly by the American brands, but that has fallen away. It's not even cheaper to run, given how closely it's priced to 87. Are there that many guys with e85 tunes buying this stuff up?

 

[Capt W]

I admittedly don't know how far and wide flex-fuel vehicles spread, but almost every fifth-gen Grand Caravan and Town & Country from 2013-onwards was E85 compatible. That's an awful lot of minivans. I'm sure there are many more out there.

I used E85 a lot in my Town & Country when it made sense. On highway drives I took about a 15-20% mileage penalty versus unleaded. If the price delta was greater than that, I used it. Many times when visiting family in southeastern Wisconsin the E85 was over a buck less per gallon. No-brainer to use it. On the other hand, our local Valero here in South Texas sells E85 for 10 cents less than unleaded. I have no idea who would use it for almost the same money.

You pose an interesting question, though. How many new-ish cars are compatible?

 

[oldhp]

My 2019 Dodge Charger SXT 3.6 engine and my 2024 GMC Canyon 2.7 turbo both require 87 octane NO MORE than 15% ethanol.

 

[tnt_motorsports]

I filled up our 2014 T&C last time with E85. It was 60% cheaper than E88 (15% ethanol) and I don’t suspect I’ll lose 40% in my mileage.

FWIW I’m currently building a FFR cobra that I’m going to stuff a 427 SBF into with aftermarket EFI that I intend to run on E85.

 

[samven]

My 25 Mazda still says no more than 10% but a buddy has a 2014 Ford pickup with one of those green leaves on the tailgate that says E85 but he has never used it.

 

[fantastic]

Will E85 still be used with hybrid technology? That may tell us the overall trend direction.

 

[Rmay635703]

It’s good racing gas.

And in certain areas a lot cheaper on and off.

Lots of people “blend their own fuel” using it as well (I did for years to avoid the cost of premium fuel)

 

[earlyre]

Will E85 still be used with hybrid technology? That may tell us the overall trend direction.

what do you mean still.... as far as i know, no Hybrid is factory flex fuel compatible. mine says no more than E20... ( they're set up for max Fuel Econ. not just general tree hugging)
could I be wrong, and a few are, Of Course.

 

[clinebarger]

A lot of people with "Built-Boosted" vehicles run E85.....I'd say every fast turbo car in my area does (DFW). Interestingly....E85 is rarely ever 85% Ethanol, 40% to 60% is about average.

 

[earlyre]

A lot of people with "Built-Boosted" vehicles run E85.....I'd say every fast turbo car in my area does (DFW). Interestingly....E85 is rarely ever 85% Ethanol, 40% to 60% is about average.

If it's Truely 85% ethanol,( which it rarely is in the US) it's basically around 100-105 octane. you burn more( less energy dense), but it's far more knock resistant, and high/comp Boosted engines can make more power. in essence, it's Cheap race gas.

 

[scrllock]

Millions of factory flexfuel cars out there, Ford and GM are still selling multiple new models that can use it off the floor.

I regularly buy it in the summer and it's usually in the 75-80% range. There's a ton of political pressure from the big corn states to keep it going as a reason to purchase corn, and Michigan is home to a lot of corn farms AND HQs for the big 3.

It's also still very popular as a fuel in south america, Brazil is a huge market for it (sugarcane product instead of corn). At least some non-US based OEMs develop for that, it's why flex-fuel was so easy to add to my VW.

 

[y_p_w]

If it's Truely 85% ethanol,( which it rarely is in the US) it's basically around 100-105 octane. you burn more( less energy dense), but it's far more knock resistant, and high/comp Boosted engines can make more power. in essence, it's Cheap race gas.

There's far better efficiency relative to energy content because timing can be advanced a bunch. But it can be anywhere from 51-83% ethanol by volume. Lowest ethanol by volume will produce the highest fuel economy, but highest will generally produce higher performance. The range is supposedly 100-105 AKI.

The math on whether it's worth it changes a bunch depending on the cost of ethanol. I think the current spot price for ethanol is less than $1.75/gallon.

 

[fantastic]

what do you mean still.... as far as i know, no Hybrid is factory flex fuel compatible. mine says no more than E20... ( they're set up for max Fuel Econ. not just general tree hugging)
could I be wrong, and a few are, Of Course.

I have no idea which hybrids allow E-85 but thought posing the question would see where things might be headed. Maybe we'll get some more hybrid owners to chime in. Yours isn't which is good to note. My speculation is that there are few if any hybrids that take E85.

 

[ls1mike]

Caprice can run it. It really likes it but in Washington it is hard to find. The nearest station that has it by me is over 40 miles aways.

 

[Barkleymut]

Our 01 Town and Country was corn juice approved, but here in Virginia it was never available until after I sold it, now I see corn juice in quite a few stations...wish I could have at least tried it. Have actually had to tell my mom and sister to avoid any and all stations that sell that stuff because they will not understnd, see the lower price and just instinctively push the low price button.

 

[Rmay635703]

Our 01 Town and Country was corn juice approved, but here in Virginia it was never available until after I sold it, now I see corn juice in quite a few stations...wish I could have at least tried it. Have actually had to tell my mom and sister to avoid any and all stations that sell that stuff because they will not understnd, see the lower price and just instinctively push the low price button.

Most regular cars won’t skip a beat until you have over half a tank full.

My old Insight skipped bopped and booped down the road for 100,000 miles, half a tank of e85 and its was smooth

 

[crashz]

Very tough to find in the Northeast. I can only think of two pumps on the Mass Turnpike.

I liked running it on occasion as a clean out. It smells better when burnt as well

 

[Kalle.J]

In most of Europe every gas station that sells over X-amount has to have at least one bio-fuel available.

• HVO100 diesel, or some kind of mixed Bio-diesel
• E85
• CNG (less common)

Imagine you have some similar structure on incentive?

 

[Kalle.J]

I have no idea which hybrids allow E-85 but thought posing the question would see where things might be headed. Maybe we'll get some more hybrid owners to chime in. Yours isn't which is good to note. My speculation is that there are few if any hybrids that take E85.

Even less hybrid-diesels.
Would be no question if the could use HVO or quality biodiesel.
And they would always have turbo, win win.

 

[PandaBear]

Biggest problem with E85 if I understand it correctly is the fuel line compatibility to the corrosion of E85 vs E15 or lower.

If there is no deposit in the valve, manifold, etc the engine will handle it right. Most problems I heard about E85 is 1) it has less energy content than regular gas so it has to be cheap enough to justify, and 2) it causes extra intake valves deposits in some engine with direct injection and need expensive cleaning, 3) it corrode the fuel lines more than regular gas, 4) you can't find it easily outside of corn farming area, 5) it is about politics and people don't like corn, thinking that it is bad for the environment or it is a government subsidies, etc.