What impact should color have on ATF?

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Disclaimer: I don't know much/anything about automatic transmission fluid in automatic transmissions.

Question... how important is changing ATF on a vehicle if the ATF is still clear and bright red?
 
If you have driven the manufacturer's recommended service interval and it is still red, change it anyway. A lot of times, when it turns brown, its too late. Transmissions are expensive. ATF is not.
 
Originally Posted By: dsmith41
If you have driven the manufacturer's recommended service interval and it is still red, change it anyway. A lot of times, when it turns brown, its too late. Transmissions are expensive. ATF is not.


+1 Well said
thumbsup2.gif
 
I am amazed at how many people want to look at a fluid and discern it's condition.

You cannot accurately tell any lubricant's condition by appearance. You can guess, but you may be wrong.

Now if you TASTE it...
 
Originally Posted By: bmwtechguy
Is this is the chevy or the pontiac? Do you have some type of additional cooler on the truck?


It's a general question. My GTO is a manual transmission and I changed the fluid out at 19k. On my truck, the first transmission went 200,000 never having a fluid or filter change. Prior to it going out, the fluid still looked red and clear, didn't smell burned. First it lost 4th, then 3rd, then 2nd, over the course of a few hundred miles.

Right now the truck transmission has maybe 16,000 on it, I'm just looking ahead. 200,000 never touching it seems like a pretty good lifetime for a 4L60E transmission which is why I am just trying to figure this out.

There is no auxiliary cooler on the truck but right now I am in the process of installing a corvette servo and aux. trans. cooler. Just trying to look ahead.

Thanks so far.
 
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
I am amazed at how many people want to look at a fluid and discern it's condition.

You cannot accurately tell any lubricant's condition by appearance. You can guess, but you may be wrong.

Now if you TASTE it...


It's not that I "want" to per se, just that I've always been told that "contaminated" ATF became dark and smelled different. Just wondering, is all.
 
In general, if the trans is operating properly and fluid is kept cool and filtered well as in aux cooler and filtration, you can operate with the same fluid for a long, long time, especially a high quality modern synthetic fluid that will tend to shear less in service. I am headed for 200,000 miles on current fluid in a 4L60 transmission. I may change it then or just see how long the unit will last at that point. At 200k miles on the fluid, it will have 330,000 miles on the unit/vehicle. Fluid still looks and smells new at this time. The ATF is in better shape than the rest of the vehicle, which is getting somewhat tired.

Without additional cooling or filtration, I would definitely change average fluids by 50k miles or so, and with high quality synthetic fluids around 100k miles or sooner as a general guideline. Some transmissions are harder on fluid than others, and type of service can make a big difference as well, such as towing, mountains, and hot climates.

Once the fluid looks bad or smells, it was probably past the ideal time to change it. I have seen transmissions fail when the fluid still looked and smelled fine. This is usually due to some type of inherent weakness in a component that breaks and then causes a failure. Sometimes we do great maintenance and still have a unit go out due to a known weakness in design or materials. Then on the other hand some folks just get lucky, like yourself, doing zero maintenance and have it go 200k miles or longer. You never know, but at least we try to stack the cards in our favor by doing good maintenance and worthwhile upgrades, right?
 
I would never discount a fluids visual/physical condition. It is a valuable symptom. So is smell.

But is clean and bright ATF bad? Additives may be depleted, but you sure could not ask for a better visual.
 
Originally Posted By: mechtech2
But is clean and bright ATF bad? Additives may be depleted, but you sure could not ask for a better visual.


I guess that's my real question.

200,000 on a transmission seems like a good lifetime, but if I can get more life out of it by changing the fluid I'll do it. OTOH, a lot of people who do change the fluid and filters get far less than 200,000 and my hypothesis was that clean fluid was uncontaminated and thus clutches weren't slipping too badly, heat wasn't too bad, etc.

What are the additives in ATF that can be depleted, if the color shows that the fluid is uncontaminated with grit?
 
Most wear particles are not seen when the dipstick is pulled out. The particles are either too small or are sitting mostly on the bottom of the pan/magnet or larger, visual pieces stuck in the suction filter media.

One of the biggest degradation in the atf comes from shearing of the fluid to a lower viscosity, which allows for more wear and negative changes in shift feel. Over time the fluid eventually becomes oxidized and chemically degraded to where the friction characteristics of the fluid are way out of tolerance. Additives get used up, so to speak, and the fluid no longer does all its jobs as well, allowing for accelerated wear and erratic shifts.
 
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