What exactly is a "Living wage"?

Having a memory lapse, but read a book that stated the most influential job a person could ever get is their first job. For may, the first job sets the standards for that new worker--- for life.

Have a first job that has high standards and discipline, that young worker may have high standards and discipline in everything they do, for the rest of their life.
Work ethic is developed before that first job. It's the way someone is raised by their parents.

A teen ager who has spent their time on the sofa playing games, all I got to say is good luck with that individual.
 
Given how badly most people manage their finances, to a certain extent, it doesn’t matter how much they earn. They’re always going to be poor. A lot of people think if they could just earn x amount they won’t be poor anymore. False. They’ll just buy a fancier Dodge Charger at a 14% interest rate.

That being said, it’s true wages for unskilled labor have fallen relative to prices. This is largely the result of postwar American foreign policy: outsourcing cheap labor, enforcing global shipping right of way, and subsidizing the security of partner nations. The US purposefully created the conditions that led to the domestic decline of unskilled labor wages in order to bribe other nations into its sphere of influence.
 
Work ethic is developed before that first job. It's the way someone is raised by their parents.

A teen ager who has spent their time on the sofa playing games, all I got to say is good luck with that individual.

Yes, young adults should work a part time job so they understand the value of money and communicate with people of different races, religions , cultures, backgrounds, etc…

Not having any social skills and locked in room playing video games is very bad.

Japanese have young adults that are hermits and don’t leave their room.
 
Last edited:
A living wage is an agenda and nothing more.
A true living wage without outside interference is what you are worth to an employer and/or your ability to generate income in order to survive (sustain life) with shelter, clothes and food. It does not include internet service, cell phones, tv programming, air conditioning or dining out on any type of food. Just to name a few.
 
We’re having trouble finding young people to take service jobs in bars and restaurants. Many of them know it’s not enough to support themselves on their own so, they are living with their parents until they can get their act together ( or not).
 
In exchange for 40+ hours of their labor each week isn't exactly "entitled" or "undeserved".
I don't have the answers. I tend to treat my guys the best way I know how. I take them to lunch all the time, and pay exceptionally well, always paying more than the number of hours worked.

What about when compared to someone who is more qualified, faster or does a better job? Should a HS or College student in a "starter" job qualify for welfare, food stamps or a living wage? What about a guy who never leaves that "starter" job? Are they now entitled to a living wage?

As the boss, I have my own view, the amount of employee related issues can be flat out unreal. There are folks that accomplish nearly nothing, lie, cheat and steal, fail to show up, create division and strife among other employees, and loudly proclaim they deserve more. Nonsense. We had one bodybuilder guy who was pretty darn close to a fight! Who knows what his problem was. The reality is that it is up to you to ensure you have the best job you are qualified for.

It is NOT up to me, as an employer, to ensure you can cover your expenses.
 
Last edited:
In my post above, I hit on what people tend to miss. In the category of "living wage" employees, there is great unreliability and stability problems. They are often quite simply, not worth it. The reliable good workers nearly always move up or out to a better job.
 
A living wage is an agenda and nothing more.
A true living wage without outside interference is what you are worth to an employer and/or your ability to generate income in order to survive (sustain life) with shelter, clothes and food. It does not include internet service, cell phones, tv programming, air conditioning or dining out on any type of food. Just to name a few.
Internet access is essential in modern life of United States. I am glad the government see it that way now. It can break anyone free and let Us economy thrive. An inexpensive smart phone may cover this need however without access you languish .
 
Internet access is essential in modern life of United States. I am glad the government see it that way now. It can break anyone free and let Us economy thrive. An inexpensive smart phone may cover this need however without access you languish .
Tax dollars (payers) shouldn't be on the hook for somebody to have internet access....period.
 
Best book that covers this topic that I've read is Naomi Klein's No Logo. It's a little dated, but it's very good at describing the emergence of what she calls "McJobs" and the undermining of wages in the post war period.
 
Last edited:
That is a bit of a loaded question. Is it anyone’s fault?
Maybe 'fault' is a poor choice of wording but there are people whose actions or inactions give them a large degree of 'responsibility'...unfortunately they never seem to be held accountable.
 
In No Logo, Klein says the "living wage" logic starts to slip in the post-war period when women and then teenagers start to come into the workforce in large numbers. Their labor can be discounted, because it is presumed to be additional, extra or added to a husband's/father's wages. The construction of all sorts of part-time "McJobs" follows this logic until no one remembers why or how the junk jobs were rationalized in the first place.
 
Last edited:
That is a bit of a loaded question. Is it anyone’s fault?
In the macro economic level, I blame it on Nixon Shock. USD no longer equals to gold in value and now it follows British Pound in terms of buying power. When you have the equivalent to unlimited borrowing, government (aka voters) eventually will take that instead of higher tax or reduced government spending (social services, infrastructure).

The post WW2 economy boom is in theory unsustainable forever. The way we were able to finance our living standard as a whole means the cost of living will eventually tilt the balance to elsewhere until they caught up. US manufacturing becomes more expensive and manufacturing moves offshore, US services now can be offshored via internet and a lot of those works moved to India and Philippine, Japan becomes more expensive and their manufacturing moves to China, Malaysia, etc, China becomes more expensive and their manufacturing moves to Vietnam, etc. Eventually, you can't have uneven high standard of living between nations that can substitute each other forever. The only exception is if politics are screwed up (i.e. Communism imploding itself because of the lack of motivation, impossible cost of living makes certain services like McD jobs impossible in certain areas).

I think I mentioned a small cafe owner's opinion here before. He couldn't hire anyone who knows how to sweep the floor for $17/hr. To get someone who knows how to do a basic job he has to pay $21, and at that rate he basically will just shut the door when nobody works even if it is a good time to keep the cafe open (Sunday), as he need at least 2 people (himself and 1 employee) to run the cafe. Why can someone demand $21? Because those who would do it for $14 are moved out to places with 1/2 the cost of living and they are working their $14/hr job there already. They don't move there because of politics, they move there because it is too expensive, because other people making 200k-300k a year are pricing them out.
 
Maybe 'fault' is a poor choice of wording but there are people whose actions or inactions give them a large degree of 'responsibility'...unfortunately they never seem to be held accountable.
My point was - buying power will change over time. That is expected. A household earning $200K in 2005 will probably need to earn $300K today to have the same level of buying power. This is why career choices and purchasing habits are forced to evolve over time.
 
My point was - buying power will change over time. That is expected. A household earning $200K in 2005 will probably need to earn $300K today to have the same level of buying power. This is why career choices and purchasing habits are forced to evolve over time.
The inflation that has reared it's head in the last couple of years has basically hurt all Americans and yet we are not seeing any blame being assigned for it.....and there certainly is blame to go around for it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: hrv
We’re having trouble finding young people to take service jobs in bars and restaurants. Many of them know it’s not enough to support themselves on their own so, they are living with their parents until they can get their act together ( or not).

The number of “homes” with 4 or more similarly aged adults paying towards its rental/ownership has been going up for years. 3bed House across the street from my mom has 10 adults living there.

Our local Culver’s and A&W have hourds of 14 year olds working there all summer, need to be patient and check your “food” for errors. Some 14 year olds are decent , others are hard working and scatter brained.

Our local CVS is only 3 years old, looks like an outdated mess inside, kids stocking and register but the pharmacy area has 2 adults busy 24/7 running like chickens with heads cut off in off with the drive through, inside is all clearance with very few venturing inside, far spaced aisles and minimal stock.

The inflation that has reared it's head in the last couple of years has basically hurt all Americans and yet we are not seeing any blame being assigned for it.....and there certainly is blame to go around for it.

A few folks from the $5T 2020 blackwater and friends bailout boondoggle were fired.

Funny part is those complaining about it are the same folks who fully approved it with a smile back in 2020.

Nothing proposed by anyone will address the real source of this problem
 
Last edited:
The inflation that has reared it's head in the last couple of years has basically hurt all Americans and yet we are not seeing any blame being assigned for it.....and there certainly is blame to go around for it.
The easiest answer (blame) is Covid. If you read around, you'll see that American inflation has been lower than many places, Britain, for example.
 
The number of “homes” with 4 or more similarly aged adults paying towards its rental/ownership has been going up for years. 3bed House across the street from my mom has 10 adults living there.

Our local Culver’s and A&W have hourds of 14 year olds working there all summer, need to be patient and check your “food” for errors. Some 14 year olds are decent , others are hard working and scatter brained.

Our local CVS is only 3 years old, looks like an outdated mess inside, kids stocking and register but the pharmacy area has 2 adults busy 24/7 with the drive through, inside is all clearance with very few venturing inside, far spaced aisles and minimal stock.
I was at an IKEA the other day, and it became very clear to me that they are trying to move to a post-labor, or at least labor reducing, model where more and more of the work involving customers and their purchases are being put on the customers themselves.
To get an ice-cream cone, for example, you have to go to a kiosk, scroll though all sorts of menus, find your ice cream, pay for it and then walk to a counter where you are given your ice cream. The only way that you can go to the counter and say "I'd like a vanilla ice cream cone, please," and get one, is if you pay with cash.
 
Back
Top Bottom